Bba Caused By Co2?

[benthyer]

So tonight just before I shut everything down on my tank for the night I noticed something on one of my Java Fern leafs and quickly realised it was BBA!

I don't know an awful lot about it but from what I have seen on forums etc it can be pretty devastating for plants and also an absolute nuisance to get rid of.

I began to wander what could've caused it as I have never had any issues with algae until quite recently but I believe that was because I was getting a bit heavy handed with the food and have managed tot myself back under control. Asides from that the only other difference is that I have now introduced CO2 into my tank via the DIY yeast method, I have sortie dived into this a bit too quick and should've done more research.

My bubble counter indicates that I am producing a just under a bubble a second and I let it run the whole time my lights are starting it about an hour before lights on where possible and stop it about an hour before lights off. Also due to the fact that I dived into this I am yet to receive my drop checker so can't monitor the CO2 levels but have kept an eye on my pH which is fine so far.

Do you believe that it is the CO2 that has caused BBA to appear in my tank and what can I do to get rid of it?

 

[SO19Firearms]

Generally low or fluctuating CO2 will induce BBA.
When you match up that with various causes you can start to pinpoint it.

Low CO2 might be too much light, too much flow, too little flow etc etc
Fluctuating CO2 might be power heads on timers, air pumps , pumps on timers, blocked filters etc etc
 

the only other difference is that I have now introduced CO2 into my tank via the DIY yeast method

That says fluctuating to me.....

James' Planted tank - algae guide - HTH

 

[daizeUK]

Agreed, my 120L is infested with BBA and it's due to low/fluctuating CO2 from my yeast setup.  I got lazy about replenishing the yeast reactors for a couple of weeks and the BBA instantly took advantage, now it's the devil's job getting rid of it.
 
It's definitely the yeast causing it.  I don't think that BBA is very common in non-CO2 injected tanks, but very common in CO2 setups.
 
How big is your tank, what sort of CO2 setup are you using (DIY or branded), how many reactor bottles, what's your recipe and how long are you letting it run for before refreshing?

 

[benthyer]

Thanks for the link SO19Firearms.
 
My tank is 115L with low lighting, I believe it's about 20W maybe a smidge more.
 
I started a DIY Yeast system on Saturday just gone so has only been running for about a week now. I used 250g of sugar and a sachet of yeast in about 1.75L of water. I think I am going to let it run for about two weeks before I refresh it and only have one reactor as I thought having two may produce too much CO2 but won't know about that until I get my drop checker. I plan on refreshing my reactor after I disconnect the CO2 for the night so that when I reconnect it int he morning before lights on it will be running at full capacity.
 
I am wandering whether or not I should have it running in the tank all night or not but worry to much about gassing the fish, but I do have an air stone that runs 24/7 and have lots of water agitation so may be ok.

 

[SO19Firearms]

I am wandering whether or not I should have it running in the tank all night or not but worry to much about gassing the fish, but I do have an air stone that runs 24/7 and have lots of water agitation so may be ok.

I'd lose the airstone - If you're think that's ok to off gas any excess CO2 during the night then it's doing the same during the day.
And by off gas, I do mean through movement - CO2 and O2 in the tank aren't much related (new planted tank ppl often tend to think that if you're adding CO2 you should add more "air" for the fish but it doesn't work like that luckily*)




*that's not to say you (OP) thing that - but best to have it written in the thread for those that still might

 

[daizeUK]

Agree with the above.  I have an airstone on a timer switch, it turns on after lights out and turns off several hours before lights on to allow the CO2 time to build up again.  During the day I rely on plants to produce oxygen for the fish.  Lots of water agitation is not a good thing when you're trying to get CO2 to your plants.  I have minimal ripples on the surface.
 
One reactor running on a 115L tank may not be enough.  I have 3 reactors running on my 120L tank, each with 1/4 tsp of yeast and 280g sugar, each of these will run for 3 weeks.  I actually just added a fourth reactor for more CO2 though I'm not sure yet if that was the best idea.  By cycling several bottles and changing them on alternating weeks you even out the fluctuations because it always takes each reactor a few days to get up to speed after refreshing.
 
In short, a single reactor is a recipe for fluctuating CO2 and BBA.

 

[Byron]

I am not at all disagreeing on the CO2 fluctuation.  But there is another major cause of brush algae on Java Fern (and other low light/low nutrient requiring plants like Anubias) and that is light.  I do not add CO2 in any of my tanks, but I have had brush algae on the JF a couple times, due solely to light intensity.  If the tank in question is the one pictured, benthyer, you might want to shade the JF as it is under direct light.
 
The fluctuating CO2 is probably feeding this too, or vice versa, but light and nutrients do have to be considered when it comes to problem algae.
 
And daize, brush algae can indeed be very common in non-CO2 tanks.  It is the only problem algae I have ever had to battle, and by experimenting with light and nutrients, I have actually been able to cause it and then stop it, solely by adjusting the balance of light/nutrients.  One simple illustration, I used to see it increase every summer, due to the fact that the daylight entering the fish room was brighter and longer, and this was sufficient to offset the balance of tank light and nutrients; the last three summers I solved this by keeping the windows heavily draped all summer.  Sometimes it doesn't take much to throw things off balance.
 
Byron.

 

[benthyer]

I have always had the airstone running and didn't know about this gassing off until recently but I have it running as it acts as another filtration system in my tank but I'm sure it won't do any harm to turn it off. Would you suggest that I have the CO2 running 24 hours from now on and just run my Air Pump on a timer?
 
I have also just acquired a Fluval U4 filter which I might put into my tank instead as it has the spray bar for use with planted tanks and this will help limit the amount of water agitation enabling the CO2 to build up during the day which will also be helped if I do turn the air pump off during the day.
 
Byron, i think in this current situation it is the CO2 that has caused the BBA and it is my own fault really as I let myself get carried away without thinking through how I should do this properly because before I added CO2 I never had any signs of BBA.
 
I have noticed more BBA tonight on the clips of my heater which I will remove and wash off but no more on any of my plants....so far! The spec I did spot on the fern leaf got removed along with the leaf. I have also noticed today that my rate of bubbles has slowed so think I will set up a new reactor tomorrow and run 2 and change each one every other week.

 

[daizeUK]

Would you suggest that I have the CO2 running 24 hours from now on and just run my Air Pump on a timer?

That's what I do. Yeast-powered CO2 is not well suited to being shut off at night, unlike pressurized CO2 which you can control with a solenoid, you can't tell the yeast to stop digesting sugar! Disconnecting it will result in loss of pressure.

I thought BBA was relatively rare in non-CO2 tanks but I will bow to Byron's knowledge about BBA and light. I've always used either CO2 or liquid carbon in my tanks, so the liquid carbon probably helps to discourage BBA in my other tank.

 

[benthyer]

So today I turnt off my Air Pump and lowered my filter level and flow leaving the tank with just a gentle circulation and very minimal surface agitation.
 
I refreshed my reactor as it was slowing and need to order a T-connector before I can add another one unless I can run one bottle into another and then into the bubble counter?
 
Also now I have turned my lights off I have switched the air pump back on, let's just hope I don't wake up to any casualties in the morning.

 

[SO19Firearms]

When Light is cited as a cause of algae in non CO2 tanks - or indeed any tank - It is still directly related to CO2
 
"Too much" light literally means "too low" CO2*......no light means no need for CO2, a bit of light needs a bit of CO2 etc etc
If you're not adding CO2, that's fine, but the plants are still using it regardless - they're just gonna suffocate at a lower light intensity than if you supplement it.
 
HTH
 
 
 
*the actual levels of "too low" or "too much" depends on the actual amounts of CO2 available....like a sliding scale - too much for one person will be different for another etc....

 

[daizeUK]

I refreshed my reactor as it was slowing and need to order a T-connector before I can add another one unless I can run one bottle into another and then into the bubble counter?

 
Use a T connector or Y connector.  Each reactor should feed into the scrubber/bubble counter.  This way you can disconnect each one individually as needed without depressurizing the others.  I use a simple clothes peg to hold the CO2 tubing folded in half when temporarily disconnecting a reactor from the system.