Could I Cycle This Way?

[Alz1992]

I'm getting my tank tommorow, 24" by 12" by 18", so pretty small, and i was wondering if i could cycle by adding tetra safe start AND fish food without the actual fish (the food to generate ammonia for the safe start to chow down on etc etc, i wouldn't want to use fish with any cycle regardless of what the bottle says :\)

Would this be okay?

(First post after lurking on the forums )

 

[brian2708]

You're better off getting some household ammonia, some pippets to measure how much you're putting in and a good reagent based water test kit.

Where abouts are you? If you're in the UK, ammonia can be sourced at homebase or boots.

 

[Tizer]

I wouldnt really recommend it, you really have no way of knowing how much ammonia fish food with put out.

I would lurk some more on the beginners resource section and follow a method people can actually help you on should you get stuck, rather than a random idea (although yes, i do see the logic)

 

[The Taffy Apple]

I wouldnt really recommend it, you really have no way of knowing how much ammonia fish food with put out.

I would lurk some more on the beginners resource section and follow a method people can actually help you on should you get stuck, rather than a random idea (although yes, i do see the logic)

Afternoon Alz.... i started using fish flake once a day BEFORE i wised up and used the household ammonia method, this too was in a relatively small (30L) tank..

I really would consider one of 2 things.. A/ Research the fishless Nitrogen cycle method using the household ammonia... or B/ Start adding a little flake daily, mimic the pattern of maybe half a dozen Tetra, THEN get stuck into the science bit of it all... which, believe me, can be fascinationg !!!

I still can't find any related article regarding safe start, ultra-start, etc or any other filter 'boosting' product, maybe swerve that idea..but do you know anyone who has kept tropical fish for any period of time, as there's always another simple option...

Regards,
Terry.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I used Tetra safestart and it doesn't really do anything. (See my log in the Bacterial Additives thread.) I did everything that you are supposed to do to help the bacteria grow... I used surface agitation and over filtration to increase oxygenation, I increased the temp to 84F, I upped the pH with baking soda to 8.4. I am on Day 25, and Day 2 of the "qualifying week". If I were you (and I was a month ago), I'd spend the money on the household ammonia (Ace Hardware in the U.S. or Boots in the UK) and just do a regular fishless cycle. The truth is that these products just don't seem to do anything. My cycle has been on the shorter side, so maybe they did a little something, but I can't really say that they are all that effective, and certainly don't do as much as they claim.

If you are really in a hurry to speed up the process, the most effective way is to get ahold of some mature media. Use this to seed your filter. Short of that angelsplus.com in the US sells "Active Filter Sponges" these are essentially "mature media". There are multiple ways to use them. Either just use them as they are designed with an air pump, or you could cut them up and put them into your filter. Either way, that money would be better spent on getting mature media and ammonia (or just ammonia and patience) rather than the additive.


I'm sorry to say, they just don't work as advertised.

 

[Tizer]

heh, so you are whistling a different tune now to a few weeks ago, shame really, it would be nice to see a working bottled product one day.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

heh, so you are whistling a different tune now to a few weeks ago, shame really, it would be nice to see a working bottled product one day.

The tune earlier was that I didn't know... now I know. As I said in that thread, until the research being done on these bacteria actually produces a product that can be used by anyone without a great deal of knowledge, they are worthless. Basically, they need to be as effective as mature media. It still won't be perfect, but it will be far more effective than what is on the market right now....unfortunately. If LFS were smart, they would be selling mature media to newbies, just like angelsplus, and then more people would stay in the hobby. Personally, I think the profit margin for a properly working mature filter media product that they can produce themselves from any of the many tanks they have would be far more effective (and honest) than what they are currently doing with these other products.



(As you showed with your fish-in cycle with mature media) The process shouldn't take that long. But with these products, fish are dying, ammonia levels are high, etc. And we see the evidence on this board with those types of threads.

 

[Tizer]

oh aye agreed, trouble is i dont really see and end to it either Even selling mature media to 'joe bloggs' isnt really going to help, 90% of them wont have a clue what you just told them or forget on the way home anyway

It would be far more helpful if the shops gave out a leaflet, free of charge with the basics on it.

 

[Smells a bit fishy]

Dont use any bacteria. There is a thread on here eagle is they guys same using it. It doesn't work. A total waste of money. Grab some household ammonia and start fish-lesscyclying that way. It's the easiest and quickest way of cycling a tank.

Crank the the temp up to 29-30 and get the ph between 8-8.4

 

[fluttermoth]

I'd just like to say my lacal MA (in Plymouth) sells mature media for a penny a portion, so it can be done.

I don't see why we can't have a leaflet and some media!

 

[StandbySetting]

Personally I feel that the quickest way to cycle a tank is to add some mature media and then proceed with your fishless cycle, that should improve the rate quite considerably.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I agree with fluttermoth and SBS. Media and know-how would make the most sense.


I think a business model that would make the most sense, would be for a section of the store to be devoted completely to "newbies". It should include free literature about the nitrogen cycle, fish-in and fishless cycling guides, as well as a troubleshooting tips. I would think that a "start-up" kit could easily be sold to newbies (just as easily as selling a bottle of dead bacteria) that includes an instruction guide for use, a small bottle of ammonia and a fresh piece of filter media taken from a tank. The ammonia wouldn't cost much more than the cost of the bottle itself. The filter media would also be very cheap. Finally, the pamphlet would be ridiculously cheap. All this could be sold (and produced by the LFS) and could be sold for the same price or less than the bacteria additives and would be far more effective.

I believe most folks would be able to figure out what to do if they were given a little guidance. Maybe that's just the teacher in me speaking, but I think that people have a tremendous capacity for learning when they are motivated and when given the right information.

 

[Tizer]

Sounds like you found a gap in the market, gluck with it!

 

[Smells a bit fishy]

I agree with fluttermoth and SBS. Media and know-how would make the most sense.


I think a business model that would make the most sense, would be for a section of the store to be devoted completely to "newbies". It should include free literature about the nitrogen cycle, fish-in and fishless cycling guides, as well as a troubleshooting tips. I would think that a "start-up" kit could easily be sold to newbies (just as easily as selling a bottle of dead bacteria) that includes an instruction guide for use, a small bottle of ammonia and a fresh piece of filter media taken from a tank. The ammonia wouldn't cost much more than the cost of the bottle itself. The filter media would also be very cheap. Finally, the pamphlet would be ridiculously cheap. All this could be sold (and produced by the LFS) and could be sold for the same price or less than the bacteria additives and would be far more effective.

I believe most folks would be able to figure out what to do if they were given a little guidance. Maybe that's just the teacher in me speaking, but I think that people have a tremendous capacity for learning when they are motivated and when given the right information.

Where abouts do you live eagle? In the uk? Maybe we could bang heads together

 

[fluttermoth]

I agree with fluttermoth and SBS. Media and know-how would make the most sense.


I think a business model that would make the most sense, would be for a section of the store to be devoted completely to "newbies". It should include free literature about the nitrogen cycle, fish-in and fishless cycling guides, as well as a troubleshooting tips. I would think that a "start-up" kit could easily be sold to newbies (just as easily as selling a bottle of dead bacteria) that includes an instruction guide for use, a small bottle of ammonia and a fresh piece of filter media taken from a tank. The ammonia wouldn't cost much more than the cost of the bottle itself. The filter media would also be very cheap. Finally, the pamphlet would be ridiculously cheap. All this could be sold (and produced by the LFS) and could be sold for the same price or less than the bacteria additives and would be far more effective.

I believe most folks would be able to figure out what to do if they were given a little guidance. Maybe that's just the teacher in me speaking, but I think that people have a tremendous capacity for learning when they are motivated and when given the right information.

Where abouts do you live eagle? In the uk? Maybe we could bang heads together

If you could persuade the manufacturers to add a little preset heater to those starter kits as well, so people could have a few Endlers, small tetras or a Siamese fighter or something instead of goldfish everyone would be much happier!