100g Marine Without A Skimmer

[littleme1969]

I'm seriously thinking of upgrading my current 25g into my 100 g which currently is used for tropicals.
Questions are as follows..
Is it possible to run something that size without a skimmer, the tank hood is totally enclosed and there is no where to attach a skimmer. Also this tank is not drilled so wont be adding a sump either. I was hoping to use 2 large exteranal filters with carbon live rock and alot of filter floss (changed once a fornight) for filtration. I'm not planning on having huge stocks of fish so there will only be a small bio load and all corals will be softies that are easy to care for. I will obviously be adding possibly 3 extra powerheads for flow. Plus the 2 large output filters.

Is it just too risky with all the coral and live rock to run a tank so lowtech?

 

[nanocubeking]

I wouldnt recommend using two or any power filters but I dont see why it wouldnt work.

 

[littleme1969]

Pic of the tank in question... Its 5' x 2' high x 18" .. Maybe it would be an interesting experiment to see just how low tech you can run a tank on. My current set up runs without a skimmer and is 1/4 the size of this one. Stocking is quite high also . But with water volume to stock level being so low in the 100 maybe it would be a gooer. I currently run an internal power filter in my 25g with live rock rubble, carbon and filter floss in it. It does a great job and I have little problem with scum build up due to protein matter in the water column. and with the larger water volume, once settled it should be easier to maintain stability.. or am I just fooling myself..lol

Any opinion appreciated

 

[SkiFletch]

Dunno Littleme. With the types of corals you're keeping now, they wouldn't be too adversely affected by the higher DOC's of running skimmerless. My only real concern is with longterm phosphate buildup and resulting algae blooms making your life miserable.

Assuming you go through with this, I'll also assume you will use more LR. If you do want to do that I'd cure it for a month, lit in a bin before going through with the setup. Just me though

 

[littleme1969]

Dunno Littleme. With the types of corals you're keeping now, they wouldn't be too adversely affected by the higher DOC's of running skimmerless. My only real concern is with longterm phosphate buildup and resulting algae blooms making your life miserable.

Assuming you go through with this, I'll also assume you will use more LR. If you do want to do that I'd cure it for a month, lit in a bin before going through with the setup. Just me though

Hi ski.. Thanks for the input

Yes I will be adding another 20kg of cured live rock to the set up, plus 25kg of base rock. Making about 65kg of rock in total with the dead stuff just being for the base so you wont really see it. Rock will come from the same place as before so I know it will be good quality. Also I intend to have the 100g set up for about a month before I transfere the contents of the 25g over. Thus making sure its fully cycled.
As for Phosphate build up. Ive found having tonnes of Macro, which I actually love the look of, in the tank brings the phosphate down to undetectable. So I would be using both Marco Algae and also Rowa Phos in the canister filters to keep the phosphates under control. Ive learnt alot from the 25g set up about how to manage the tank stats and how overfeeding can be a big issue with algae outbreaks just as much as a tank first becoming establised .

The main reason for the move is I have decided to shut down totally on the tropical side. The electricity prices have just sky rocketed here again in the UK and I just cant warant keeping that many tanks anymore. So one large marine would still keep my fish interest alive and over time I can start to sell the corals as frags rather the fish which is what I do now.

 

[alexlark]

@ littleme1969

Love that tropical tank you got there!! I kinda miss mine now I've switched to marines.

Still prefer marines more though!

 

[steelhealr]

I wouldn't recommend 'not skimming' on a large marine. I guess you could try it and see what happens. I would think that you would build of DSO's over time, depending on how you stock it. Ski may be of more help on that. SH

 

[littleme1969]

Thanks for replying
Ive managed to find an internal skimmer that can be placed direct into the main tank, its load is ment for a 90g though which is a little small for the 100g, but I guess once you have the displacment of all the rock which will be about 80kg in total and about 100lbs of sand the water volume will probably be more like 80g anyhow. I will also run the one external filter as mentioned above .
Ive decided to give it a go and see what happens . Ive managed to find a home for the contents of the 100g tropical to someone of the fish forums who Ive sold fish to in the past so I know they will be well looked after which is a good weight of my mind. The fish hopefully will be off next weekend just leaving me with the plecs to sell on as and when.
Hopefully should be filling the 100g in about a month fingers crossed. I'll document the process in my nano diary

@ littleme1969

Love that tropical tank you got there!! I kinda miss mine now I've switched to marines.

Still prefer marines more though!

Thanks
I started with tropicals about 6 years ago, and it soon turned into an addicton..lol But my real goal was always marines anyhow. I will miss my fish as most Ive had for over 5 years from tiddlers and feed from the hand. They also always come upto to say hello when I go into the room , it amazes me as they dont do it with anyone else..lol Guess they know who feeds them

 

[Colin_T]

You can keep any marine tank without a skimmer. It doesn't matter how big or small the tank is. Skimmers help keep the water cleaner and well oxygenated but they aren't essential. As long as you monitor the water quality and do regular partial water changes you can run any marine tank without a skimmer.

Power filters are fine too but if you want to run the system on live rock then don't put anything in the power filters. Just run them without filter media. If you want something in them then use the rawaphos or nitrate removing granules, but they aren't necessary unless you are having problems with phosphates and nitrates.

 

[fishstick]

You can keep any marine tank without a skimmer. It doesn't matter how big or small the tank is. Skimmers help keep the water cleaner and well oxygenated but they aren't essential. As long as you monitor the water quality and do regular partial water changes you can run any marine tank without a skimmer.

Power filters are fine too but if you want to run the system on live rock then don't put anything in the power filters. Just run them without filter media. If you want something in them then use the rawaphos or nitrate removing granules, but they aren't necessary unless you are having problems with phosphates and nitrates.

Can you explain why? I thought if a power filter with ceramic media was attached to the system the media in time would become 'live' as rock does.

 

[littleme1969]

I think the best way to run an external is with live rock rubble, and this is what I intend to do instead of the sponge. I will also be adding filter floss as this has proved to be very helpfull in the 25g set up and carbon also helps with water quality if its a good quality brand . I'll also ben adding Rawaphos as needed to the filter.
Its good to know though that with proper upkeep and regular water changes it should do OK, but the proof of the puding will be in the eating..lol Ask me agin in 6 months time how things are going..lol

 

[Wraith001]

I had great results in my 200l tank using two canisters (i had a skimmer tho) with LR rubble in them. I tried to replicate this in a 5x2x2, however after a year of struggling with rising nitrates, phosphates and algae, i am currently stripping it. At the moment im building my first sump system for the tank. (Glad i kept my old tank for the fish and inverts hehe)

 

[steelhealr]

As long as you monitor the water quality and do regular partial water changes you can run any marine tank without a skimmer.

DSO's are not measurable. Considering the investment in time and money in putting together a large marine tank, I would think that anything that maximizes it's success and minimizes losses would be worthwhile. I can think of a lot of positives for a protein skimmer on a large marine system and just handful of negatives. Personally, I wouldn't have large tank without one. Nano tanks are a different issue. SH

 

[Colin_T]

Can you explain why? I thought if a power filter with ceramic media was attached to the system the media in time would become 'live' as rock does.

There are two theories on this subject. One is the filter materials/ media clog up and encourage nitrates. If there are no materials in the filter they can't clog up and you don't get nitrates. The filter bacteria that keep the water clean develop on the live rock and the system becomes more natural relying less on external filtration, and more on a natural rock type filter.

The other says to run the filter like you would in freshwater with media. Let the media develop the beneficial bacteria and use that to keep the water clean.

I prefer the latter but it depends on where you are. I found that if you do regular maintenance on the filter it doesn't clog up and doesn't encourage nitrates. But on some forums, particularly the British ones, (no offence to anyone from the UK), they are sticklers for the filter material creates nitrates rule. Do it their way or not at all so to speak.

Having an external filter with a sponge or filter wool does help by trapping the particulate matter and makes the water look cleaner. Ceramic noodles/ beads or even coral rubble will develop beneficial bacteria that helps keep the water clean. Carbon and other granulated substances can be used in cannister filters to help lower nitrates and phosphates.

Its good to know though that with proper upkeep and regular water changes it should do OK, but the proof of the pudding will be in the eating..lol Ask me agin in 6 months time how things are going..lol

I've kept marines for years with and without skimmers. They help but aren't totally necessary. If you can afford one and have room for it, then use one. If money is a criteria then go without. They are a bit like a UV steriliser, helpful but not always needed.

 

[alexlark]

@ littleme1969

Can you tell me what skimmer you are thinking of using?