How many gallons/how much space for 3 fancy goldfish?

[OliveFish05]

Hello. I am setting up an aquatic garden to propagate and grow a variety of aquatic plants, grow aquaponic herbs, berries, and veggies, and raise Pygmy sunfish and Guppies. For one of my aquaponics setups. I would love to have my trio of fancy goldfish. I have an orange and white ranchu, a one eyed Thai Oranda, and one more I haven’t decided on yet, but definitely an Oranda or a ranchu. Their names are Like, Comment, and Subscribe But anyways. I am planning on growing strawberries and herbs in their setup, as aquaponics. Would it work to just have plants filtering their setup, with an air stone and sponge filter for aeration and a place for a bit of bacteria to grow? How many gallons/how much space would they need? Is this even possible?

 

[GaryE]

I have no idea of the yard, but you need to plan depth and hiding places. The first pond I managed was visited by a heron, and all of a sudden, there weren't as many fish as we started with. A one eyed oranda. Yummy, to some. Ranchu are really deformed, and I somehow don't think they'd survive a visit.
The pond I mention was in a courtyard, very urban - but it was noticed.

If you're enclosed and have no local raccoons, chances are increased (raccoons can remove bird netting).

 

[OliveFish05]

I have no idea of the yard, but you need to plan depth and hiding places. The first pond I managed was visited by a heron, and all of a sudden, there weren't as many fish as we started with. A one eyed oranda. Yummy, to some. Ranchu are really deformed, and I somehow don't think they'd survive a visit.
The pond I mention was in a courtyard, very urban - but it was noticed.

If you're enclosed and have no local raccoons, chances are increased (raccoons can remove bird netting).

Thanks for the input! Bird won’t be an issue in this space. I do have raccoons and possums… I think I accidentally replied to your post here in my other thread. I am looking into more predator proofing options.

 

[GaryE]

Raccoons here figured out that by lifting the pump outlet to a small waterfall, after disconnecting it, they could drain my rainbowfish pond. They did it 3 times, and I watched them the 3rd time (there were no fish left).

To raccoon-proof, you need a small armed guard, lazers, ninjas (but good ones, no budget hires), 7 sumos and several hundred crafty corgi dogs. Anything less will fail.

 

[OliveFish05]

Raccoons here figured out that by lifting the pump outlet to a small waterfall, after disconnecting it, they could drain my rainbowfish pond. They did it 3 times, and I watched them the 3rd time (there were no fish left).

To raccoon-proof, you need a small armed guard, lazers, ninjas (but good ones, no budget hires), 7 sumos and several hundred crafty corgi dogs. Anything less will fail.

WOAH. Fencing it is then... We once had a rabid raccoon attack our collies. Back then we had 3 collies, we only have 2 now (it wasn't rabies that killed the third one). My mom, my 3 sisters, and I had to get rabies vaccines. Miserable, miserable I tell you. My sisters have corgis. They are genuinely my least favorite dog breed... they are the absolute worst. Several hundred corgi dogs would equal several hundred squabbling dogs and several hundred corgi dumps on the floor.

 

[Uberhoust]

We have raccoons and herons as well, the raccoons pull out the water lilies and love munching on the goldfish. I now have one pond that just has minnows in it, they seem to avoid predation easier. My ponds have no filtration or air in them and the fish effectively are only fed via mosquito larva or other insects such as the aphids that like the water lilies. I am okay with the predators getting some of the gold fish because I don't want their population to grow, and I like watching the birds and raccoons. Goldfish wise I have 4 goldfish in a 300 gallon pond and they seem to do good, other than the predation. They spawn a lot but I don't get many young goldfish.

 

[OliveFish05]

I am thinking about what kind of fencing I would need. Obviously raccoons and possums can climb, so it would need a roof, correct?

 

[OliveFish05]

We have raccoons and herons as well, the raccoons pull out the water lilies and love munching on the goldfish. I now have one pond that just has minnows in it, they seem to avoid predation easier. My ponds have no filtration or air in them and the fish effectively are only fed via mosquito larva or other insects such as the aphids that like the water lilies. I am okay with the predators getting some of the gold fish because I don't want their population to grow, and I like watching the birds and raccoons. Goldfish wise I have 4 goldfish in a 300 gallon pond and they seem to do good, other than the predation. They spawn a lot but I don't get many young goldfish.

Uh oh. What kind of goldfish do you have? Do you think that 3 fancies would do ok in a 110 gallon stock tank? I have enough experience with goldfish to know that they would not do well in 40 gallons, which is the other size stock tank I have available to me.

 

[Uberhoust]

Depends on how well fed the raccoons are and whether they have a way out after they get in. Like any wild animal they subconsciously assess the benefit/risk ratio of trying to get into somewhere vs. how likely they are to get some tasty food. I find the fences and nets detract from a pond, so I haven't really tried seriously to keep predators out. Raccoons are pretty smart so you might find you need to try more than one thing, maybe start with one fish then expand to more if you don't have any issues. @GaryE comments really attests to the tenacity and drive of a raccoon that wants to get into something, for me its just simpler to accept some loss. I feed a sharp shinned hawk occasionally for the same reasons.

 

[Colin_T]

Most herbs don't do well with wet feet (too much water around the roots).
Strawberries will be fine in warm weather but not cold weather.
Most fruits and vegetables will grow well in aquaponic situations during warm or dry conditions.

A lot of aquarium plants can be grown out of water in aquaponic set ups. Amazon sword plants, Hygrophila species, even Ambulia and Milfoil can all be grown out of water. You can sell them as marsh plants for ponds or take cuttings and grow them underwater to help with your aquatic plant business.

Have lots of plants in the pond for the fish and cover the ponds with decent netting and it should stop the racoons getting the fish. The plants growing in the ponds can be sold too.

 

[OliveFish05]

Most herbs don't do well with wet feet (too much water around the roots).
Strawberries will be fine in warm weather but not cold weather.
Most fruits and vegetables will grow well in aquaponic situations during warm or dry conditions.

A lot of aquarium plants can be grown out of water in aquaponic set ups. Amazon sword plants, Hygrophila species, even Ambulia and Milfoil can all be grown out of water. You can sell them as marsh plants for ponds or take cuttings and grow them underwater to help with your aquatic plant business.

Have lots of plants in the pond for the fish and cover the ponds with decent netting and it should stop the racoons getting the fish. The plants growing in the ponds can be sold too.

Great! I will stick to pots and soil for the herbs then, and do strawberries and spinach aquaponically. Is a 100 gallon stock tank large enough for 2 or 3 fancy goldfish? I have heard people say "30 gallons each", I've also heard "30 for the first, 20 for every additional goldfish". Either way I suppose three is fine... although I will not be doing weekly water changes, more like 25% every other week, so I should stick with 2?

 

[Colin_T]

3 will be fine in 100 gallons of water.

for aquaponics to work well, they usually recommend a high stocking load so there is lots of fish waste for the plants. Having 3 fish might not be enough for the plants and you might need to use some supplemental fertilisers for the plants.

 

[OliveFish05]

3 will be fine in 100 gallons of water.

for aquaponics to work well, they usually recommend a high stocking load so there is lots of fish waste for the plants. Having 3 fish might not be enough for the plants and you might need to use some supplemental fertilisers for the plants.

Oh wow, ok! I was worried about stunting the goldfish. From what I've heard, goldfish have a growth suppressing hormone that they release so that they don't outgrow their space. I was afraid that with so little water changes, I would be stunting my goldies? Perhaps I will put my chunky bn pleco in there too, it should stay warm enough. More food for the plants. I told my little cousin about it, and she said "Ew... does that mean that when you eat the spinach and the strawberries, you are eating... goldfish poop?"

 

[Colin_T]

Most fish kept in aquaponic set ups are eaten and people don't really worry about the fish being stunted.

All fish produce a hormone to slow/ stunt the growth of other fish around them. This is produced by baby/ young fish and stops when the fish are mature. If the goldfish are 4 inches long or more (not including the tail), or they are more than 6 months old, they won't be producing any anti-growth hormones.

Fish will grow to the size of their environment. In a small container, they won't grow as big as if they were kept in a huge container, regardless of food and water changes. Fish that have been kept in small containers for a long time can start growing again if they are put into a bigger container.