Gourami Problem

[borissimo]

I have a small orange (bought as a thicked lipped, but I am not sure if he is that or a dwarf) gourami.

He lives in a community tank with another small gourami, gold and pearl gouramis, rainbow fish, bristlenose catfish, corys, a ruby shark and a plec. He is the only fish affected.

For a while now he has had to take 'rests' either at the bottom or top of the tank - when we first saw him do this he was so still we thought he was dead.

He seems to struggle to the top of the tank to take air, but so far he has always made it. He can swim around in between and is still eating.

There are no other signs of illness to give any idea of what the problem is - i.e. no bloating, no fin or scale damage - except for one 'tentacle' which has recently become slightly frayed at the end.

I am sorry that I do not have the tank stats with me at this moment but the last time I tested the water everything was within normal parameters except for phosphates which I do have a problem with. The nitrates can rise a bit, but I perform frequent water changes including cleaning the substrate to keep these down. Nitrite and ammonia was nil. PH was around 7.5.

When he goes up for air, he goes up practically vertically, so perhaps this is a swim bladder problem like Lilmuppet's on the other thread - however, he can also swim horizontally in between rests.

At the moment I am just doing frequent water changes and putting in ESHA 2000.

Any thoughts gratefully received.

 

[-germ-]

Is there anything apart from his/her resting to suggest this is actually an illness?
Particularly when you say he struggles to the surface, how does he swim (aside from vertically whichisn't a problem) that suggests he's struggling?
Nearly all my gourami rest from time to time and they have no illnesses (that i know of),my thick lips being probably the most lethargic of my fish, also if the gourami appears to be gulping as he rests alost vertically at the top of your tank he's probably just being greedy and sieving out small particles of food from the waters surface.
Unless theres anything else wrong aside from his resting it sounds like completely normal gourami behaviour to me.....

 

[borissimo]

Sorry - don't know why I lost the thread (possibly losing the thread altogether!)

When he goes up vertically for air, it is usually from his resting position on the bottom. Then he slightly sinks back down and turns himself so he is the right way up to go down the rest of the way. He often leans against the glass at the bottom. I don't think it is quite normal because although he is quite young he hasn't done this from the beginning. It looks hard work to get to the top although he can stay there when he wants to eat.

 

[borissimo]

Hello

My gourami is worse. He was only just managing to get to the top of the tank to get air, then tending to fall back down rather than turn round and swim. He is presently in a net balanced at the top of the tank with the lights off. I have done this because he was resting at the moment and other fish were barging past him and he looked uncomfortable. He is still eating but his balance isn't good. I am putting a few drops of bacteria control in the water in the net. I am still not sure exactly what has caused this. The gill area is a bit pale, though I don't think he was ever very darkly coloured in that area. He doesn't appear to be swollen, though it is possible that the front half of his body is bulkier than the rear half of his body. At the moment he is balancing himself against the net and as I mentioned above, is still eating, so I do not want to euthanase him whilst he still has the will to live.

I think he is going to die but if anyone has any ideas for emergency treatment it would be much appreciated.

 

[-germ-]

I'm sorry, i'm awful at fish illnesses, try feeding him half a mushed up pea and some daphinia if you have them....
I'll grab my fish illness book and post later but hopefully someone with a better knowledge of fish illness than me will have posted by then...
(hint, hint, anyone?)

 

[-germ-]

ok...
I personally think its osmotic shock due to your high ph level, this will have messed with the balances in his swimbladder....
Emergency treatment, get him to a hospital tank, or seperate container if need be with SOFT water in..... no vitamins or additives, nutrient poor, dechlorinated and detoxified, softwater
If it isn't osmotic shock... Then treat him with anti bacterial and peas....
I'd go for number 1...
Good luck

Do you have a hospital tank?
Do not decrease the PH in your main tank suddenly or you may kill/damage the other fish...

 

[Miss Wiggle]

both cases definately sound like swimbladder

it can be tricky because there are a number of things that can cause it and which may require different treatments.

first thing to do as with all illness's is confine the fish to a hospital tank if possible, if not ensure that the water is spotless in the tank, if you can put in some sort of makeshift divider that would be good.

the easiest form of swimbladder to treat is when it's caused by constipation, get frozen peas and blanch them briefly, then take off the outer shell and feed the soft inside bit to the fish, this should clear up the constipation. if that doesn't work then you know you need to do something more serious, locate a decent anti bacterial med

 

[borissimo]

Thanks - actually I might have overestimated the pH a bit - I will test again this evening. I have trouble matching the exact colour but it is probably between 7 & 7.5.

I will try your suggestions

 

[borissimo]

I tried putting my gourami in a small tank with half the tank water and half RO water last night. I checked and he was still able to make it to the top to get air. He also ate some flake before I put him in the tank but turned his nose up at the pea I tried to hand feed him.

Sadly he was dead this morning. I didn't realise that an incorrect pH can cause swim bladder problems.

I am very embarrassed to admit that I had not been keeping a proper eye on the pH. The colour on the chart is somewhere between 7.2 and 7.8 (i.e. between the yellow and the brown).

I tested the tap water and it is coming out at the brown colour which matches 7.8 and I had been mixing this with RO water for this tank. The water that comes out of the tap at work about 22 miles away where I keep two other tanks, is usually around 7.

I am going to try and bring it down gradually.