Ammonia Tests - Confused!?

[fm1978]

Hi guys,

Starting to get a little confused with my test results for ammonia. I had been using the API Master Test Kit for all my tests and was managing to keep the ammonia down somewhere between 0 - 0.25ppm in an non-cycled tank. Yes, I had made the mistake of doing a fish-in cycle.

Now, however, I see that my ammonia is spiking for the first time, in between 0.5 - 1ppm. Performed an immediate 50% water change. Where's my confusion, you ask?

Well, I also bought the Salifert ammonia test kit, which, I'm led to believe, is very good. Why on earth is it testing negative for ammonia when the API is at as much as 1ppm???

Any ideas?

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Because these kits aren't as reliable as we would like to think that they are... they are 'hobby kits'. 
 
What dechlorinator are you using?

 

[fm1978]

Oh sorry, did I put this in the wrong place...apologies!

I use Nutrafin Aquaplus and as a back up, I add a few drops of Stress Coat and Stress Zyme.

Despite the fact they're only hobby kits, I'm still surprised that there's such a significant difference in test results.

Would you recommend any other type of test?

 

[eaglesaquarium]

Nope.  Those are the two I am most confident in that don't cost $400.
 
 
And don't worry about putting the thread in the 'wrong' place.  That's what we do as mods.  Some dechlorinators interfere with the test kits, specifically the API kit, so that's why I asked.  Usually the 'false reading' is closer to 0.25ppm than 1.0ppm though.

 

[fm1978]

Well thank you for correcting me, Mr. Mod, that's how I learn! Hehe!

Would you suggest I don't then re-test the water immediately after adding dechlorinator? Would there be a rough time to wait until a re-test?

Thanks for your help!

 

[FungusTrooper]

I always wait until the next day to do any testing other than PH after a water change, let things settle and balance out a little.
 
That being said, I don't know if that's the correct length of time to wait.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Here is what SeaChem says re Prime:
 

 
Under the conditions of a salicylate kit the ammonia-Prime complex will be broken down eventually giving a false reading of ammonia (same as with other products like Prime®), so the key with a salicylate kit is to take the reading right away.

 Hobby kits today are mostly salicylate- if you have two reagents to add, it is what you have.

 

[fm1978]

Am I to assume then that a reading taken straight after the introduction of new water and dechlorinator with the API kit is in fact correct?

So the test with the API kit (2 reagents) is right and the Salifert test (1 reagent) is false?

I retested today again and still get the same 0.5 - 1ppm with the API kit and 0 with the Salifert. Another 50% later and I'll wait 'til tonight to test again.

My fish are all behaving as normal and still have an excellent appetite and are plenty active. Oh, I should mention that I reduced the pH a tiny bit to, hopefully, render the ammonia less toxic!

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I have always been confused with the Salifert kits and their site has been undergoing restructuring and the fw stuff is not there. It says they read both, but I have always seen salicyclate kits with two reagents. It has to do with how they work and the colors infolved. There is a second type of ammonia kit based on Nessler reagents, a good test unless there is dechlor present.
 
It would be a big help to me and your if you could read through the box label and the enclosed directions and see if it tells you which form of test. I am too lazy to contact them and ask at this stage. I found this on a site - it was posted in 09 so may be dated:

 
Description
 

• * Ammonia and ammonium should be rapidly converted by aerobic nitrification into nitrite and then nitrate and finally into nitrogen gas. If this does not happen then either the aquarium is not fully matured or there is a problem with the tank`s biological system, which can be caused by an excessive biological loading being placed on the system.
  * The Salifert Ammonia Test Kit measures the total amount of ammonia and ammonium quickly and accurately.
  * Sufficient for up to 50 tests and can detect 0.5 ppm of total ammonia easily.

Specifications

Instructions:

1. Add with 5ml syringe 1 ml of water in the test vial.
2. Add 6 drops of NH3-1 (watch out caustic!) and swirl gently for 5 seconds.
3. Add 6 drops of NH3-2 (watch out contains Mercury salts, wash hands after use, keep away from food, see additional warning under the heading WARNING). Swirl gently for 5 seconds and allow to stand for 5 minutes.
4. Hold the test vial and look through the side of the test vial. Keep the color chart behind the test vial. Ensure that a white piece of the color chart is behind the liquid layer. The values on the color chart are in mg/L total ammonia (that is NH3 + NH4+).

 
So you can see the issue - two reagents vs 1.

 

[fm1978]

If that's the Salifert directions then it is a little outdated. The instructions for the ammonia test read, and I'm paraphrasing, 'add 2ml of tank water to test vial, then 0.5ml of reagent and swirl for 30secs, then add another 0.5ml of reagent and swirl for 10secs, leave to stand for 3mins. A final swirl for 5secs then compare against the chart'.

The only thing I have noticed that's a bit odd is that on the box it states NH4 test, however, one of the final statements on the directions mentions NH3 + NH4+ - exactly the same as the final sentence in your quote.

I sort of 'trusted' the API test more since it's result was much more what I expected it to be. I have fish so there MUST be ammonia production. It makes no sense that there could be a negative result as there is a low probability that my tank is cycled, plus, I read 0 Nitrites (API & Salifert) and 0 Nitrates (API only).

So, what's going on, really?

 

[daizeUK]

I tried the Salifert test kit and had the same problem.  It didn't work for me at all.  I made up solutions of various concentrations of ammonia and the Salifert gave me no comprehensible results - I ended up returning the kit as faulty.  There's a thread about it here http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/415015-ammonia-testing-the-good-the-bad-and-the-ugly/

 

[fm1978]

That was a hefty amount of information in there. I'm no scientist, but, I do know my way around an atom or 2, however, that probably made things much more complicated...
 
So there are numerous things that can affect our tests? That would be OK so long as we had control over them and could either negate them or account for them in the result. But, one of THE most important tests, NH3 & NH4, (especially for a beginner and one who's currently cycling) and it's that difficult to get a reliable, accurate test? That's very frustrating! 
 
Could they both be correct? Bear with me here!
 
Is it at all possible that the Salifert kit, ostensibly a little better than the API kit, is that much more sophisticated that it's giving me a 0 reading since the more toxic variant of ammonia is not present while the API kit is giving me the total amount of ammonia present, both the toxic and non-toxic variants giving a positive result? If so, it would most certainly explain a lot!

 

[eaglesaquarium]

That could be true... but I don't know.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

This is the problem with hobby tests. They tend to fail at the extreme. However, that doesn't not mean you can not use them, you just have to use them in a way that compensates for their short comings
 
For one, they should be pretty reliable to indicate the direct and often amount of change. If you see ammonia go up in successive tests, its a good bet that is what is going on even if the readings themselves might be a bit off. The tests are good on direction.
 
Ammonia exists in two forms in tanks. One, NH3 is highly toxic and the level you don't want to exceed is .05 ppm (some will say its .03 ppm). No hobby kit can detect that low a concentration reliably. However, in total ammonia which is both NH3 and the way less toxic NH4, the major portion is NH4. If one tests for both, the level is higher and thus easier to spot. The way ones knows how much bad NH3 there is in a sample tested is to use the pH and temp of the water and a conversion chart which tells you.
 
But in the end it is simple. I can buy an API ammonia test kit for under $5. If I needed to get mission critical ammonia readings, I would consider a $400+ test kit from Hach. If I was in a lab and needing to get dead accurate or continuous readings, I would be inclined to spend upwards of $4,000 for a test system.
 
Also, know what can interfere with readings doesn't make things worse, knowing about these things means you can take them into account. If you are adding iron to a tank for the plants and you test for ammonia, be aware iron affects results. So if you get numbers that seem not to make sense, you would know why and take things with a grain of salt. You look for other ways to confirm or refute what a kit says. If your kit says you have 3 ppm of ammonia in a tank with fish but all the fish seem completely fine, maybe the test is off. If your fish are gasping at the surface do you have ammonia? Do you have nitrite? Or do you need better aeration. Even an inaccurate kit can help with the answer.

 

[daizeUK]

The problem is when you've got two kits and they tell you completely different things.  Both measure NH3+NH4, both are salicylate so they're testing for exactly the same thing.  How can we explain that?
 
I tried two Salifert kits from different batches.   I even tried with deionised water to rule out anything affecting it in the water supply.  It's possible both were faulty, otherwise I'm at a total loss to explain why they didn't work for me!