Hello all! New to the forums!

[johndfritz]

My name is John, just wanted to say hello and introduce myself.
I am fairly new to the hobby (three months or so), though we did have a family tank when I was younger, back then I knew nothing about what it takes to properly keep fish. I have learned quite a bit since starting out a few months back.
I currently have a live bearer tank set up (40 long) that is doing well, consisting of guppies and platys so far.
That tank is a product of a learning curve, it started out as two platys in a 10 gallon, which I learned was much more difficult to keep then the bigger volume tanks due to water fluctuations. I bought a 20 gallon Hex shortly after that the Guppy males were living in, which taught me the pains of those tall up-to-your-arm-pit hex tanks, not to mention 20 gallons is not much better for fluctuation. Luckily, even though I cycled those tanks with the fish, they are alive and well, with new tank makes (the females) in my fully cycled 40 long, which pretty much had all the cycled media from the other tanks moved to it when I set it up. I have a 55 gallon set up as well, that I am doing a fishless cycle on. I plan to make that a new world/american cichlid tank when its ready.

Sorry for the book, just thought I would share my journey so far while introducing myself.
Not only have I researched daily for the past few months about all things fish as I fall deeper into the hobby. but google has constantly brought me here in response to questions I ask, usually on threads that already had similar questions asked, so I figured it was time to actually sign up! That being said, there are some very knowledgeable and helpful people on here and I would like to thank you all for your help to myself and others.

Here is a photo of the 40 gallon tank in case anyone is interested!
Phone pic so sorry for the blur!
P.S:The photo is cutting off the right side of the tank, but there is another 40g sponge filter over there as well. Also I made that stand with my son and he helped paint it, he is 8. It is screwed to the wall as well.

Thanks and look forward to more interaction with you all here!

 

[Guppylover3x]

My name is John, just wanted to say hello and introduce myself.
I am fairly new to the hobby (three months or so), though we did have a family tank when I was younger, back then I knew nothing about what it takes to properly keep fish. I have learned quite a bit since starting out a few months back.
I currently have a live bearer tank set up (40 long) that is doing well, consisting of guppies and platys so far.
That tank is a product of a learning curve, it started out as two platys in a 10 gallon, which I learned was much more difficult to keep then the bigger volume tanks due to water fluctuations. I bought a 20 gallon Hex shortly after that the Guppy males were living in, which taught me the pains of those tall up-to-your-arm-pit hex tanks, not to mention 20 gallons is not much better for fluctuation. Luckily, even though I cycled those tanks with the fish, they are alive and well, with new tank makes (the females) in my fully cycled 40 long, which pretty much had all the cycled media from the other tanks moved to it when I set it up. I have a 55 gallon set up as well, that I am doing a fishless cycle on. I plan to make that a new world/american cichlid tank when its ready.

Sorry for the book, just thought I would share my journey so far while introducing myself.
Not only have I researched daily for the past few months about all things fish as I fall deeper into the hobby. but google has constantly brought me here in response to questions I ask, usually on threads that already had similar questions asked, so I figured it was time to actually sign up! That being said, there are some very knowledgeable and helpful people on here and I would like to thank you all for your help to myself and others.

Here is a photo of the 40 gallon tank in case anyone is interested!
Phone pic so sorry for the blur!
P.S:The photo is cutting off the right side of the tank, but there is another 40g sponge filter over there as well. Also I made that stand with my son and he helped paint it, he is 8. It is screwed to the wall as well.
View attachment 91172

Thanks and look forward to more interaction with you all here!

Hi and welcome to the forum

There’s lot of nice knowledgable people here and lots to learn. I hope you enjoy it with us.

Nice tank! You should consider entering the tank of the month contest that’s just started. The winner gets their own little TOTM badge on their profile.

There is one every month so be sure to vote!

Best of luck.

 

[Colin_T]

Hi and welcome to the forum

Do you have a picture on the back of the tank?
If not you should stick one on the outside of the back. You can buy aquarium backings from pet shops or use a plastic bin liner, coloured card, newspaper. Darker backings make the fish feel more comfortable and let them show off their colour better.

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Stress from tank lights coming on when the room is dark can be an issue. Fish don't have eyelids and don't tolerate going from complete dark to bright light (or vice versa) instantly.

In the morning open the curtains or turn the room light on at least 30 minutes (or more) before turning the tank light on. This will reduce the stress on the fish and they won't go from a dark tank to a bright tank instantly.

At night turn the room light on and then turn the tank light off. Wait at least 30 minutes (or more) before turning the room light out. This allows the fish to settle down for the night instead of going from a brightly lit tank to complete darkness instantly.

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You don't need this now but the following link has information about what to do if your fish get sick. It's long and boring but worth knowing. I recommend printing it out and reading it in bed to help fall asleep.
http://www.fishforums.net/threads/what-to-do-if-your-fish-gets-sick.450268/

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If your fish ever get sick or stop feeding or look unwell, start a thread ASAP. The sooner we see the fish, the more chance we have of helping it.​

 

[johndfritz]

Hi and welcome to the forum

There’s lot of nice knowledgable people here and lots to learn. I hope you enjoy it with us.

Nice tank! You should consider entering the tank of the month contest that’s just started. The winner gets their own little TOTM badge on their profile.

There is one every month so be sure to vote!

Best of luck.

Hey thanks!
I did see that contest actually, I probably wont enter just yet but I do plan to vote!

Hi and welcome to the forum

Do you have a picture on the back of the tank?
If not you should stick one on the outside of the back. You can buy aquarium backings from pet shops or use a plastic bin liner, coloured card, newspaper. Darker backings make the fish feel more comfortable and let them show off their colour better.

-----------------------
Stress from tank lights coming on when the room is dark can be an issue. Fish don't have eyelids and don't tolerate going from complete dark to bright light (or vice versa) instantly.

In the morning open the curtains or turn the room light on at least 30 minutes (or more) before turning the tank light on. This will reduce the stress on the fish and they won't go from a dark tank to a bright tank instantly.

At night turn the room light on and then turn the tank light off. Wait at least 30 minutes (or more) before turning the room light out. This allows the fish to settle down for the night instead of going from a brightly lit tank to complete darkness instantly.

-----------------------
You don't need this now but the following link has information about what to do if your fish get sick. It's long and boring but worth knowing. I recommend printing it out and reading it in bed to help fall asleep.
http://www.fishforums.net/threads/what-to-do-if-your-fish-gets-sick.450268/

-----------------------
If your fish ever get sick or stop feeding or look unwell, start a thread ASAP. The sooner we see the fish, the more chance we have of helping it.​

Thanks for the welcome and the insight!
I do have a background on the 55 that is cycling but not on the 40 yet, it has a grayish colored wall behind it, however I do plan to add an actual background asap. Looks better in general not to mention the fish appreciate it as you say.
On the lights, I actually did not know that could stress them out if you did not let some natural light enter first in the mornings, or room light on for 30 mins when turning them off. Good news is I do open the curtains and front door in the mornings before flipping them on, and my tv light usually enters it when turning them off at night, but I will start using the actual room light when shutting them down from now on. Appreciate the info!
Lastly, yes, I will definitely be posting right away if I any of them start to behave oddly or show signs of illness, thank you for that link as well!

 

[Colin_T]

I do have a background on the 55 that is cycling but not on the 40 yet

If you have an established aquarium (filter has developed the necessary beneficial bacteria to keep ammonia and nitrite levels at 0), you can take half of that filter material and put it in the new tank for an instant cycled tank. It means you don't have to spend a month or more cycling the new tank because you will be adding the filter bacteria from the old established tank.

 

[johndfritz]

If you have an established aquarium (filter has developed the necessary beneficial bacteria to keep ammonia and nitrite levels at 0), you can take half of that filter material and put it in the new tank for an instant cycled tank. It means you don't have to spend a month or more cycling the new tank because you will be adding the filter bacteria from the old established tank.

I actually encountered some weird stuff with that tank already, I added a 25 gal sponge filter that was already established as well as a full bottle of dr tims one and only that said treats up to 60 gallons and the ammonia level did not move from 4ppm. I used dr tims ammonia chloride to dose the ammonia up. temp stays between 78-80 degrees F. PH around 7.8-8.0. Very hard well water here though, not sure if that makes a difference in bacteria growth.

This is over a week and a 1/2 to two week period that nothing moved. I actually gravel vac'd moving decorations, and drained 90% of the water earlier due to this, and refilled. Retested water to find .50 ppm ammonia left over, ph had dropped to 6.8-7.0 from what I believe is all the rain here lately in MD, my LFS claims to have the same issuses when it rains/doesn't rain, and they usually correct with RO water. However, from what I have read as long as you stay above 6.0 the bacteria wont go into a dormant state, so I bought another bottle of dr tims and added the whole thing again, dosed ammonia back up to only around 2-3ppm this time.

Just to add, no nitrite has shown its face, going to check things after 24 hours, but that is to date, no nitrites yet. However, NitrAtes out of the tap right now are around 40ppm, and that varies depending on the rain here, I have plants in the established tank lowering those keeping it around 10-20ppm tops for me. I saw that this can stall things but that was only from one source I read somewhere so not sure of the accuracy there.

I was actually planning to ask about all of this pending tomorrows test's, so yeah sorry for the book, I have been all over this forum/google/youtube reading and watching about cycling and other post's here with the same type of issues. What is odd to me though is the first bottle of dr tims as well as the established filter seems to have had its bacteria killed off pretty much as soon as I added it to the tank, I could be wrong, but no change in ammonia levels and no nitrite after almost two weeks seems to verify that. Its definitely not from chlorine or the like as we are on a private well here, so not sure what else could have caused that. This was a used tank, but I scrubbed the crap out of it with a brand new sponge that I had rinsed first, with a solution of half white vinegar and half water, and rinsed it well multiple times, same with the lid. Also rinsed all the gravel and decorations well before adding them, did not rinse/clean the seeded filter I added, I know that will kill the BB. So yeah, no clue. Sorry for going on like that, was planning to ask this in another thread though haha. Appreciate the responses and info!

EDIT/UPDATE:
So after typing that I decided to do some test's (Manily PH), not sure if I was getting a off reading earlier and the water just needed to settle, but it is back up to 8.2 PH, which is pretty much the normal here out of the tap. Also, too early to tell but I tested it anyway, looks like ammonia has dropped slightly but still no nitrites. I use the API master test kit for freshwater.

 

[Colin_T]

If the ammonia level goes above 4ppm it will stall the cycling process.
If the nitrite level goes too high it can stall the process.
If the pH drops too low it can stall the cycle.
If the oxygen levels are low it can stall the cycle.

If you are using a dry paper test kit, it might be reading a little bit lower and the ammonia level might have been too high. I normally suggest keeping the ammonia level at 2-3ppm during a fishless cycle. You have lowered it so it should be fine at 3pppm.

Your pH should be fine.

Hard water does not make any difference to the cycling process and will actually help keep the pH stable so it doesn't drop and stall.

Make sure you have lots of aeration/ surface turbulence in the tank water to keep the oxygen levels high.

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If you have nitrates in your well water, you should probably get it checked for other things too. There are numerous chemicals that can leach into ground water and slowly poison fish and other aquatic organisms. You can test it for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH with your own test kits, but you might want to get a lab to test it for anything and everything just to confirm it has nothing harmful in it that might affect you or the fish. If it does contain harmful chemicals then get it tested every year and pre-filter it before using it. You should also contact the health department and let them know the ground water is contaminated.

Agricultural chemicals can inhibit or kill filter bacteria, fish and people.

I would probably pre-filter the water before using it. You can use large plastic storage containers, plastic rubbish bins, or even a fish pond outside. Fill it with well water and aerate it. Fill a box filter or power filter with Activated Carbon or Highly Activated Carbon and let it run on the container for a few days to remove any chemicals. Replace the carbon each time you refill the container with water. You can buy large bags of Activated Carbon from various places and it's a lot cheaper than buying it from a pet shop.

You can also look at getting a Pozzani filter to remove nitrates from the water. If you can't get that, then add a heap of floating plants to the container and give them lots of light. They will use up the nitrates and then you can use the clean, nitrate free water to do water changes on the fish tanks.

I would use a carbon filter and plants together, to get clean water.

The following links have some information about nitrates in tap water and might be useful.
http://www.fishforums.net/threads/nitrates-and-water-changes.447661/#post-3784415

http://www.fishforums.net/threads/pozzani-filter-update-and-more-qs.448815/#post-3794258

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How old was the filter you moved into the new tank?
If it was less than 1 month old, the bacteria might not have survived the move. When filters have been run for more than 2 months the bacteria are pretty well attached and normally survive being moved to different tanks.

If your well water has something bad in it, that might have killed the bacteria.
If the ammonia levels in the new tank were too high, it might have killed the bacteria.

I would leave the ammonia level in the new tank at about 1ppm for a couple of weeks and see what happens. If it doesn't drop and you don't get any nitrites, then I would drain the tank and refill it, then add a few fish.

See what you can do about dropping the nitrate. It shouldn't be the issue but might be a contributing factor.

 

[johndfritz]

Man, really good info there, I seriously appreciate that. Been wondering how I could remove those nitrates prior to doing water changes! We don't drink the well water here due to that issue, its all gallon spring water for drinking/coffee. As far as contacting the health department, it was years ago, but a guy had tested and said it was fine, but that was before our well partially collapsed, which is why I believe we have those issues. We do run our water through a whole house filter (sediment filter), but I doubt that does anything for any possible nasties. The tank with fish has java moss, java fern, guppy grass, and amazon swords which all appear to be thriving and are definitely dropping the nitrate levels in that.

Yeah the filter that was moved was only like a month and a half or so old, so it probably did kill the bacteria there. I am kinda over filtering the 55 gallon with a 60 gal sponge filter, the 25 gal sponge, as well as a 20 gal HOB, that has a aquaclear sponge inside rather then the little pack that comes with is, as well as a pre-filter sponge on the end in the tank, and an air stone. Sounds like I might want to run the little carbon filters that come with that inside the HOB. In the meantime I'm gonna look into a drum I can keep water in for changes and the activated carbon method. Gonna look at those links you put there. Thank you again for the info, hope I'm not bugging you! Its almost midnight here, I am only up due to rain and no work tomorrow.

 

[Colin_T]

You can collect rainwater and mix it with well water to drop the GH and nitrates.

If you take a glass full of tap water to the local pet shop, they should be able to test the GH (general hardness) and KH (carbonate hardness) of your well water, or you can buy a test kit for it. Write the results down (in numbers) when they do the tests. And ask them what the results are in (eg: ppm, dGH, or something else).

If you buy test kits, try to get liquid test kits because they are more accurate than dry paper strip kits. And check the expiry date on the kits. Do not buy test kits or medications that are kept next to a window or heat source. Heat destroys the chemicals. When you get the kits home, keep them in a cool dry, dark place. I kept mine in a plastic container in the bottom of the fridge.
*NB* Make sure children and animals can't get the kits because they have some pretty toxic stuff in them.
*NB* Wash hands and test phials after using them to remove any of the chemicals from your skin.

Depending on your GH and what fish you want to keep, having rain water and hard well water would give you plenty of options on different fishes for your tanks.

eg: If you want tetras, angelfish, gouramis or Bettas, then they all prefer soft water and using 2-3 parts rain water and 1-2 parts well water would give you suitable water.

If you want livebearers (guppies, mollies, platies, swordtails) then keep them in straight well water so they have lots of minerals and a higher pH.

You will need to know the GH of your well water first tho, and add rain water to lower the GH to whatever level you want.

Rain water should have a GH of 0ppm and a pH of 7.0.
If the rain water has a pH below 7.0, then there is chemicals in the air that are being picked up by the rain. These should be filtered out with a carbon filter before using the water for drinking or fish keeping.

 

[johndfritz]

Nice tip about the rain water, would have never thought to use rain water in an aquarium, let alone to drink.
Just wanted to update, the 40 long now has a DIY background that I made out of underlayment for mulch or landscaping purposes, since its already black. Just cut it to height and length and taped it on. Looks good imo.

Trying to DIY most everything I can at this point, it really is a ridiculously expensive hobby when it comes down to it, if you simply break down and buy everything you need. For the nitrate out of the tap problem, I am thinking about making my own reactor for that, just gotta find what type of bio media is good for it, as far as Anaerobic bacteria are concerned. Water has to move slow through it for this to work, not sure if seachem matrix would be good or not.
https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/product/seachem-de-nitrate-filter-media?rrec=true
Still looking into that. It will probably end up being something similar to this thing Joey made...

There is of course these but honestly again $$$...

https://aquaripure.com/product-category/aquaripure-nitrate-removal-filter/

Lastly, as far as DIY stuff, I had planned on setting up a drip system with irrigation tubing/parts/0.5gph drippers and the like along with an overflow like this...(skip to about 14 mins in)

Anyways, all plans I have had for weeks, and yes, I realize this does not completely replace doing water changes and you still have to gravel vac and perform regular maintenance when necessary. Just helps maintain a consistent healthy environment. Still giving the 55 gallon some time to do its thing before I test again. Also I use the API master test kit for freshwater, no strips. Need to get a TDS meter though. Thanks again for the replies!

 

[Colin_T]

Denitrating filters use anaerobic bacteria to break down nitrates into nitrogen gas and something else, which then comes out of the water. They are fed carbon and take about 2 months to start working.

You can have any sort of filter media in them, including sponge, bioballs, ceramic beads, basically anything you use in a normal filter for the bacteria to live on.

I originally bought a Sera Bio-denitrator and it worked well. However, I have also made them from old canister filters (the motor was not turned on). I used a small water pump to pump water around the tank and tapped into the return hose to drip water into the denitrator. You have it dripping at about 1 drop per second.

For nitrates in tap water you are better off using floating plants in a plastic water holding container. It will be quicker and you can add an air operated box filter (containing carbon) to the water container and remove anything else while the plants use the nitrates.

I'm not sure what the second video is for or why you want a drip system.

 

[johndfritz]

For nitrates in tap water you are better off using floating plants in a plastic water holding container. It will be quicker and you can add an air operated box filter (containing carbon) to the water container and remove anything else while the plants use the nitrates.

I'm not sure what the second video is for or why you want a drip system.

I will admit that does sound like a much easier and quicker way to deal with the nitrates out of the tap, and originally I wanted to set up a drip system to constantly have fresh water going into the tank with old flushing out, but with the nitrates in the tap I would have to already have the established de-nitrifier system working. So yeah, probably wont be doing that anytime soon, that video was just to show the type of overflow I planned on using for the drip system.

 

[Colin_T]

drip systems on tanks that continually have new water flowing in and old water flowing out, use a lot of water for little gain. Unless you have lots of water flowing into the tank, you don't dilute anything because the filters/ pumps mix the new water in with the old.

Big weekly or fortnightly water changes are much more effective. Just drain 50-75% of the water out every week or two and refill it with clean water.

 

[johndfritz]

drip systems on tanks that continually have new water flowing in and old water flowing out, use a lot of water for little gain. Unless you have lots of water flowing into the tank, you don't dilute anything because the filters/ pumps mix the new water in with the old.

Big weekly or fortnightly water changes are much more effective. Just drain 50-75% of the water out every week or two and refill it with clean water.

Full of info good sir!
Decided to abandon all the wild ambitions and just go with the standard water changes as you suggested, which I have been doing, just need to get some tubs set up with plants and aeration for the nitrates in the tap. I will then use a pump to get that filtered water into the tanks when doing the water changes.

Also just an update on the 55 gallon that I am fishless cycling. Finally seeing Nitrite!
Ammonia is at 1.0ppm, Nitrite at .50ppm (was .25 yesterday, so still ammonia is still being converted at this stage). Waiting to see ammonia drop to .25-.50ppm before I bump it back to 2-3ppm. I was very pleased when the vial turned purple! Thought there was something else going on killing the bacteria, but it was apparently just a matter of patience!

Anyhow, thanks again for all the info.
P.S: Are standard rubbermade tubs okay for storing and filtering my tap water or is it possible they contain something toxic?

 

[Colin_T]

I have no idea about Rubbermaid products. Your best bet is to contact the manufacturer and ask them if their containers are safe for drinking water. If they are safe for drinking water then they will be safe for fish.

Most plastic storage containers are safe for fish but try to avoid the coloured containers. Some red and blue containers seem to cause issues to fish, whereas clear containers or semi transparent containers are fine.