Experienced Novice

[SushiAk49]

New to the forum, and I have kept a few tanks before it seem that my prior success had a lot to do with the water of where I've lived before. So though I've had a few tanks in my life time, I knew nothing and was just really amazingly lucky. After moving up here and starting a tank a few times and ending in utter failure have I learned I know nothing. I have learned that MOST the people at the Big Box LFS know almost as much as me. I have learned that living in an area with very hard water with a high ph coming out of the tap makes for a lot more work. I didn't know how important testing was for more than just ammonia, I didn't know about doing a fishless cycle. My tank now, I have a 40 gal I have had no luck with due to lack of knowledge. It had been empty for over a year decided to try again. Filled it ran it for over a month. Thought it would be enough. Went to BB LFS got some neons. I know cichlids do better at high ph but kind of expensive starters. I got 6 neons. All died but one. Not surprised, since then I've found this site which in my opinion gives the best info on the relation between water hardness, ph, and ammonia. I have also found a LFS that is not a Big Box chain store. So toughing it through the ammonia cycle and the daily water changes is one lone neon who I think deserves a name for sticking out in hard water w/ high ph and and to much ammonia.

 

[Baccus]

G'day and Welcome 

  to the forum, it is a tough learning curve finding out about water quality and components and then matching what you have to fish that you like. But you have found a great site to help you with all the problems a tank or fish can throw in your direction.
 
And I think your one Neon tetra needs a name like SOLO or HERO.

 
Best of luck with your cycle and keep us posted

 

[BerryAttack]

welcome!
if you have very hard water out of the tap then you can always but the water jugs.. test that and see what it is like.. that's what i use for my aquarium (also a 40 gallon) and never had any issues with it.
 
with the cycling, when your done you stop adding ammonia in it because its not needed... do a water change.. treat the water before adding it in and then add it in... 
you can also have live plants.. that'll help the water.. but then your going into the lighting stuff like that.
 
and also your neon is a schooling fish.. ha so you'll need to get more later on

 

[cpwebsite]

To start, I recommend getting cardinal tetras versus neon's, cardinal tetras seem to be more stable. In my opinion your water hardness/ph isn't as important for the average fish as long as you make sure to keep it stable. I can keep lower pH fish fine in my higher pH water, but I work to keep my water very stable. Regular water changes are good for this. Have you bought a liquid test kit yet? Those are an absolute must. How's your ammonia cycle going, are you waiting it out. If so don't add fish fast afterwords because an neon tetra has a low bioload so there won't be that much bacteria. Do you have live plants in your tank? I highly recommend live plants for any tank!

 

[SushiAk49]

Went to the LFS that is only a fish store and they set me up with some starter plants that do not need anything special. I'm not adding any ammonia to the tank, never have. They finally got the master API test kits in so got one of those. The water is starting to clear a bit. My hubby named the neon Titan. If he survives this mess till tank is stable I should get him some friends but there in lies the dilemma, get more neons that may go into shock and just die due to water thats opposite what they like or leave him the lone neon w/ some other type of fish? What to do what to do?

I should also note the substrate is from previous fish tank attempt with out a lot of cleaning I thought it may have enough organics in it to get things started so the tank ran fish less for two months, but the heater died in the beginning of that and replaced it just before I got the fish. The water may have just been too cold for it to redevelop a good bio filter maybe during two month time?

 

[TallTree01]

Hi sushi,

If Titan survives the cycle I think the best thing to do would be to return him to the fish shop. The cycle will proceed regardless of water temp BUT you can't just put old substrate in and expect that to cycle a tank. The good bacteria have most likely all died without an ammonia source like fish or food or pure ammonia.

 

[SushiAk49]

Again, possibly bad advice could have been the problem. Was told by Big Box LFS to set up both kinds of filers when I first got this tank. So now I found something that said do not use under gravel filter w/ HOB or HIT filter, it causes the fish waist to be compacted to the bottom under substrate. This was an old tank, I didn't change or wash substrait before setting up because thought anything left over from last time would help produce ammonia after it ran a bit and decomposed more. I did vacuum it some. So I thought, after I read about it maybe there was a bunch of muck under that. So i removed the UGF. Oh yeah, there was, lots and lots of gunk trapped under the under gravel screen under the substrate. So I took that out. So now every day giving the gravel a bit of cleaning till ammonia drops so far both my N's are registering as nill on the testing.

And Titan is still alive.

 

[This Old Spouse]

Poor Titan ... what a trooper! Do you know anyone else with an established tank? Or maybe the private LFS, that could donate some mature filter media to you? If you can get enough to supply your 40g tank it would be cycled almost immediately.

 

[SushiAk49]

Good idea ill ask around.

 

[SushiAk49]

So far I'm still having prob w/ my cycling. My ammonia is still though the roof my nitrites and nitrates remain at 0 every time I test. Doing 25% every other day min. I have live plants. I have lots of algae, and now, I think because of the plants, I have snails. I have not added any additional fish. Ideas? The first fish ( six neons at first ) were first introduced about 3 maybe closer to 4 weeks ago. Then they all died but that one whose still alive and I only feed him every three days. Over feeding was a serious problem when the tank was set up before, before it sat fish less for at least a year, because of my husband. Heck I still get tons of stuff every time I vac the gravel now.

 

[This Old Spouse]

If you're having that much trouble with ammonia you should be doing daily water changes, probably at least 50%. If you're still getting tons of stuff when you vacuum, that's poo and uneaten food, which is contributing to the ammonia problem.

 

[SushiAk49]

I do water changes as often as I have time for. And yes I know there is a lot of old food and stuff in the gravel from the last time I had the tank up and running. As I mentioned I didn't clean the gravel that well before restarting tank figuring it would provide the ammonia. But the question is why are the nitrites and nitrates remaining 0? Are the snails a bonus or are they slowing things down?

 

[the_lock_man]

I would say that you aren't seeing a reduction in ammonia, and an increase in nitrite, because you haven't got any bacteria to do so. And ammonia levels that are too high inhibit bacterial growth.
 
I'd suggest you do enough of a water change(s) to get that level right down to 0-0.25ppm, and keep doing the changes to keep it at that level. Your filter will still cycle with ammonia that low, but a fish-in cycle does take time and effort.

 

[SushiAk49]

So after weeks of water changes with NO improvement .....Ammo Chips. I was doing min 30% water changes every day and if I couldn't do one I did 50% the next day. No improvement none. Came across the ammo chips and thought... At this point what could it hurt. Little ammonia wonder sponges! Ammonia isn't perfect yet but rapidly improving, andTitan was lonely. He's a schooling fish he needs buddies so sent the hubby to LFS to bring him some of his own kids as I was at work. He's being a bulley! To much time alone? He's nipping tail fins. I risk getting him biddies and he torments them. Hes got a jaws complex or something.

 

[TallTree01]

He's probably become one of those battle hardened warriors after waging war in a toxinous wasteland. Now the warrior is fighting to defend his toxinous wasteland. Honestly I don't think the ammo chips will do much good in the long run.