Cycle In A Bucket Log

[Overload]

Ok, so as some of you may have read my 300 liter Seabray Dolphin cracked when I was filling it prior to starting to cycle it.

As a result I have been running my filter in a 50 liter storage box since sunday, dosed with ammonia.

I have just changed the water in the storage box, and I am going to cycle the media in my filter using this untill I fix or replace the tank.

Equipment list:
50 Liter storage box (acting tank)
Eagle Aquatic HW-304 filter with mature media and additional fuval bio max ceramic rings
Fluval E300 heater (set to 30C)
API Master Test kit
Declorinator - Aquacare water conditioner
Ammonia - Boots household ammonia

Tap Water stats:
GH 14
KH 14
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0-0.25
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 40

Time and Date~~~~PH~Ammo~NO2~NO3~~~Notes
20:30 31/08/2011 ~ 7.8 ~~ 4 ~~~~ 2 ~~ 80 ~ Ammonia left in filter water after change not dosed
19:00 01/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 2 ~~~~ ~ ~~ ~~ ~
17:50 02/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0.25 ~~ 5 ~~ ~~ ~ Dosed with 1.2ml Ammonia, rechecked result 2ppm
18:00 03/09/2011 ~ 8~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 5 ~~ 20 ~ Dosed with 1.2ml Ammonia
18:00 04/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 2 ~~ ~~ ~ Dosed with 1.2ml Ammonia
18:00 05/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 2 ~~ ~~ ~ Dosed with 1.2ml Ammonia
19:00 06/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 2 ~~ ~~ ~ Dosed with 1.2ml Ammomia
18:00 07/09/2011 ~ 8.2 ~~ 0 ~~~ 0.25 ~ 80 ~ Dosed with 2ml Ammonia (aprox 3ppm)
18:00 08/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 0 ~~ ~~ ~ Dosed with 2.6ml Ammonia (5ppm)
17:45 09/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 0 ~~ ~~ ~ Dosed with 2.6ml Ammonia
06:00 10/09/2011 ~ ~~ ~~ 0 ~~~~ 2 ~~ ~~ ~

 

[waterdrop]

It takes so long for the bacteria to get through the first stages that it won't matter that the volume is smaller, at least for quite a few weeks probably. In the long run though, volume does ultimately matter since you are setting the ammonia concentration for a particular volume to create colonies that are robust enough to then drop down to the level needed for a full stocking of a particular volume. (So, for example, fully qualifying the filter for the 50L box would only set it up for about 1/6 of the bioload the 300L tank could handle.)

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Overload]

It takes so long for the bacteria to get through the first stages that it won't matter that the volume is smaller, at least for quite a few weeks probably. In the long run though, volume does ultimately matter since you are setting the ammonia concentration for a particular volume to create colonies that are robust enough to then drop down to the level needed for a full stocking of a particular volume. (So, for example, fully qualifying the filter for the 50L box would only set it up for about 1/6 of the bioload the 300L tank could handle.)

~~waterdrop~~

I am hoping to switch the setup over to a full size tank in the next couple of weeks so hopefully that wont be an issue, but there is a fair bit of mature media in there thanks to Aqua_Tom and Whitey_144. But if there was a major delay I had considered when reaching the qualifying week building up an overdose to compensate.

e.g. when it can process 4-5ppm in 12 hours start dosing at about 6, then 7 etc until it was handling the same volume of ammonia as the larger tank in 12 hours, all be it more concentrated. Is this likely to work or just cause problems with very high ammonia concentrations?

 

[Miles_hot]

The "overdose" you suggest is the wrong way to expand beyond the actual capacity of the bucket to mimic the bigger tank. If you take the ppm above 5 or so you risk eithe retarding the bacteria growth or possibly encouraging the wrong sort of bacteria (depends what you read up on).

The better (correct?) method is to increase the frequency of the dosing. My thinking is thus:
Assuming your buckt is x and your tank is 10x in volume.
To raise x to 5ppm takes Y ml of ammonia.
The buket is considered cycled when it can process Yml of ammonia in 12 hours (and then has a 12 hour "rest" period)
Your tank at 10x would need to process 10Y ml of ammonia in the same 12 hour period.
To mimic the behavour of the 10x tank with a bucket of x you need to see the bucket process y ml of ammonia in 1.2 hours, thus you would dose to y ml, wait 1.2 hours, test, leave it 1.2 hours, dose with y ml and repeat. Thus over the 24 hour period your tank wouldd have processed 10Y ammonia and also had 12 hours "rest" time.

Obviously with a 10 times difference this is unrealistic (unless you're able to automate!) however you get the idea

Miles

 

[Overload]

The "overdose" you suggest is the wrong way to expand beyond the actual capacity of the bucket to mimic the bigger tank. If you take the ppm above 5 or so you risk eithe retarding the bacteria growth or possibly encouraging the wrong sort of bacteria (depends what you read up on).

The better (correct?) method is to increase the frequency of the dosing. My thinking is thus:
Assuming your buckt is x and your tank is 10x in volume.
To raise x to 5ppm takes Y ml of ammonia.
The buket is considered cycled when it can process Yml of ammonia in 12 hours (and then has a 12 hour "rest" period)
Your tank at 10x would need to process 10Y ml of ammonia in the same 12 hour period.
To mimic the behavour of the 10x tank with a bucket of x you need to see the bucket process y ml of ammonia in 1.2 hours, thus you would dose to y ml, wait 1.2 hours, test, leave it 1.2 hours, dose with y ml and repeat. Thus over the 24 hour period your tank wouldd have processed 10Y ammonia and also had 12 hours "rest" time.

Obviously with a 10 times difference this is unrealistic (unless you're able to automate!) however you get the idea

Miles

Thanks Miles, I see where you are going with that, if I don't have a proper tank sorted in time I will see how viable that is

 

[Overload]

Day 2, just updated stats for ammonia, down to 2ppm in less than 24 hours

 

[HayzH]

Day 2, just updated stats for ammonia, down to 2ppm in less than 24 hours

Jelous??? Me??? YES!

 

[Overload]

Day 2, just updated stats for ammonia, down to 2ppm in less than 24 hours

Jelous??? Me??? YES!

lol don't be,

I have a good chunk of mature media in there, maybe see if there are any other members in sunny Devon that can donate some to you?

 

[HayzH]

Day 2, just updated stats for ammonia, down to 2ppm in less than 24 hours

Jelous??? Me??? YES!

lol don't be,

I have a good chunk of mature media in there, maybe see if there are any other members in sunny Devon that can donate some to you?

ive asked in loads of places...nothing

 

[Overload]

Day 2, just updated stats for ammonia, down to 2ppm in less than 24 hours

Jelous??? Me??? YES!

lol don't be,

I have a good chunk of mature media in there, maybe see if there are any other members in sunny Devon that can donate some to you?

ive asked in loads of places...nothing

That sucks, I got mine from a couple of people on here. Maybe start a thread asking for some?

 

[Overload]

Updated for day 3, looking good so far

 

[Overload]

Update for day 4

Now clearing 2ppm of ammonia in 24 hours, and though Nitrite still 5 was a bit lighter, so looks like progress being made.

One puzzeling thing, the Nitrate has dropped

 

[Overload]

One other thing, how clear is the log?

I am thinking of using the same format for the proper tank when that gets going?

 

[Overload]

Day 5 and no change.

Hopefully nitrite will drop again tomorrow, if not will do a full set of tests see if PH or nitrate has changed

 

[Aqua Tom]

Day 2, just updated stats for ammonia, down to 2ppm in less than 24 hours

Jelous??? Me??? YES!

lol don't be,

I have a good chunk of mature media in there, maybe see if there are any other members in sunny Devon that can donate some to you?

ive asked in loads of places...nothing

That sucks, I got mine from a couple of people on here. Maybe start a thread asking for some?

Maybe you need to be willing to travel a little further. Overload made a 30 min train ride to get his media from me, (thats dedication).



The bucket cycle looks like it is going well.


Tom