Brand New Tank Set Up Questions

[ammartini]

About 4 weeks ago my hubby bought a Juwel Aquarium (I think it is the 800 - does that refer to litres?)

We set up the filters, added gravel and filled it with water - we put in both plastic and live plants and set the temperature to 27/8 degrees. Then, as the LFS advised us we waited for the tank to 'mature' without fish.

Today my hubby took a sample of the water to the LFS and they said it was OK for him to buy some fish. He bought 6 Zebra Danios, which look lovely, and 2 Apple Snails.

Before adding the fish he did a quick tank inspection and as one of the plants in the tank looked like it had collapsed he took it out. It disintegrated in the process and took out as much of the debris as he could.

He added the fish as advised by letting the bag float for 15 mins and then adding a little tank water at 5 min intervals until the fish escaped!

Questions:

1) I thought the tank woud be ready but reading a little on here it looks like we should have added ammonia to the water to start the 'cycling'. Does this mean that the tank is now only just starting to cycle?

2) Will the Danios start the cycling process or is it already finished?

3) How often do I need to check the levels? Can I do this myself?

4) One of the Zebra Danios does not has stripes, it is slightly spotty instead. It does look a little smaller than the others. Is this marking to do with age? Or is it an odd one?

5) The snails do not seem to have moved at all. Should I check them or leave them 24 hrs. My hubby doesn't remember seeing them being selected in the shop or moving at all so he has not been very helpful! Is this usual? Would they die so quickly?

6) I spotted two very little snails - they are very quick too! I thought I would leave them for now as I have no idea what sort they are and they add a little interest. However, should I be worried about them? They are no bigger than an apple pip and although I can't guarantee it, I think they may have been introduced today!

Any help would be appreciated - if I have not given enough detail I will be happy to let you know what I can!

x Ammartini

 

[drobbyb]

1. Yes the LFS mislead you. It will start the cycle as soon as there is an ammonia source.

2. Yes they will start the cycke,

3. Daily while you are in your cycle.

4. Sounds like a leapord danio got in the mix. This is common.

5. Sounds like something is definitaley wrong.

6. Those could be "volunteer" snails. "Volunteer" snails could have come in from the garden, on plants, etc.

 

[jmkgreen]

About 4 weeks ago my hubby bought a Juwel Aquarium (I think it is the 800 - does that refer to litres?)

No, according to a Google search your aquarium holds at most 110 litres (24 UK Gallons, 29 US Gallons).

We set up the filters, added gravel and filled it with water - we put in both plastic and live plants and set the temperature to 27/8 degrees. Then, as the LFS advised us we waited for the tank to 'mature' without fish.

By maturing they mean that the filter material (the sponges in the black box inside the tank) develops bacteria that consumes the pollutants. However, without something "generating" the pollutants the bacteria cannot develop.

Today my hubby took a sample of the water to the LFS and they said it was OK for him to buy some fish. He bought 6 Zebra Danios, which look lovely, and 2 Apple Snails.

Danios are extremely common as a first fish - cheap, easy to source, and hardy. They will expel pollutants for the bacteria to feed on.

He added the fish as advised by letting the bag float for 15 mins and then adding a little tank water at 5 min intervals until the fish escaped!

Typically you should take care not to allow the water in the bag to get into your own tank as its contents may be harmful. Some ignore this advice without too many ill effects.

1) I thought the tank woud be ready but reading a little on here it looks like we should have added ammonia to the water to start the 'cycling'. Does this mean that the tank is now only just starting to cycle?

You don't need to add ammonia directly - but something that generates it. You may find cheaper to add frozen prawns from a supermarket. Just put it in a stocking to contain the major bits. DO NOT do this with any fish in the tank!

2) Will the Danios start the cycling process or is it already finished?

It's just begun

3) How often do I need to check the levels? Can I do this myself?

Until it is stable at acceptable levels you should perform water changes at least once, perhaps twice daily. Ouch I know, but the Danios aren't enjoying themselves either.

Get yourself an API freshwater test kit - not the test strips.

6) I spotted two very little snails - they are very quick too! I thought I would leave them for now as I have no idea what sort they are and they add a little interest. However, should I be worried about them? They are no bigger than an apple pip and although I can't guarantee it, I think they may have been introduced today!

They may have disease but it's a bit late to worry now. In future, ensure you check and wash your plants before you add them to the tank.

 

[ammartini]

Thanks! I have now seen one of the Apple snails 'peep' out. It is clearly alive but I'm not sure about the other one, hubby is worried but I am hoping it is just shy!

Back to the original questions.

2) Do you think that the dying plant could have triggered the cycling? lFS said when they tested the water the tank was 'ready' apparently. Hubby said they tested bacteria levels aswell as other stuff, again not sure exactly what they actually read levels to be.

3) How do I measure the levels? Or more correctly what does hubby need to purchase to do this?

4) Yep, googled for images and quite obviously a Leopard Danio. My daughter can see it is different and has called it Mary-Kate!

6) The 'volunteers' are more than happy! One has travelled the length and breadth of the tank and the other has gone to ground.

New Question:

7) In the tank there is a piece of wood (Maparne I think) this looks like it is a little furry, could this be algae? The fish seem happy to nibble at it and I have now located the other volunteer snail who looks like he is grazing!

Oh and hubby assured me that the water from the LFS did not get into the tank, though I'm not sure how he managed it!

Thanks

 

[waterdrop]

Hi ammartini and welcome to TFF!

2) Do you think that the dying plant could have triggered the cycling? lFS said when they tested the water the tank was 'ready' apparently. Hubby said they tested bacteria levels aswell as other stuff, again not sure exactly what they actually read levels to be.

>>> Plant debris is eventually turned into ammonia by heterotrophic bacteria. Its an uncontrolled process that's undesirable for fishless cycling. LFS is -always- "ready" where a sale is concerned. You can't test bacterial levels with a water sample. When having water tested for ammonia, nitrite(NO2) etc. at LFS, always insist on numerical results and make/model of test kit. Them saying levels are "fine" for instance, is useless.

3) How do I measure the levels? Or more correctly what does hubby need to purchase to do this?

>>> Most of us, including me, like and use the API Freshwater Master Test Kit. The Nutrafin Mini-Master Test Kit is also good if you can't find the API one. This may be all you need for a long time or you might end up also getting a GH/KH kit if your water turns out to be extremely soft.

6) The 'volunteers' are more than happy! One has travelled the length and breadth of the tank and the other has gone to ground.

>>> Many aquarists eventually find that "volunteer" snails begin to overtake their tank and at some point no longer look good, its best to begin maintaining at least a portion of them by removal to your garden. Don't put them in the indoor trash or they will crawl out. You can also crush some of them for your fish to eat.

7) In the tank there is a piece of wood (Maparne I think) this looks like it is a little furry, could this be algae? The fish seem happy to nibble at it and I have now located the other volunteer snail who looks like he is grazing!

This is normal and the fish will probably continue to nibble away at this.

Oh and hubby assured me that the water from the LFS did not get into the tank, though I'm not sure how he managed it!

>>> After the plastic bag has matched temp and you've done some adds of tank water to it over a half hour or so, you can pour the bag water and fish through a net and let the water go into a small container. Then put the netted fish in the tank, thus minimizing LFS water going into the tank. This might have been how he did it.

>>> You are in a "Fish-In" cycling situation which should not be taken lightly for the sake of the fish's lives. Read up in the Beginners Center and ask questions here. Its also great to read other threads about other people's cycles...

~~waterdrop~~

 

[K-Holed]

I suppose on the plus side, you didn't end up with neon tetras or an oscar as your first fish. If I had to chose a fish to do a fish in cycle with, danios would be somewhere at the top of my list. Of course, without fish at all seems to be the most popular choice on this forum but you have to make the most of the situation you're in as it stands.

 

[fatheadminnow]

Here is what waterdrop is referring to:

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=224306

It is VERY important that you read and understand this process, as this is how you are going to experience long years of happy fish keeping!

Also, in average, to cycle a tank it takes 4-6 weeks.

-FHM

 

[QuilliamUK]

About 4 weeks ago my hubby bought a Juwel Aquarium (I think it is the 800 - does that refer to litres?)

4 weeks isn't that long for the tank to mature naturally unless you add "Tapsafe" etc and other chemicals to stablise the water (depends on tank size). The bigger the tank, the type of water going in (soft or hard tap water) it all plays its part with the overall chemistry of the tank setup.

We set up the filters, added gravel and filled it with water - we put in both plastic and live plants and set the temperature to 27/8 degrees. Then, as the LFS advised us we waited for the tank to 'mature' without fish.

With you having real plants, have you put a "Subtrate" under the gravel? This is like a clay mixed with fertiliser for the real plants roots to bite into. When your plants mature they will look a lot healthier and grow much better. Your Temp is too high, drop it to 24 (ish) degrees. BIN THE PLASTIC PLANTS. They never look as good as the real thing. (see this website- www.thegreenmachineonline.com). Real plant specialists.

Today my hubby took a sample of the water to the LFS and they said it was OK for him to buy some fish. He bought 6 Zebra Danios, which look lovely, and 2 Apple Snails.

Most shops of fish suppliers will tell you that......cash in their pockets.

Before adding the fish he did a quick tank inspection and as one of the plants in the tank looked like it had collapsed he took it out. It disintegrated in the process and took out as much of the debris as he could.

Could be due to the lack of a "Subtrate", temp of the water, Ph levels, bad plant, who knows. I'll take a guess that is is "VALLIS SPIRALIS" (Tall grass that throws up a spiral strand). Looks nice along the back of the tank. It has a habbit of withering from the tip of the leaf and has been known to die in a week. Works well in low lighing tanks. A good one is called "Cabomba", Grows quite quickly in any light and absorbs amonia quite well too. It throws up tall strands and spreads well. Easy to maintain and prune. Do a 50% water change once every 2 weeks with real plants in.

He added the fish as advised by letting the bag float for 15 mins and then adding a little tank water at 5 min intervals until the fish escaped!

I give it 30 mins with the lights out, less stress for the fish. Never be in too much of a hurry to stock to tank as it can get costly when they keep kicking the bucket. Really look at what fish live well with each other. Don't let the shop tell you, research it first before hand.

Questions:

1) I thought the tank woud be ready but reading a little on here it looks like we should have added ammonia to the water to start the 'cycling'. Does this mean that the tank is now only just starting to cycle?

You want to get rid of ammonia not add it, burns the fish!!!

2) Will the Danios start the cycling process or is it already finished?

The more the fish eat and #### (pardon) generates more ammonia. Keep an even balance with regular water changes and don't over feed them. Look at diets of the fish. The cycling is never ending.

3) How often do I need to check the levels? Can I do this myself?

Do it before a water change I find, this will give you an idea of how good/ bad it is. Get a testing kit, they come with a colour chart and full instructions, you can't go wrong and you can prove the shop wrong if they fob you off!

4) One of the Zebra Danios does not has stripes, it is slightly spotty instead. It does look a little smaller than the others. Is this marking to do with age? Or is it an odd one?

Different fish looking at it!

5) The snails do not seem to have moved at all. Should I check them or leave them 24 hrs. My hubby doesn't remember seeing them being selected in the shop or moving at all so he has not been very helpful! Is this usual? Would they die so quickly?

I had a problem with snails, hundreds of the buggers!!! They will come into the tank as eggs in the roots of the real plants, hard to see. If you get at least 2 Zebra loach (botias) that will solve your snail problem, these fish love them. Mine ate at least 30 snails in a week!!! The snails will eat your real plants too. I hate them, I hate them, I hate them!!!! lol

6) I spotted two very little snails - they are very quick too! I thought I would leave them for now as I have no idea what sort they are and they add a little interest. However, should I be worried about them? They are no bigger than an apple pip and although I can't guarantee it, I think they may have been introduced today!

See above

Any help would be appreciated - if I have not given enough detail I will be happy to let you know what I can!

x Ammartini

 

[fatheadminnow]

About 4 weeks ago my hubby bought a Juwel Aquarium (I think it is the 800 - does that refer to litres?)

4 weeks isn't that long for the tank to mature naturally unless you add "Tapsafe" etc and other chemicals to stablise the water (depends on tank size). The bigger the tank, the type of water going in (soft or hard tap water) it all plays its part with the overall chemistry of the tank setup.

Wrong, a tank can fully cycle in 4 weeks, as the average for a tank to cycle is 4-6 weeks if done properly.
Also, 'Tapsafe' is a water conditioner, and what it does is dechlorinate the water so that the water is safe for fish and for the Autotrophic bacteria that colonize in our filters that process Ammonia and Nitrite.
Fully cycled tank = 4-6 weeks
A mature tank = 6+ months



Before adding the fish he did a quick tank inspection and as one of the plants in the tank looked like it had collapsed he took it out. It disintegrated in the process and took out as much of the debris as he could.

Could be due to the lack of a "Subtrate", temp of the water, Ph levels, bad plant, who knows. I'll take a guess that is is "VALLIS SPIRALIS" (Tall grass that throws up a spiral strand). Looks nice along the back of the tank. It has a habbit of withering from the tip of the leaf and has been known to die in a week. Works well in low lighing tanks. A good one is called "Cabomba", Grows quite quickly in any light and absorbs amonia quite well too. It throws up tall strands and spreads well. Easy to maintain and prune. Do a 50% water change once every 2 weeks with real plants in.

Most live plants when added to a new tank (environment) have to adapt to different water parameters, and when they do this some leafs die of, it is really common.

It can take up to 2 months for plants to fully adapt to a new tank.

Questions:

1) I thought the tank woud be ready but reading a little on here it looks like we should have added ammonia to the water to start the 'cycling'. Does this mean that the tank is now only just starting to cycle?

You want to get rid of ammonia not add it, burns the fish!!!

Adding Ammonia is what you do for a fishless cycle, but in your case you are in a fish-in cycle.

Any level of Ammonia over .25 ppm can give the fish permanent gill damage.

Any level of NitrIte over .25 ppm can give the fish permanent nerve damage.

2) Will the Danios start the cycling process or is it already finished?

The more the fish eat and #### (pardon) generates more ammonia. Keep an even balance with regular water changes and don't over feed them. Look at diets of the fish. The cycling is never ending.

This is true, but fish also produce the most amount of Ammonia when water passes through their gills.

3) How often do I need to check the levels? Can I do this myself?

Do it before a water change I find, this will give you an idea of how good/ bad it is. Get a testing kit, they come with a colour chart and full instructions, you can't go wrong and you can prove the shop wrong if they fob you off!

You are in a fish-in cycle, where you need to keep the Ammonia and NitrIte levels at or below .25 ppm.

You keep the levels in check by doing water changes, and you are going to need to do about 2-3 a day for a while, as it takes time for the Autotrophic bacteria to colonize enough in your filter to process Ammonia and NitrIte.

x Ammartini

I believe waterdrop has a very good write-up about what you need to do, as he already answered most of these questions.

Also, look at the link that I have provided for you in my other post.

-FHM