How to be a fish store detective

[GaryE]

Here are some tricks I've learned over the years, often from people who own or work in aquarium stores. I take the view that prevention is more important than knowing how to cure a sick fish.
But prevention is very inconvenient for many, so this is just thrown out there as possible best practices.

Find out when new fish are delivered. Most stores will tell you. Check the next day. If no tanks are quarantined, be skeptical. The good local stores would have a QT of at least 24 hours (not enough, but better than nothing) up to a week. The local chains sell the moment the fish tumble out of the bag, and that's the serious buyer beware zone.

Go as soon as they open. If the tank bottoms are littered with corpses.... many stores pay someone to come in early and remove the 'deads', but if they can't even be bothered to do that, run away.

Look at every fish in the tank. If it's a central system, look in all the connected tanks. Do you see any unhealthy fish? Any Ich? Never buy from a tank with any sign of disease, even in the species you aren't shopping for.

If you can, don't buy on the first visit. Give it a few days and do a second visit. That has saved me a few times, as fish that looked good had blossomed into awful diseases.

Never rescue fish you feel sorry for without preparing in advance. That sickly sad Betta could easily have fish tuberculosis, and should never be mixed with other fish. If you are into rescues (bad fish stores that mistreat fish will love your business) quarantine should be forever.

Look up common fish diseases and learn to recognize them. Choose your fish. No one chooses for you, and watch the catching process closely. Never buy an unfamiliar fish without pulling out your phone and googling it. It may be a youngster of a big nasty bruiser or a fish with needs you can't meet.

We're all supposed to quarantine, and maybe 1% of us actually do. So use your skills and try to avoid trouble.

 

[Back in the fold]

Excellent advice !

 

[emeraldking]

I always check how fish are behave, look like when visiting a fish store. Same goes for how te tanks look like from the inside and outside. The checking comes natural. I will say something about it when I see sick or dead fish to an employee.

 

[algeaverse]

thats some good advice, thanks for sharing

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I have been aware of GaryE's great advice for a long time. In my area most pet stores are not acceptable places to buy any fish. I do have one store where I can actually skip quarantine. The problem is their prices reflect this fact. To work there you have to pass a written test on fish species and their proper care. So the advice you get there is due to the prices they charge. On weekends they say the Mercedes and limos are triple parked. I have only gone weekday afternoons. It has likely been about 13 or 14 years since my last visit.

I have been buying fish for almost 24 years. I have likely bought at least 500 fish in that time. I estimate that the number I bought in a retail stores was about 30-35. Most were the ones that went into my first tank. Then I discovered online. My second tank was for growing out swordtail fry from my first tank.

After that I began to quarantine new fish. My worst case of ich came from store bought tetras and danios in a Q tank. I treated unsuccessfully and one live fish came out from the 18 I bought. The second case was from a purchase I made on Aquabid. That only cost me the new fish and one bn pleco. Soon after, I started to learn from whom to buy fish.

A lot of my new fish came from one of two sources. One was from breeders. The other was working with somebody with a home based import business. She had learned from which of the exporters to buy specific species. I had the benefit of her knowledge and experience. It was a great advantage.

Since about year 4 or 5 the major cause of my fish deaths was stupid mistakes on my part. The second most common cause has been from old age. The third most common cause was illness/infection I was unable to cure.

The one difference between what GaryE suggested and I do is because I do not own a smart phone. So I do it one of two ways. I research the fish before I go shopping for a specific species. If I was in a store and saw something I though I might like, I went home and went online to research it. What GaryE did not say and I would add is as important as going onto the net to research, knowing what site or sites to visit for good information is essential.

Bear in mind that there is likely more worthless info on the net the valuable information. It is your job to know the difference. If you are Googling for info on fish, I would suggest that the first few links that come up are likely ones to be avoided. I have been searching on Google for decades. The information coming back has gotten less and less relevant in that time.

And this brings me to a video I recently watched from Leandro Sousa:

ChatGPT KNOWS NOTHING about fish!​

If you are wondering who Leandro is: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=kOGcJDgAAAAJ&hl=pt-BR
I was fortunate to meet and talk with him at CatCon 2022. He is likely the world's greatest expert on zebra plecos as well as fish in general and especially from the Big Bend of the Rio Xingu from where all my breeding plecos originate.

 

[GaryE]

In my 60 tank fishroom, I have one tank of beckford's pencils from a store, and, umm, nothing else. My other fish come from breeders, or from wild imports.
But I, like @TwoTankAmin , am in a position of luxury, as I have built contacts over the years.

Newcomers to the hobby don't have those resources, so it's good to share experience sometimes. This is the new to the hobby section....

 

[Ceez]

Offshore tuna fishing has taught me a lot of things but one of the best things that have helped me catch more fish than anything else is to pick the best, hardest to catch sardine/anchovy.

In the past I have used that when picking fish from the pet store. I wouldn't say its sage advice or gospel but I think its helped picking the most active, hard to catch fish. Gary, I think you're probably right too about quarantine. Might even be less than 1%

 

[TwoTankAmin]

New to the hobby folks can find good sellers if they look. They can also find better stores. My best advice for new to the hobby folks looking for a store in which to buy fish is never choose a pet store, choose a fish store. Even if it means having to travel further, do it.

Now, a fish store may not always have the quality of fish one expects and the way to know that is to follow GaryE's advice. But the odds favor a fish store having healthier stock than a pet store. There fish are not close to the biggest part of their business and most times the employees know less about the fish than their customers.

When I got my first tank were had two pet stores with fish departments and a local fish store. The fish store went all salt water after about 18 months and both pet stores closed. There was another pet store about 25 miles away. They had a huge indoor concrete pond for fish rescues. They ultimately shut their fish department but kept that pond. It is a good customer drawing attraction.

Another way to get healthy fish at a good price and to learnm a tom of good info is to join a local fish club if there is one not too far away. Most clubs meet monthly and hold an aution at each meeting. In my club we get fish plants and other supplies. I have also bought fish directly from one of the members who is a master breeder. If it swims in FW, he likely has bred it. I have his Purple Emperor Tetras (Inpaichthys kerri). I also finally wanted bn again for my planted tanks. All 9 I got (including 3 super red, 6 albino) were bred by club members and cost me between $3 and $5 each. Very healthy fish and I confess that I did not Q any of them. I have had them for 1 to 4 months w/o an issues.

I can also tell you a lot of the fish I sell skip a stint in a Q tank at the buyer's end.

 

[Ceez]

New to the hobby folks can find good sellers if they look. They can also find better stores. My best advice for new to the hobby folks looking for a store in which to buy fish is never choose a pet store, choose a fish store. Even if it means having to travel further, do it.

Now, a fish store may not always have the quality of fish one expects and the way to know that is to follow GaryE's advice. But the odds favor a fish store having healthier stock than a pet store. There fish are not close to the biggest part of their business and most times the employees know less about the fish than their customers.

When I got my first tank were had two pet stores with fish departments and a local fish store. The fish store went all salt water after about 18 months and both pet stores closed. There was another pet store about 25 miles away. They had a huge indoor concrete pond for fish rescues. They ultimately shut their fish department but kept that pond. It is a good customer drawing attraction.

Another way to get healthy fish at a good price and to learnm a tom of good info is to join a local fish club if there is one not too far away. Most clubs meet monthly and hold an aution at each meeting. In my club we get fish plants and other supplies. I have also bought fish directly from one of the members who is a master breeder. If it swims in FW, he likely has bred it. I have his Purple Emperor Tetras (Inpaichthys kerri). I also finally wanted bn again for my planted tanks. All 9 I got (including 3 super red, 6 albino) were bred by club members and cost me between $3 and $5 each. Very healthy fish and I confess that I did not Q any of them. I have had them for 1 to 4 months w/o an issues.

I can also tell you a lot of the fish I sell skip a stint in a Q tank at the buyer's end.

I'd love to joina fish club but the nearest one is almost 1.5hrs away. Wish we had one more local to me.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

The master breeder I mentioned is an officer in my club and his drive is a bit more than 90 minutes. He always brings fish for the auction.

One of the other officers usually has 1 lb frozen slabs of brine shrimp, blood worms, mysis shrimp and occasional other items. The price is good. My drive is 25 to 30 minutes each way. I usually bring a couple of bags of assassin snails. We have a member who grows an insane volume of plants, he brings bags are bags that sell for a very cheap price. Sometimes he gives stuff away.

Were I younger I might have also joined a several other clubs that were anywhere up to an hour+ drive each way from me. But I am about 35 miles NE of NYC, so in a densely populated region. We actually have a Club of Clubs in the NE. https://northeastcouncil.org/

I am trying my best to suggest the drive will prove worth it over time. We have members who have been keeping fish for 30 or 40 years. And we have some who have recently started up. Clubs love new members and every one of us was new when we began. And the thing is, the people you meet and the speakers at the meetings can impart a lot of great information. It us relaible. More importantly, they can steer you to the best places to buy specific fish. And, you may get to buy a few at the meeting.

Think of it as paying for all this with a few hours of your time driving once a month. Also, clubs normally post their meeting agenda/speaker in advance and they all allow a potential new member to attend a firsy meeting without joining on order to check things out. So that few hour round trip the first time is for a free look. If you don't like what you see. That is the end of things.

I am posting this for any new fish keeper, or any one else reading this thread who keeps fish but is not yet a member in a local club. JOIN A CLUB!

@Ceez
I have a good fish buddy from CA. She contacted me about buying my fish and from there we became friends. She came east for the Keystone Clash and stayed here to help me prepare and then helped in my booth. She breeds the plecos she has gotten from me and has sold some of my fish as well as hers. She has a YouTube channel

I also have been exchanging PMs on another fish site for several years with another lady in CA who is a long term fish keeper and plant expert who was originally for the NE. She is adopting my 3 very old zebra plecos (no charge for the fish or shipping) so I can close down my zebra tank in the near future. She is being their retirement home.

They are both in clubs, and they live very far apart, I checked. One is in the south the other in the north. Something like a 7 hour drive each way.

Are you sure there is no other club nearer to you?
region California (southern) listings: https://fins.actwin.com/dir/clubs.php?c=1&r=65
region California (northern) listings: https://fins.actwin.com/dir/clubs.php?c=1&r=66

California​

[I deleted the SW clubs]
Bakersfield Koi & Water Garden Society
Bay Area Killifish Association
California Betta Society
California's Organization Aquatic Show Tropicals
Camellia Koi Club
Central California Koi Society
Davis Aquarium Society
Desert Fish Club
Fresno Koi Society
High Desert Koi Fanciers
Inland Koi Society
Koi Club of San Diego
Mendocino Coast Koi and Water Garden Society
Nishiki Koi Club
North Coast Water Garden Club
Pacific Coast Cichlid Association
Pan Pacific Guppy Association
Sacramento Aquarium Society
San Diego Killifish Group
San Diego Tropical Fish Society
San Francisco Aquarium Society
San Francisco Bay Area Aquatic Plant Society
San Francisco Bay Area Killifish Association
San Francisco Bay Area Koi Club
Santa Clara Valley Koi & Water Garden Club
Santa Clarita Koi
Shasta Koi & Water Garden Club
Silicon Valley Aquarium Society
Southern California Killi Club
Southern California Water Garden Society
Ventura County Koi Society
Yuba Sutter Reef Society
Zen Nippon Airinkai (Northern CA Chapter)
Zen Nippon Airinkai (Southern CA Chapter)

 

[GaryE]

When I decided to get serious about my hobby, I joined my 2 local clubs (2 languages) and it was the smartest thing I've done. There is no club where I am, though I tried to start one. I was a member of the Montreal clubs for 30+ years, and wish I had joined sooner. We like to think of this hobby as a lone nerd in a basement thing, but that's mushroom growing.
We're social animals, and clubs allow us to meet like minded people and develop our skills. Here I am, retired with the fishroom I wanted to have, but not a soul to share it with. That's unfortunate, because I learned a lot from people in my current situation.

I'd like to see everyone posting here find a physical club, and 2 worlds for developing their hobby - TFF and friends.

I used to scoot down to the Burlington Vermont club (1.5 hours each way) and gave talks in Quebec (2 hours) and Ottawa (1:15) almost yearly. The terrain has changed radically since we all became post pandemic hermits, but we can work around it. I'm speaking in Vermont and Montreal next fall. Hey, that's only a 9.5 hour drive.

 

[gilltyascharged]

In my 60 tank fishroom, I have one tank of beckford's pencils from a store, and, umm, nothing else. My other fish come from breeders, or from wild imports.
But I, like @TwoTankAmin , am in a position of luxury, as I have built contacts over the years.

Newcomers to the hobby don't have those resources, so it's good to share experience sometimes. This is the new to the hobby section....

60 tanks?? Man, I can't wait for adulthood...

 

[sharkweek178]

My personal rule is to never buy a fish on impulse. I spend weeks if not months thinking about it and researching before I buy. I make sure it's compatible with my tank size, water parameters, tank mates etc. I know what I'm buying before I walk through the door. And I call ahead to make sure they have what I want in stock. No substitutes.
Sometimes the fish store employees get it wrong. I called ahead to buy some corydoras pygmaeus and when I got there they only had habrosus. The employee didn't know the difference between the dwarf corys. It was a teachable moment for the employee. Bought a extended claw grabber which I've found really handy since then. But no fish. They didn't have what I specifically wanted.
I might buy a plant or decor or equipment spur of the moment. But never an animal.

 

[GaryE]

60 tanks?? Man, I can't wait for adulthood...

Umm, this is not adulthood. That's 50 years of working long hours and wanting free time. This is retirement...

Impulse buying is always a bad idea, but again, for many newcomers, all aquarium fish are new to them. That's why a phone and Seriously Fish go together really well.

 

[sharkweek178]

Umm, this is not adulthood. That's 50 years of working long hours and wanting free time. This is retirement...

Impulse buying is always a bad idea, but again, for many newcomers, all aquarium fish are new to them. That's why a phone and Seriously Fish go together really well.

Here's the thing. Most people have grown up with dogs and/or cats. If one gets dropped in their lap, they already know at least the basics. Fish are a whole different ballgame. The husbandry is more intensive in that we have to create and maintain a whole environment for them. Most people don't grow up with fish keeping or at least done properly. In fact, there is a lot of misinformation and myths and just a general lack of knowledge out there. But there's also a mind set of "It's a fish. How hard could it be?".