Ceramic Rings

[waterdrop]

What is the thinking behind those little ceramic rings as a type of media for one of the filter baskets?

I've been trying think this through. A sponge with larger holes would seem to catch more large particles. A sponge with smaller holes would seem to have more surface area for bacteria anchoring.

Is the ceramic somehow a much better surface for bacteria?

The only thing I can think of is that perhaps the rings can somehow continue catching particulate matter but not get as clogged up and thus help to maintain throughput in the filter. Is that it?

Is it that the ceramic is virtually indestructable, lasts longer? Seems like some types of synthetic sponges are really tough and last a long time but maybe long-lasting is one of the desirable attributes of the rings?

waterdrop

 

[Spooky76]

Spot on. Depends what filter you have and how large etc. I have 3 filters in my large tank. My eheim DID have the ceramic rings but I changed them to eheim substrate pro. Same thing really. Its about the surface area and type. The bacteria colonise better on them than sponges and yes they last forever. Every 3/4 months I take out the trays, put them in my water ive taken out the tank and dunk them to release some of the crud. They will get clogged up just like anything else.

I have a sponge on top of the trays which I can replace, but thats more mechanical than biological. My other 2 filters are just mechanical, more to clean the water. Although in effect everything is biological in the sense bacteria grows on them, but I clean them to make them run more efficiently. Again though, only ever clean your sponges in the tank water you take out for weekly maintenance.

EDIT : Spelling

 

[waterdrop]

ok, thanks spooky,

"The bacteria colonise better on them than sponges and yes they last forever."

that's interesting, first time I've heard someone say the bacteria colonise better on ceramic than sponge -- maybe I've just picked up the wrong idea about sponge and most aquarists think of it as more for mechanical cleaning than for the colonies.

Have I wandered into one of those areas where you hear different opinions or is there an established "pecking order" for highest to lowest bacterial colony promotor substrate?

(remember, I'm just new and dreaming this stuff up as I try to picture why I would choose what filter and media, I'm not coming from knowing much!)

-waterdrop-

 

[Davo86]

I would agree with what has already been said, I use the ceramic media as the majority media in my external filters, along with a small amount of polyester sponge, The Ceramic media is great for catching larger pieces of debri and is were most of the bacteria is grown IMO.
I use the sponge media purely to catch finer particles that have found their way through the ceramic media.

 

[Spooky76]

lol - the idea is they dont clog up like a sponge, so therefore they dont need cleaning as much, but they also have a large surface area.

The little balls are the same idea, but are pitted and that makes it good.....i think it all depends what you want. Personally I would always go for an external biological filter (Balls rings etc with small fine pad also) and then a mechnical internal filter like the aquaball or fluval.

I think you will always hear different opinions everywhere. Lfs tell you what they want to sell or stock mostly I find. People on here talk from experience and have nothing to gain from telling porkys.

This is the best forum around for good advice and there are lots of people with lots of experience.

 

[pauly]

They're also used to distribute the water through the filter more evenly rather than the water just passing through the centre of each of the other filter mediums.

Paul.

 

[waterdrop]

They're also used to distribute the water through the filter more evenly rather than the water just passing through the centre of each of the other filter mediums.

Paul.

Oh that's interesting. I hadn't thought of that but it makes sense. The hard rings would easily distribute the water out more evenly across the entire media basket. It makes sense to me that that would help the filter maintain a higher flow rate for a longer period as you move toward saturation with debris.

 

[Chrispixx]

Everyones Hyped up on "ceramic" media. Seachem Matrix is a far better bio-media. Seachem Link

 

[waterdrop]

Everyones Hyped up on "ceramic" media. Seachem Matrix is a far better bio-media. Seachem Link

Thanks, interesting! It says you can use it without a bag, do you use it that way?

 

[backtotropical]

I am going to have to disagree. The bacteria will colonise on any surface they can. Just because you put a sponge in your filter for mechanical filtration and ceramic rings for biological filtration, doesn't mean it will happen that way. The bacteria don't know where you want them to grow after all. In this case the bacteria will colonise both types of media unless specific steps are taken by the aquarist to prevent this from happening.

That said, i don't think you can say ceramic rings are better for biological filtration. The only factors which need to be taken into account when deciding which media is best for biological filtration is the flow of water through the media and the overall surface area which is available to the bacteria. I would think that a sponge wins on both counts.

I agree that the sponge is better for mechanical filtration as obviously it will catch more detritus and smaller particles which ceramic rings may not, but that doesn't necessarily mean that ceramic rings are better for boilogical filtration.

That's my cat amongst the pigeons.

Cheers

BTT

 

[CFC]

Sponges are more popular and better known for one reason, they are cheap.

Ceramic media like Efi substrat pro, ceramic rings and alfagrog provide more surface area per square inch than sponge and are less prone to "tunneling" where the water will find the path of least resistance through a substance and therefore having little to no contact with the rest of it, sponges unless cleaned on a strict regular basis are very prone to tunneling due to the nature of the material.

 

[OohFeeshy]

I can't comment on SA because I can't be bothered to look for the SA of sponge vs ceramic (anyone?). However, the obvious advantage of maintaining the main bacterial colony on ceramic is that you can happily wash/change the sponge when required with less of an effect on the filter and much more easily. When you rinse a sponge, even in tankwater you're going to loose bacteria, and it's quite a kerfuffle to have to chop up your media if it needs replacing. Much in the way that floss is only mechanical because it clogs up quickly and it's a bit of a waste of time rinsing it, the same is true in a lesser degree for sponge.

 

[waterdrop]

backtotropical,

OK, this makes a lot of sense, at least given the small amount of information I am working from. Casual observation would seem to say that bacteria might not be particularly picky about what structural substrate to attach themselves to. OTOH, maybe they are (!) .. actually, when I think about it, this brings up another newbie type question.. do we ever really see the bacterial colonies visually?? Assuming we are not looking at debris, when we are looking at darkened filter media are we seeing brown algae?? What is slime? (I know, SLIME is SLIME, but I'm being serious here, ha!) I've read posts referring to that clear/brown slippery coating one feels on aquarium internals (glass/tubing etc.) ... is there really a separate thing properly referred to as slime that is -not- algae??

So back to the the main topic here that I'm ignorant about... Do the 2 or three families of beneficial bacteria that aquarists want to cultivate in their biological filters have preferences about their structural home? Well, and of course then the next thought is whether any different preferences would be -significant- or not. If not, then the sponges might be just as good, but if they like slick, hard surfaces then the ceramic might be better.

(lol, you can see why I'm not yet getting to the stage of adding my first water yet.. but learning new stuff is at least half the fun)

Sigh, -waterdrop-
ps. today I've just finished a string of phone calls trying to figure out why the Pro I series of Eheim filters seems non-existant in America.. all the suppliers seem to have the classic line, the ecco line and then jump to the Pro II line. The sales people are almost universally clueless. I'm beginning to think the Pro I series is reserved for Britain! (eek, I'm off-topic)

 

[rabbut]

Just to add my bit;

Sponge cloggs more easily, but also, IMO is easier to clean and manage in teh filter. Also channeling is more common in the sponge. Ceramic takes literaly 10 times longer to clogg, but can be aquard to remove all the built up waste. Also, while out of the filter, it would apear to me that sponge stays damp longer, thus you have more time to play with the pump, if needs be, before you start having issues with the media becoming too dry.

All in all, I prefur sponge, where the filter is easy to access and clean. However, in low maintanance systems, where you don't want as much clogging, ceramic is probibly your best bet However, this may be something that is down to personal preference.

HTH
Rabbut

 

[Chrispixx]

Everyones Hyped up on "ceramic" media. Seachem Matrix is a far better bio-media. Seachem Link

Thanks, interesting! It says you can use it without a bag, do you use it that way?

I use it both ways..i have it in a cannister, and i have it in a bag in an Aqua Clear HOB filter.