Angelfish

[mnccnm]

I have a lot of questions, (and ideas) about setting up an Angelfish tank.

I have an 85 gallon tall tank and I plan on setting it up for Angelfish. I am not new to fishkeeping, but far from an expert and have never done an Angelfish tank. Through my research I have found that they prefer a lower ph, slow water movement, driftwood, and a planted tank. This poses some questions, and I also have some ideas I thought I would throw out there.

Ph - My ph here is a consistent 7.8. While knowing that in the wild they are from lower ph waters, the fish I will have will be in 7.8 water. My thoughts are that since they will be coming from a fish farm they are likely to have already adapted, (for lack of a better word) to a higher ph. I'm not overly concerned about this. Should I be?

Slower water movement - It is my understanding that they are not strong swimmers and aggressive water movement will cause stress. I still want to have a lot of filtration though to keep maintenance at a minimum. I was thinking of using a Fluval FX4 that I already have, but instead of using the distribution nozzles that is comes with I thought I would make a 1/2 PVC distribution bar across the entire back of the tank, (4 feet) with many wholes drilled in it, (hole size still to be determined) pointed straight down. My thinking is this hopefully would still allow me to move a lot of water though the filter, but still have a pretty calm tank. Thoughts?

Driftwood - Not a huge fan as I previously never got past the mold stage, but I do still have to pieces of Spiderwood I would be willing to give another try. I also have many large pieces of driftwood that we used to use for reptiles and have now been outside in the weather for several years, but not knowing exactly what kind of wood it is I am not really considering this option. Ant other thoughts?

Planted tank - I have never done this before but have been looking for an opportunity to try it. I would prefer to stay with easy to grow and easy to obtain plants. Suggestions on plants?
What kind of substrate? I would prefer to keep as much gravel as possible to keep maintenance easier, (vacuuming it) but I would assume gravel isn't conducive to rooting plants, if this is true, can I only use the different substrate where the plants are rooted? Or is there a way to root the plants in gravel? Or can you vacuum the other substrate?
Plant supplements? is there any fertilizers I should use and how do these effect the water conditions?
Lighting - I currently have a 35 inch LED light on this tank, I was hoping this would be sufficient to promote moderate growth of the plants.

Also, what is a good method of algae control? It is my understanding that live plants help this, is this enough? Is there a good catfish tankmate to consider? Are snails a good option and if so are there any that will not overtake the tank?

I am probably going to keep this an Anglefish only tank, but if I should want to add tankmates later, what are good ones that will get along and not nip at the Angles fins?

Behavier - I am aware of their aggressiveness when eating or defending eggs. What else should I be thinking of?

Thanks in advance for any constructive input.

 

[Anonymous Fox]

this may help Angelfish | Tropical Fish Forums

 

[mnccnm]

Thank you Unicornblast5000, but not so much. It bears saying I did do a limited search, but if anyone is aware of a post I might have missed please point it out to me.

 

[Slaphppy7]

Angelfish Care: Complete Guide for Beginners - AquariumNexus

Learn how to care for your angelfish with our beginner's guide. From feeding to tank setup, everything you need to know to ensure your fish thrive.

www.aquariumnexus.com

 

[mnccnm]

No Anglefish experts?

 

[P J]

Hi mmc, a good source for planted tanks is Diane Walstad book - following her advice of a soil base capped with gravel I have successfully grown a vigorous plant environment. I used about 1” of peat moss from garden centre make sure there are no additives - the cheaper the better. Do a test in an old water bottle first to make sure no leaching occurs, cap peat with about half to one inch of small aquarium gravel. Plant amazon swords, angels love them, elodea densa and say fanwort. There is no need for plant fertilisers. With good filtration and plants algae will not be a problem - don’t over feed.

Start with about six angels when the tank is fully mature with a well functioning filtration system, a good canister filter. Let the tank mature without fish for at least 4 to 8 weeks. Add some small dither fish after the angels have settled in perhaps platy. They provide fun for the angels when the platy start breeding.
Platties do not nip angel fins.

The angels love the amazon sword plant leaves for laying their eggs, make sure plenty of hiding places are set up with rocks and mopani wood (scrub and soak overnight) don’t boil it. As you say there will be some white funghi but the fish will eat this.

A good quality tropical flake and when the angels are about nine months old 1.5 inches body long feed frozen bloodworm to bring them the breeding condition. Also 1mm cichlid pellets are good with the flake. Feed about 3% of the fish body weight - they don’t weigh very much!

Filtration cycle should be eight to ten times the tank volume per hour put the outlets at one end of the tank, with a small power head filter for aeration. The angels don’t have a problem with return water flow currents. Keep lighting fairly low not super bright.

Do not put a catfish in your tank they’ll eat the angels eventually.

 

[Essjay]

Do not put a catfish in your tank they’ll eat the angels eventually.

That depends on the catfish. I can't see a cory eating an angel; nor a bristlenose plec.


I disagree with platies as dither fish. All the common livebearers are hard water fish while angelfish are soft water fish. Dithers with angels need to be soft water fish.

 

[P J]

Well not so, platy and angels will happily live together in a pH of about 7. Based on actual experience not a freely held opinion.

 

[Essjay]

It's GH that matters, not pH.

 

[Uberhoust]

@mnccnm I am definitely not an expert but I started with Angels a couple of years ago, before that time I had one or two with other fish in a community tank. I really like the angels but they really have personalities which sometimes have caused me issues. I started with a number of juveniles that lived all together well until a pair developed, now I have the pair in their own tank (more or less), and another couple in other tanks individually because they don't get along any more. The rest had to be rehomed. That said I still very much like them. Below is what I have found and is not necessarily the best information.

pH - My water in my newish home is about 6.8 to 7.0 out of the tap and extremely soft, it is the reason I picked angels and tetras for the community tank. That said a number of years ago I had an Angel that lived with my African cichlids who did very well in water that was closer to 8.0 and very hard. I wouldn't do that again but the pH didn't seem to cause him issues. The driftwood will help reduce the pH of the water slowly so is a good reason to add driftwood. I don't like maintenance or fiddling with the water so I try and pick the fish to my water.

Slow Water Movement - I only filter with the minimum filter size available, so current isn't an issue for me. I think your spray bar idea will work quite well, though you might want to consider splitting the take up as well if the filter is pulling a lot of water.

Driftwood - I am a big fan of driftwood, though I collect my own. I use water aged wood that I collect from a reservoir nearby. I collect the wood in the summer after they get pieces get left on the shore (the wood has undergone many wetting and drying cycles). My breeding pair always lay their eggs on one of these pieces. Wood always has a certain risk associated with it but the right piece really helps create a nice environment. I sun dry the pieces thoroughly after scrubbing them down before they go into the tank.

Plants - Vallisneria has always been a dependable plant for me, Amazon Swords are good too, Java Fern. All of these have been easy for me to grow. I use aquarium soil. I can said all that those 3 plants also grew well when I was using pool filter sand with fertilizer tabs.

Substrate - If I was starting out I would use sand, in my experience it has the lowest maintenance. I find it as easy to work with as gravel. I like the aquarium soil I have now but it seems like it is starting to break down and adding more nutrient to the water. I have tried gravel, florite, sand, and now aquarium soil, I liked sand the best. I would try to get sand with rounded grains if you are planning on bottom dwellers.

Lighting - I don't believe a 35" LED will be sufficient, you might be able to get Vals and Java fern to grow. On my 60 tall I use a 48" Nicrew G2 LED, right now I run it at 8 hours a day full intensity (22" water depth). With it I can grow some plants on the bottom, it is hard to get light to the bottom of a tall tank. You might be able to get away with floaters, I have water lettuce growing in mine now and it is reproducing.

Algae - I control mine primarily by trying not to overfeed the fish and by reducing the hours of light in the summer. I do have a bristle nose pleco, I can see where he eats the algae but he just reduces it on the glass. He does keep the driftwood clean.

Behavior - I did the largest amount of learning here. My Angels all got along together until a pair started. That totally changed the dynamics of the tank and intense competition and aggression started with the males of which I somehow ended up with a larger number of. Additionally the mated pair became so protective of each other and their spot in the tank that they forced all the other fish into the other third of the tank. I still don't know entirely how to deal with this issue. I have moved the mated pair into another tank, and separated my two other favorite males into two other tanks. The rest have been rehomed. I haven't had any luck introducing other angles with the males. Everyone says not to keep Angels alone but right now that seems to be my only option, I might try putting a known female with the males.

What I like most about the Angels is that they always watch me and are the first to the front of the tank when I approach. They are so curious about what I am doing I have to push them away when I clean the tanks.

Good luck with your endeavor.

 

[mnccnm]

Thanks P J, Essjay and Uberhoust. Some good information to digest.

 

[dhjaksu]

I have a lot of questions, (and ideas) about setting up an Angelfish tank.

I have an 85 gallon tall tank and I plan on setting it up for Angelfish. I am not new to fishkeeping, but far from an expert and have never done an Angelfish tank. Through my research I have found that they prefer a lower ph, slow water movement, driftwood, and a planted tank. This poses some questions, and I also have some ideas I thought I would throw out there.

Ph - My ph here is a consistent 7.8. While knowing that in the wild they are from lower ph waters, the fish I will have will be in 7.8 water. My thoughts are that since they will be coming from a fish farm they are likely to have already adapted, (for lack of a better word) to a higher ph. I'm not overly concerned about this. Should I be?

Slower water movement - It is my understanding that they are not strong swimmers and aggressive water movement will cause stress. I still want to have a lot of filtration though to keep maintenance at a minimum. I was thinking of using a Fluval FX4 that I already have, but instead of using the distribution nozzles that is comes with I thought I would make a 1/2 PVC distribution bar across the entire back of the tank, (4 feet) with many wholes drilled in it, (hole size still to be determined) pointed straight down. My thinking is this hopefully would still allow me to move a lot of water though the filter, but still have a pretty calm tank. Thoughts?

Driftwood - Not a huge fan as I previously never got past the mold stage, but I do still have to pieces of Spiderwood I would be willing to give another try. I also have many large pieces of driftwood that we used to use for reptiles and have now been outside in the weather for several years, but not knowing exactly what kind of wood it is I am not really considering this option. Ant other thoughts?

Planted tank - I have never done this before but have been looking for an opportunity to try it. I would prefer to stay with easy to grow and easy to obtain plants. Suggestions on plants?
What kind of substrate? I would prefer to keep as much gravel as possible to keep maintenance easier, (vacuuming it) but I would assume gravel isn't conducive to rooting plants, if this is true, can I only use the different substrate where the plants are rooted? Or is there a way to root the plants in gravel? Or can you vacuum the other substrate?
Plant supplements? is there any fertilizers I should use and how do these effect the water conditions?
Lighting - I currently have a 35 inch LED light on this tank, I was hoping this would be sufficient to promote moderate growth of the plants.

Also, what is a good method of algae control? It is my understanding that live plants help this, is this enough? Is there a good catfish tankmate to consider? Are snails a good option and if so are there any that will not overtake the tank?

I am probably going to keep this an Anglefish only tank, but if I should want to add tankmates later, what are good ones that will get along and not nip at the Angles fins?

Behavier - I am aware of their aggressiveness when eating or defending eggs. What else should I be thinking of?

Thanks in advance for any constructive input.

ok. My 55 gallon tank has 6 adult angels. I have 3 large sponge filters and can easily go a month without doing a water change and still have the water perfect.
the tank is heavily planted. ph is 8.4 and they are breeding. 4/6 angels came from tanks with a ph of 6. so ph should not be an issue.

also I have a lot of other fish in the tank. All fish are full grown adults.
there are 22 corys from 3 larger species and 12 pygmy corys. 8 kuhli loaches. 5 bristlenose. 18 neon tetras. 6 kribensis. 25 guppies. one female betta. 6 mystery snails. and 1 otocinclus however I plan on getting more.

so its a very heavily stocked tank with only basic sponge filters and I only do 20% water changes once a month and not even because of water quality.

 

[mnccnm]

ok. My 55 gallon tank has 6 adult angels. I have 3 large sponge filters and can easily go a month without doing a water change and still have the water perfect.
the tank is heavily planted. ph is 8.4 and they are breeding. 4/6 angels came from tanks with a ph of 6. so ph should not be an issue.

also I have a lot of other fish in the tank. All fish are full grown adults.
there are 22 corys from 3 larger species and 12 pygmy corys. 8 kuhli loaches. 5 bristlenose. 18 neon tetras. 6 kribensis. 25 guppies. one female betta. 6 mystery snails. and 1 otocinclus however I plan on getting more.

so its a very heavily stocked tank with only basic sponge filters and I only do 20% water changes once a month and not even because of water quality.

The tank is a year old now. 8 adult angels, they have paired off and get territorial now, but I find keeping the lighting low calms them down. On of these days I will thin the herd. Didn't have much luck with live plants, I think it's the light. Other than that the tank does well with a couple blue sharks, 2 pictus and a royal pleco.