Gill Flukes...... :(

[Fawke]

Hi ppl,

Damn, just when things are looking good, levels are acceptable and settled... bang, another kick in the teeth....

Today my Blue Gourami has been flashing and flicking like a bit of a lunatic.... he keeps opening his mouth pretty wide and occasionally gasps...
He is feeding, and is his normal self (arrogant) + this behavior....

His gills almost appear kind of raised - hard to describe, but not red or sore looking. Absolutely no signs of ICH or anything visable.....

My diagnosis is gill flukes, although any other ideas would be greatly welcomed (especially if its better news)

I need to setup a hospital tank to treat for them i guess, as i am limited with medication as far as my catfish are concerned.....

When treatment recommendation say a salt bath.... does this mean adding salt to a small tank? or applying it directly......?

Any pictures or help much appreciated.....

Thanks

 

[wuvmybetta]

From what I understand, gill flukes should be very noticable on the external area of the gills...you sure that's what it is? How are your water parameters?

salt baths should be given outside of the tank, but I don't know if that will kill flukes.Since they're a parasite and not a bacteria,that could be a wasted step.

If you decide to treat,you'll need something for parasites and after that you'll have to treat for bacterial infection as a preventive so he doesn't get a secondary infection.

 

[Fawke]

No im not really all that sure if it is gill flukes, as you say it is not all that noticable.

I have just done a 30% water change, to lower the nitrates from 50ppm (which is high i know, but it comes outta the tap at 40ppm) also been using nitrasafe,,,

Other parameters are fine.......

He is also scratching around the head/gill area, so another pointer that may say its flukes?

hhmmm, help?!? i really dunno....

 

[Fawke]

Sorry, water params -

Ammonia 0.0mg/l
Nitrite 0.0mg/l
Nitrate 40-50ppm

Ph - 7.6
Hard Water...

 

[wuvmybetta]

The gills would be red if it was gill flukes, but perhaps you caught it at it's earliest stages.

I asked about your parameters because I was wondering if perhaps it was ammonia poisoning. Or nitrate poisoning in your case (mine come out at 40 ppm tap too ) but he would be lethargic if that were the case.

I hate to say remove him and treat him before examining all possibilities, but maybe that's the best decision. Maybe move him and observe him for a day before medicating him. This way you can stop it from spreading throughout your tank.

 

[Fawke]

Im gonna have to go and buy, setup a hospital tank for first...... Can the other fish catch Gill Flukes is it infectious?

Presumably thats what i should treat him for, gill flukes....?

Whats the best way of setting up a hospital tank, with water from my main tank? It wont be cycled you see, i have to go and set it up....

Thanks for the replies anyhow, much appreciated

 

[wuvmybetta]

Yes, something that's anti-parasite. Followed by a anti-bacteria med to prevent an infection where the parasites were.

Just transfer water as you said and some gravel, do you have an extra filter you can start running now to 'season'?
Try and keep the water as clean as possible because dead parasites can foul your water quality.

 

[Fawke]

No i dont have a spare one, but i will buy a small power filter along with my hosptial tank.....

How long does the filter generally tank to "season" in a mature tank?, ready for transfer to a non- mature tank ?

Thanks again

 

[wuvmybetta]

A couple days, you have no choice atm,you need a filter on the hospital tank immediately. You'll just have to stay on top of your water changes so the bio-filter doesn't get overloaded. If you use enough gravel from the first tank you should be ok. But be careful not to take too much gravel and crash your other tank.

 

[Fawke]

went out yesterday to price up a hospital tank. I have decided which one to go with and was going to buy it today, but have been called into work........

however, I have this morning noticed that my fish has infact got fungus, not gill flukes, this must of been the cause of the scratching I am pulling out all the stops to get to my lfs before it shuts to pick up the tank and meds, but was hoping you could help me with a few questions in the meantime.

any suggestions on a good medication?

how contagious is it?

how did this happen? if it is something I have done wrong then I would like to put it right

thanks, any help would be really appreciated

 

[Fawke]

sorry, forgot to say all my water tests are reading fine and have done a water change of about 30%

I know that setting up a tank from scratch and putting fish in is not ideal, but dont see I have any other choice at this point.

also I was a newbie that cycled with too many, of the wrong fish so water changes are one of my strong points

anybody got any thoughts?

 

[Cian McLiam]

Having battled gill flukes with Discus a few years ago, I think the following might be helpful.

Gills infected with flukes will be pink in colour, they should be bright red. The flukes are nasty little buggers that will re-appear after a couple of weeks of succesful treatment because they will curl up and fall to the aquarium floor, but not all will die. A second treatment a week after the first is a necessity. A third is also a good idea if the fish are not weakened.

Two products have given good results IME, malachite green/formalin medications (WS3, QuickCure, Contra Spot) is effective but will damage the filter and stress the fish. Praziquantel is very effective and gentle on the filter. Its sold as a wormer for dogs under the name droncit, you may need to get a vets presciption in your area. 3-4 ppm is the recommended dose for the first treatment, but as its tolerated well by most fish, you could strengthen that if necessary the following week.

Ken

 

[Fawke]

thanks for the reply ken

we thought it was gill flukes at first as the gills were slightly raised and the fish was scratching. we studied him closely and that was the only difference we could see. we also tried trawling the net for a picture of a fish suffering gill flukes but all we could find were diagrams which were not that helpful.

would the meds that you mention also be good for fungus? have heard that melafix is a good all rounder, will pick some up as I hate being in this possition of being un prepared and unable to do anything

 

[Cian McLiam]

Melafix probably wont do very much for either fungus or flukes or any other types of parasite. In fact it doesnt seem to be very effective on bacteria in lab tests. What it does seem to do is help the skin fight/prevent infection from bacteria and promote re-growth of damaged areas. Malachite green will help fungus, it is most effective when diluted and painted onto the fungus with a new model paint brush. I wouldnt do this if it was the gills that were affected though.
I've used this effectively on body and mouth fungus.

You probably wont see any pics of gill flukes infection as the parasites are microscpoic, and you can only really see the damage on gill scrapings of dead fish.

Fungus wont cause a fish to scratch, whatever caused the wound that the fungus is growing on will. It could be Ich, flukes or a number of parasites. In this case, Quick Cure at 3/4 the recommeded dose is a simple but effective treatement that will be effective against parasites and fungus. Tetra Contra spot is a similar product.
King British WS3 or White Spot Control has malachite green and quinine and is also effective, I believe the quinine is less damaging to fish and filters than formalin. White Spot Control is a diluted version of WS3, I use the concentrated WS3.

Ken

 

[Fawke]

thank you so much for your help

cant see any other sign of disease on the fish so have no idea what the primary cause could be. will keep a close eye and see how things develop. the fungus is growing on the body of the fish just behind the head.

thanks again for the detailed advice, it is most appriciated. just got to hot foot it to the lfs now, will be sure to take notes of the meds you recommended before I go