How Many Angelfishes?

[twodoctors]

Hi all,

Planning on returning one of the firemouth to the LFS as it's being bullied by the larger one. Shouldn't be a problem (fingers crossed). Hoping to add a Koi Angelfish to the big tank. Now I have read that they are difficult to sex, and the combination would either be one, or a big group. Without crashing my tank, which way should I go? Planing on one currently and then add another shoal of something and corys to complete the setup. Thanks.

Adrian

 

[minnnt]

If you buy a group of them, get 6 and then wait and see IF any pair off. You can't really sex them until they breed. They're ovipositors (tubes) will show. The males is thinner and the females is thicker and shorter iirc. I have a male and a female.

How much do you want for the FM as i will have it off you if the price is right?

 

[fluttermoth]

I'd go for just the one, unless you want to breed them. Even in a groupd of 6+, if two decide they want to breed they'll harrass the others something terrible.

 

[minnnt]

The idea was to rehome which ever dont pair... obviously.

 

[fluttermoth]

The idea was to rehome which ever dont pair... obviously.

Yeah, but if Adrian doesn't want to breed angels, is it worth the hassle?!

 

[Tolak]

Just because they pair & spawn doesn't mean you'll have success at breeding angels. Getting angels to parent raise in a pair only tank is tough enough, I have yet to hear of someone with angels parent raising in a community tank. Angels aren't the sort of fish that always pair for life, sometimes a pair will have a falling out for whatever reason, and you suddenly have two incompatible fish to deal with.

A single angel, male or female should be OK with the stocking, just watch the firemouth, keep a divider handy.

 

[minnnt]

Ok, go for one then, but I think it would be lonely my self. I have a full grown female and a male that is not far behind. Her previous mate unfortunately died from mouth rot due to them falling out and lip locking whilst they had a batch of fry.... I put my male in (what I thought was a male) and he took a shine to her but she didn't seem to think much to him. They're now in my other tank and seem to get on very well together apart from the odd chase every now and then. Wharf has some very good specimens of angels in stock, always. Pm me about the FM if you want to sell him/her.

 

[KittyKat]

The first time I tried angels was in the tank you have now, I felt it was not big enough for them. Also, I observed that they did better in a group of 6+, but that tank is definitely not big enough for 6, so if you will get angels, you should go for a single fish.

 

[twodoctors]

Thanks for the replies.

I think 6 is a bit too much for my tank unless I take everything else out, literally. So I think I am stuck with just 1... unless you think I can get away with 2 or 3 (random ones). I have no interest in breeding them but obviously if they do breed (any of my fishes) then it means I'm doing something right. I also don't really want to try to rehome them. Unless someone on here is willing to take the "spare one" off me.

Do you think the firemouth will quarrel with the angelfish? I am tired of worrying about them in terms of fighting/bullying. Just want to watch them swim and thrive.

My firemouth I think I'll be able to bring back to the MA I bought from. They are very nice too. If they won't have it back I'll let you know Minnnt. I only want whatever is the current selling price.

Adrian

 

[minnnt]

Ok if you would rather do that mate thats fine. Me personally, i would have two juvenile angels. I wouldn't ever have 1, but thats just me.

 

[Tolak]

When you consider 5 gallons for potential breeder size angel, and 20 gallons for a pair is ballpark for what breeders stock a 215l is more than enough for 6 juvies & an attempt at a pair with tankmates. Adults in a group are generally kept at 10 gallons per fish, which is certainly workable in that tank as long as you keep up on maintenance. I as well as others have stocked adults at double that in a 55 gallon or larger, though you had better enjoy water changes.

Remember that angels are cichlids, individual temperaments vary. You may get an individual that is laid back, or very aggressive. Pairs work the same, with some you can keep two pairs in a larger undivided tank, others need something to block their view from the tank next to them.

 

[twodoctors]

Thanks.

I also prefer to have a pair of things. However after the experience with the firemouth (where I ended up having 2 males, different size, and bigger one chasing the smaller one away) I am a bit hesitant with getting pairs of potentially aggressive fishes. I have no experience with angels, and thinking that their mouth is small, there can't be too much damage done... I'm sure I'm wrong on that front! Someone please tell me. Is it worth the hassle? Would I get away with getting a pair of Koi Angels to live with the firemouth? Would I have a better chance if I get two different morph of angelfish? Should I consider angelfish at all knowing that I want to keep the firemouth?

I know maintainance isn't a major issue with my tank. With all the plants I have I can boast that my nitrate is zero 2 weeks after water change. That doesn't mean I don't change the water (I normally do ~30-50% per week, depending on the poo level). I don't see a problem with potential "overstocking" unless we are talking about swimming space.

Adrian

 

[KittyKat]

From the point of view of the number of fish, the angels should not make much difference to the bio-load.

Apparently black angels are more aggressive, but I have never seen any difference between the other colour morphs.

You already know my views on angels in that tank, so I won't repeat myself.

 

[twodoctors]

Thanks.

Is angelfish compitable with a (pair of) gourami? Just wondering...

Adrian

 

[KittyKat]

Depends on the gourami species/individual and individual angels. It has worked with relatively peaceful individuals for me.