Bloated Angelfish & Other Problems....please Help!

[dpscholastic]

Hello,

First of all, I'd like to say that you all have a fantastic board. After reading it thoroughly for about an hour, I already feel as if I know so much more about caring for my tropical fish.

Here's my story -- hopefully some context for whomever is kind enough to help me out with some good advice.

I set up my 15 gallon freshwater tank back in May, and enjoyed a fairly established tank with some tetras, a pleco, and some other random fish for a few months before moving about 6 hours away. Naturally, I couldn't abandon the tank so I moved my whole operation with me, bagging each fish early on the morning of the big move, and driving to my new home.

Of course, the first thing I did was set up my tank. I even used Bio-Spira ( http/www.marineland.com/products/mllabs/ml_biospira.asp ), as recommended by the knowledgeable clerk at my specialty tropical/saltwater fish store, to expedite the cycling process and giving my little guys their best shot at surviving. Here's what I brought with me:

4 Tetras (2 neon, 2 glow-light)
1 Butterfly Pleco (small)
1 Bala Shark (about 2.5")
1 Brown Ghost (~5")
2 Koi Angelfish (3", and 2")
3 Japonic Shrimp

Furthermore, shortly before I moved-- around the time I added the Brown Ghost to the tank, he came down with a bad case of ICH. I had started treatment by removing the carbon from my filter, raising the tank temperature to 85 degrees, and 16 droplets of Aquari-Sol daily. It seemed to be working, then it came back, and so on. Just this weekend I came back to my tank [after the move] after three days away [leaving my roomate instructions on medicating and feeding the fish] to find nothing but a dry 2" spine, with a shrimp picking for any last scraps.

The Brown Ghost apparently died, and was completely consumed, probably within the last 24-48 hours.
None of the other fish in the tank appear to be affected by the ICH. Although I'll keep treating the tank for about a week to make sure I completely eradicate it, I'm wondering if perhaps it wasn't ICH, but was another similar fungus or parasite. I'm not sure, but I do remember being slightly thrown off at first because the spots on him where yellow(ish).

Big Problem #2

The larger of the Angelfish seems to have suffered some kind of intense stress, although he remains alive. Here's his story.

During the big move I bagged the two angels up together in larger bags-- which I actually got from my friend at the fish store-- with about 1.5-2 gallons of tank water. I didn't feed the fish about 36 hours prior to the move either-- a tip I picked up off a similar board-- to hopefully limit the amount of fish waste that would gather in the bags during the impending move. Anyway, as soon as I set up the tank at my new place (Bio-Spira, etc.) I noticed that the big angelfish (who we call "The Dude") appeared to have suffered a stroke. That's the only way I could describe it then-- exactly 11 days ago.

The Dude was swimming on his side, looking terribly stressed, slightly crooked in half, with one eye cloudier than the other. But he was swimming around. He appeared completely disoriented, and would swim in tight spiral shapes, upside down, before returning to the surface where he is almost constantly because of his condition.

I added some Aquarium Salt and a little API Stress Coat as treatment-- I honestly had no idea what to do. Also, please note that this whole time I have been treating for ICH. Another thing that may be worth noting is that when I set up the tank at the new place, the water temperature was considerable lower than the norm, and I had to add them quite quickly without proper acclimation time for the temperature. Again, they seemed to have toughed it out.

So back to The Dude. Now his eye seems to have cleared up. He is still floating on the surface, and has what seems to be a bloated stomach. The "air bubble" as I originally called it, seems to have grown in the last days since the move, and now exhibits four impressions along his underside between his ventral and anal fins. I'm not sure if it's actually scale protrusion--the best description I can give is that it looks like his ribs are sticking out.

He'll still swim around occasionally, but appears less anxious as he did a week ago. He now mostly just paddles his one submerged pectoral fin and floats on one side of the filter. I should also note that it always the same side that he is submerged on.

One last note (and this may have been a silly thing to do), during the big move I replaced my cheesy blue gravel with Flourite and planted it. This process, by the way, is a big pain in the ass. I had to rinse the Flourite relentlessly in order to cut my cloudy-tan period down to about 8 hours. That's right... to CUT IT DOWN to 8 hours. The plants look great, though, and have already grown and propagated noticeably since.

Here are my questions, although any general advice is greatly welcomed:

1.) What the heck do I do about my angelfish??
2.) Are the fish at a greater risk of contamination having eaten a dead fish?
3.) Should I keep treating for the ICH?

Man, I wish I had a digital camera!


Thank you so much for your help.

DP

 

[ICEEGRL]

I am far from the best person to really tell you what to do. I am still learning about these things, but no one else is saying anything. I will give you some suggestions that you can check into though. My first thought is dropsy. There may have been some shock from the sudden temp drop, and your tank is no where even close to big enough for what those fish need.
Did you add oxygen or anything to the bags when you sealed them?
Were they packed where the wouldn't slosh much?
Is the water stats much different from what they were in your old place?
How much cooler was the water they went into?
What are your water stats?
Are there any injuries, marks, or signs of infection that you can see besides being bent and bloated?
What exactly do you mean by looking terribly stressed?

I wish you had a camera too.

 

[-germ-]

1) Possibly osmoregulatory overload related dropsy due to the addition of salt, and the sudden change in conditions including substrate which I would assume causes a rapid climb in TDS = Bad. Keep water as stable as you can; no additions (maybe a small dose of anti-bac), no salt, just well maintained water.
If you have a hospital tank seperate the angel, it sounds as if there is also a fair possibilty that the problem could be bacterial.

2) Not sure, but if the problem was Ich it's so contagious i doubt it would have made an enormous difference.

3) Try researching Piscinoodinium (velvet) and see if this is closer to what you have encountered. Ich and velvet are both protozoans but Piscinoodinium is generally harder to detect, slower to take effect and harder to treat.

My q;
1)Did the knife fish display any flashing, scratching or flicking?

 

[jollysue]

I wondered about treating with Aquari-Sol since the protozoan is so established. I would go to the next level: Quick Cure or even Clout, perhaps CopperSafe, if it is available, if germ does indeed determine that it is a parasite. I use Aquari-Sol as a preventative for new fish, but if the parasite has taken hold I have moved to a stronger medication.