Fish In Cycle

[tez2k007]

Got 3 zebra danios in tank which has been going for about 2 weeks almost but added these guys on sunday.

Jusst took the latest reading and just needing advice if looks ok.

Amonia - 0.25
Nitrites - 0
Nitrates - 5

They are whizzing around like mental cases and seem happy chasing each other.

 

[waterdrop]

It takes about 3 weeks miniumum, but often up to a couple of months (without fish) to grow the 2 specific species of bacteria that we need in the filter before it is operational for having fish. Prior to that, the filter is not a working piece of equipment.

You've put yourself in what we call a "fish-in cycle", which means the zebras are being exposed to ammonia (causing permanent gill damage) and are in danger of being exposed to nitrite(NO2), which causes suffocation, leading to permanent nerve damage. If you can re-home them out of the situation or if you decide to manually perform all the daily water changes, you might be able to save the fish in the long run.

The ideal thing would be if they could be taken back or re-homed so that you could perform a "fishless cycle" with pure household ammonia as is explained in our pinned articles here on the forum. If you can't do that then you will need to get instructions from the members for performing a "fish-in" cycle.

Any chance you had introduced "mature media" (sponge or other media from an old fishtank filter) during that first two weeks?

~~waterdrop~~
ps. there are also many, many threads here where you can read of other beginners doing both these types of cycle processes

 

[tez2k007]

It takes about 3 weeks miniumum, but often up to a couple of months (without fish) to grow the 2 specific species of bacteria that we need in the filter before it is operational for having fish. Prior to that, the filter is not a working piece of equipment.

You've put yourself in what we call a "fish-in cycle", which means the zebras are being exposed to ammonia (causing permanent gill damage) and are in danger of being exposed to nitrite(NO2), which causes suffocation, leading to permanent nerve damage. If you can re-home them out of the situation or if you decide to manually perform all the daily water changes, you might be able to save the fish in the long run.

The ideal thing would be if they could be taken back or re-homed so that you could perform a "fishless cycle" with pure household ammonia as is explained in our pinned articles here on the forum. If you can't do that then you will need to get instructions from the members for performing a "fish-in" cycle.

Any chance you had introduced "mature media" (sponge or other media from an old fishtank filter) during that first two weeks?


its a 33g tank and doing the daily water changes isnt really a big deal. i had the tank running for 2 weeks using start up media and fish flakes and added the danios on sunday. been checking every day for amonia and nitrites and .25 is highest amonia reading since then. just wondering what levels are too high during this process.

~~waterdrop~~
ps. there are also many, many threads here where you can read of other beginners doing both these types of cycle processes

 

[Schmill]

As we discussed previous in THIS THREAD you have taken the choice to do things the hard way.
As I pointed out in that thread if you do FISH-IN cycling you need to do lots of regular water changes and lots of regular testing.
At 0.25 ammonia you are at TOXIC levels for your fish, so they are currently 'in danger'. You need to do enough water changes now to bring that level back down to zero, and you are going to need to increase your testing regime to keep an eye on the ammonia and the nitrIte levels.
WhenEVER either of them is above 0ppm you need to do a waterchange, even if you have only just done one.

I guess what bugs me a little bit, is in that original thread you said about adding TWO zebras and we warned you of the work and load that would cause, and now you say you started out with 3 zebras, and then added "these guys" (which guys?), on Sunday, so I presume you now have 3 zebras + some other fish in the tank? That is only going to serve to INCREASE the ammonia levels, and as such cause you to the ahve to test even MORE often, and perform even more, greater volume water changes...

I hate to say "I told you so", but I guess somethings we just have to learn for ourselves.

As ever good luck with it, and I hope your fish stay ok

 

[tez2k007]

As we discussed previous in THIS THREAD you have taken the choice to do things the hard way.
As I pointed out in that thread if you do FISH-IN cycling you need to do lots of regular water changes and lots of regular testing.
At 0.25 ammonia you are at TOXIC levels for your fish, so they are currently 'in danger'. You need to do enough water changes now to bring that level back down to zero, and you are going to need to increase your testing regime to keep an eye on the ammonia and the nitrIte levels.
WhenEVER either of them is above 0ppm you need to do a waterchange, even if you have only just done one.

I guess what bugs me a little bit, is in that original thread you said about adding TWO zebras and we warned you of the work and load that would cause, and now you say you started out with 3 zebras, and then added "these guys" (which guys?), on Sunday, so I presume you now have 3 zebras + some other fish in the tank? That is only going to serve to INCREASE the ammonia levels, and as such cause you to the ahve to test even MORE often, and perform even more, greater volume water changes...

I hate to say "I told you so", but I guess somethings we just have to learn for ourselves.

As ever good luck with it, and I hope your fish stay ok

As i said I dont have a problem with the water changes. That I can do and all I have is 3 zebra danios.

I said I have a tank that has been going for 2 weeks mini cycling which now has 3 danios as of sunday.

 

[Schmill]

Aha I see, sorry the number of fish didn't come across clearly to me in your first post

In that case waterchange, & test and waterchange some more is the way to go

Good luck!

 

[tez2k007]

Aha I see, sorry the number of fish didn't come across clearly to me in your first post

In that case waterchange, & test and waterchange some more is the way to go

Good luck!

Cheers bud will do. No i knew not to overstock it but a friend of mine who has had them for years said to add danios to help with the cycle but did say there is a slight chance could lose them.

When I change the water how do I counter the temperature though and should I put the decholrinator into the tank before I add the new water. Not sure which best method is.

 

[Schmill]

Up to you really, I don't recall the capacity of your tank, but there are various options, and many members on here will do several different types - lol

1) Add water to buckets (with enough dechlor for each bucket), put them somewhere warm, then do your waterchange.
or
2) Add water to buckets trying to mix warm & cold water to match tank temperature, (although there is some concern that if you have the type of system that stores a tank of hot water some copper may leech into the water), add the dechlor to the buckets and do the water change.
or
3) Put cold water in the buckets along with the right amount of dechlor, do water change.
This is what I do on my 60 litre tank, I'm generally changing around 20-25% of the water and the fish seem to welcome the cooler water stream for a while
or
4) Remove dirty water from the tank, add dechlor to the tank, use hose to refill the tank, (either with cold water, or with mixed warm water, (but see warning above)).
This is the option I am now going to be doing on my 300 Litre tank. It's too awkward & time consuming to do with buckets, (not to mention risky for the carpets!), and I have no way to add 'warm' water using the hose, so it will just be fresh cold mains water. Not got fish in that tank yet though so I can't say how that will work out for me

 

[tez2k007]

Up to you really, I don't recall the capacity of your tank, but there are various options, and many members on here will do several different types - lol

1) Add water to buckets (with enough dechlor for each bucket), put them somewhere warm, then do your waterchange.
or
2) Add water to buckets trying to mix warm & cold water to match tank temperature, (although there is some concern that if you have the type of system that stores a tank of hot water some copper may leech into the water), add the dechlor to the buckets and do the water change.
or
3) Put cold water in the buckets along with the right amount of dechlor, do water change.
This is what I do on my 60 litre tank, I'm generally changing around 20-25% of the water and the fish seem to welcome the cooler water stream for a while
or
4) Remove dirty water from the tank, add dechlor to the tank, use hose to refill the tank, (either with cold water, or with mixed warm water, (but see warning above)).
This is the option I am now going to be doing on my 300 Litre tank. It's too awkward & time consuming to do with buckets, (not to mention risky for the carpets!), and I have no way to add 'warm' water using the hose, so it will just be fresh cold mains water. Not got fish in that tank yet though so I can't say how that will work out for me

its 125ltr so im gonna use a hose i think that way its less work. Probs going to try use the hose to remove the water also but need to think of a way around it so I dont have to use the obvious method which involves getting a mouthfull of fish tank water.

 

[waterdrop]

It doesn't take much to pull the siphon water over the edge of the tank, so you will rarely get a mouthful, especially if you ensure the hose is longer. And yes, you'll be wise to work out a good technique for the large number to be done. You'll need to add conditioner measured as if its for the full volume of the tank. The method I use is to know that calculation and then dump in half of it directly in the tank at the beginning of the fill and then the other half near or after the end of the fill.

The pattern of water changes you are seeking should be to get as close to double zero readings as possible. Then the highest you want to hit is 0.25ppm of either ammonia or nitrite(NO2) at the point at which you are able to perform the next water change. In other words, your timing, worst case, has it building up to 0.25ppm of one of then but then you are able to peform a 50% water change and hopefully give yourself another 12 hours or whatever. With 3 danios in a 125L/33G, you should get into some sort of once a day pattern or less after possibly some initial extra ones.

If you are careful to do this in a good manner, the situation will not be so bad for the danios although we can't guarantee they'll make it. One of the things that confuses people is that when the tests, even the liquid tests report zero, that means a zero level with respect to the sensitivity of the test and with respect to "zero" for the fish, it doesn't mean there aren't smaller amounts of the toxic chemicals present in the water. So when it -does- detect the chemicals, even small detections, its already pretty bad for fish.

~~waterdrop~~