Live Foods....

[Tommy Gunnz]

So besides the ethics involved in feeding saltwater fish live food (e.g. feeder guppies, rosy reds...), what are the major concerns?

The reason I ask is because I have decided to set up my salt water tank as a preditor tank with a porcupine puffer, a lion fish (p. volitans), and a snowflake moray eel. I realize that many people would think this is unethical, and I would normally tend to agree, but I am not doing it so that I can watch, but because having had livebearer tanks in the past (FW), I realize that I can reduce some of my costs by breeding my own food source. I also feel that the other options (e.g. frozen krill, silversides, lake eels) are not much more ethical since they were just killed by someone else. Understand what I mean? Please dont kill me on this issue

I also know from reading posts from others under all sorts of catagories that live food is bad because I could transfer disease and bad stuff from the feeder fish right into the belly of my saltwater fish. However, I honestly feel that I am experienced enough to breed my own feeding stock and in this way, can ensure with some certainty that the food is going to be safer than simply buying fish on a weekly basis from my LFS. I also feel that I will have the opportunity to 'gut pack' if needed or neccessary.

So, BEFORE I do this, I wanted to see what the rest of you may have to say about it. For the record, I really would like to hear every reason why NOT to do this as well as opinions in favor of this, so dont hold back (unless you are just trying to be mean to me! I really am a nice guy and just trying to think of the best for my fish.)

Thanks!

 

[Mr Miagi]

Putting ethics asside for the time being, feeding your preds live food has deffinate disadvantages.

-Cost: You will need to constantly buy fish/shrimp. Feeder fish are generally cheapish, but shrimp can become costly depending on availability.

-Diversity: If you buy a predator, and it refuses to eat anything frozen, your going to have difficulty assuring your tankmate has a more diverse diet, rather than guppies/mollies, which are FW, and hold really little nutritional value.

-Liver Problems: Its widely stated when feeding a Lionfish or any other SW predator on FW feeders like goldfish, guppies or mollies they can develope liver disfunctions/failure from fat deposits (not 100% sure on whether or not thats truth or myth).

-Availability: I know when I bought my Dwarf Lion, I found finding Shrimp easy. When nobody went out catching them anymore, I was stuck without them. Make sure several sources can supply you with your feeders before you buy a pred.

-Breeding your own: Even though you say you will breed your own, I think this just adds more to the pain of feeding live feeders. Take into account changing water now on both SW and FW fry tanks (probably more often on the FW fry tanks as more waste produced fromhigh feeding/waste production), having multiple grow out tanks, feeding the fry daily with a decent nutritional food (so that nutrition is eventually passed onto your preds), running electricity to those tanks etc etc. So now do your really want to breed your own? I dont know all the facts, but IMO the transfer of desease or infection from a FW fish to a SW tank would be pretty difficult. Best do some more reading.

IMO, ts just downright beneficial for you and your specimen to be weaned onto frozen food. Remeber, once on frozen food, they will still eat the occasional live treat if you wish to add them for it. For the ease of keeping your mate happy/healthy, try making sure they are feeding on frozen foods from the LFS before you buy it.

 

[Tommy Gunnz]

Thanks Mr. Miagi! I did not know about the liver problems that can arise due to feeding live fish and so that really turns me off to the idea. However, I really do think that I could most definately breed enough food, but that is now a mute point. Earlier today I got myself into a sticky predicament when I offered to take about 20 mollies, platties and non-fancy or feeder guppies because I over heard a guy at my LFS asking about humaine ways to essentially kill his fish so that he could get a cichlid tank going. I was pretty mad about it and so after a long discussion between three of the lfs employees, that guy and myself about why it isnt ok to pick certain cichlids just to have 'alot of color' in your tank, I followed him home and took the fish. This basically left me without a 'breeding tank' since I was really set on using a 10 gallon tank that I bought earlier in the day and now those fish are going in there in a couple of days. I am rushing like a mad man to get this new 10 gallon tank cycled by using every trick in the book.

So, anyways, I appreciate you letting me in on your opinion. I always like to ask around about my ideas or plans to see if anyone disagrees with my ideas or information. Usually I am right on the money, but every so often a person will bring up a point that I had no idea about before. Thanks again!

 

[Mr Miagi]

Thats cool man, always good to talk about stuff rather than harasing someone about how humane etc you think it might be. Even though I myself I have used feeders.... IMO its not that in-humane, but I know others opinions differ.

My LIon eventually died of starvation. He would not eat any prepared food. I tried cockle, prawn/shrimp, fish flesh, white bait, frozen bloodworm, brineshrimp, and blackworm. I also tried him on live blackworm, brineshrimp (didnt take enough of both) and the only thing he would take was baby mollies and shrimp, which I couldnt find around any store after the supplier stopped catching them.

He was doomed for a life of mollies anyway, but I did try very hard to ween him onto other foods, and because he didnt, he died. I was aware before I bought him that Dwarf Lions, especially wildcaught specimens are tough to get feeding on prepared foods (She told me he was eating frozen prawn, pfft. )

Generally eels like the Snowflake are pretty easy, but some are tough, like the Dwarf Lions. Im sure Andy knows more about this topic anyways, he will get here sometime soon!

 

[Mr.September15]

While on this topic, do large blue damsels eat feeder guppies? Or are they too big?

 

[Mr Miagi]

While on this topic, do large blue damsels eat feeder guppies? Or are they too big?

Why did you want to know? Unless the fish will not eat prepared foods, they should not be fed live feeders. Read the above posts. Blue Damsels are not finicky eaters, and will eat almost anything you put in the tank.

 

[Mr.September15]

Its for my own knowledge?

 

[SkiFletch]

Usually they wont eat feeder guppies before the feeders die from hyposalinity. Once the feeders are dead they may pick at them if they can reach them. Either way, not a good food for damselfish

 

[Mr.September15]

Do you guys know if clowns eat brine shrimp? Im wanting to buy some for my Nemo but since mines small im not sure if he would really eat it.