Weird Hybrid At The Lfs

[vancouver]

It's so weird looking.. it's got the body shape of a severum, but the color pattern of a syn.. it came in with a bunch of syns.. I've never seen colors like that on a severum before.. such weird pink on it's fins and squiggles on it..

Is it possible for the 2 to breed? or maybe it's just some weird kind of severum?

 

[~T~]

It's so weird looking.. it's got the body shape of a severum, but the color pattern of a syn.. it came in with a bunch of syns.. I've never seen colors like that on a severum before.. such weird pink on it's fins and squiggles on it..

Is it possible for the 2 to breed? or maybe it's just some weird kind of severum?

Dont think they can breed, sure its not a short body syn?

Can you get a pic?

 

[vancouver]

I cant get a pic..I'm not a regular there and they'd probably wonder wtf I was doing wanting to take a pic of their fish.. but it's definitey not just a short bodied syn.. it looks exactly like a severum, it just has some serious weird coloring, that makes it look very similar to the syns in the tank.. I've never seen a severum with colors like that before.

 

[juanveldez]

did it look something like this?

 

[vancouver]

Nope... didn't have the normal colors of any severum I've ever seen.. it had so much weird pink and light green on it... I've never seen a severum like it before.. I really wanted to buy it, but I just finished un-overstocking. So I'm trying not to buy anything.

 

[juanveldez]

well my guess is without seeing the pic is that it is simply another sev. until I saw the pic of the one that I had posted I never new that species of sev to even have yellow in it. but I am waithing on getting some fish until I get rid of some of my fish and also have better time to dedicate to them. I am also looking into going on a collecting trip in a couple years to central america. where I hope to focus on the pacfic slope of mexico and collect a couple of rare spcies in the hobby here in the US.

 

[vancouver]

It just sort of seemed plausible that it was a hybrid of the 2.. maybe it was stressed I don't know.. but the fact that it came in with syns made me wonder.

 

[juanveldez]

that would be a bit curious considering the fact that syns are central and sevs aint. but again without seeing a pic of the fish in question it is a bit hard to say 100 percent sure if it is or isn't either way.

 

[diburning]

did it look something like this?

is that a color morph??

also, if you see a severum with yellow on it, its probably a green one that gotten old. old green severums start yellowing.

Or it could be a cross between a gold and a green severum although the green color is dominant, however, codominance may sometimes occur

 

[Synirr]

did it look something like this?

is that a color morph??

Right click and check the photo name. It is Heros sp. "rotkeil", an undescribed species.

 

[diburning]

I know its a heros rotkeil but I still doubt its a new species. It looks so much like a severum that without hte color differences, it looks EXACTLY like a severum...

Maybe a severum color morph or crossbreed?? Or maybe its dyed? I REALLY REALLY doubt its a new species seeing its body shape and size, and spawning habits and all (search heros rotkeil on google... the first link)

ok heres an example... An albino tiger oscar and a common oscar are both astronatus oscellatus. Their colors look nothing alike but their body shape are identical. Biologists have made species identification mistakes for centries...

 

[Synirr]

It is a severum, it is from a different region than other species of severum (there are already more than one you know) and the colour is consistent for this fish throughout its region. It is not dyed or cross-bred because it is wild and reproductively isolated. When a breeding population is reproductively isolated from others and begins to take on different traits, no matter how slight, that constitutes a different species, or at least subspecies. It hasn't been scientificially described yet so it may just be a subspecies, but generally when that is the concensus it will be noted, and in the Googling I have done on this fish it is not, so it will probably be recognised as a new species some day. The differences between species are not always drastic, have a Google and check out Betta albimarginata and Betta channoides. The two look almost identical, but they never meet in the wild and are divergent, that constitutes a species.

Seriously, you need to do some research before opening your mouth. Look up what makes a species a species. A lot of it is somewhat arbitrary, but there are some basic guidelines. It's not what they look like, I can guarantee you that much, which is what you seem to think.

 

[diburning]

It is a severum, it is from a different region than other species of severum (there are already more than one you know) and the colour is consistent for this fish throughout its region. It is not dyed or cross-bred because it is wild and reproductively isolated. When a breeding population is reproductively isolated from others and begins to take on different traits, no matter how slight, that constitutes a different species, or at least subspecies. It hasn't been scientificially described yet so it may just be a subspecies, but generally when that is the concensus it will be noted, and in the Googling I have done on this fish it is not, so it will probably be recognised as a new species some day. The differences between species are not always drastic, have a Google and check out Betta albimarginata and Betta channoides. The two look almost identical, but they never meet in the wild and are divergent, that constitutes a species.

Seriously, you need to do some research before opening your mouth. Look up what makes a species a species. A lot of it is somewhat arbitrary, but there are some basic guidelines. It's not what they look like, I can guarantee you that much, which is what you seem to think.

you are entitled to your opinion, I am entitled to mine. I was guessing not making it a fact. I acknowledge what you said. It is described in Darwin's Origin of hte species. An example would be the tortoises or the birds on the galapagos islands. On each island, they were different because they needed to adapt to differnet needs on the different islands.

Because they are isolated from the Heros severus they may be adapted/evolving (I use that term lightly so don't criticize me) to their environment. Thats how some new species or subspecies evolve.

Or it could still be the same species. I know what you mean by how it is arbitrary. For example, A common carp can have different color/body forms. (NOTE: The following only makes sense to carp anglers) There is the common carp, then theres the mirror carp which has irregular scales, the leather carp with no scales at all, then theres the colorful koi. They are all Cyprinus Carpio and are all the same species but they have adapted (maybe except the koi) to their environment since the common carp are mostly seen in asia, the leather carp is mostly seen in europe and the mirrors are mostly seen in US/Europe.

There can be some disputes, for example, there are some carp subspecies of the common carp. I will not name the common names of these subspecies because they are disputed and that would give people an excuse to criticize me.

Cyprinus carpio carpio Linnaeus
Cyprinus carpio communis

 

[Synirr]

I know what you mean by how it is arbitrary. For example, A common carp can have different color/body forms. (NOTE: The following only makes sense to carp anglers) There is the common carp, then theres the mirror carp which has irregular scales, the leather carp with no scales at all, then theres the colorful koi. They are all Cyprinus Carpio and are all the same species but they have adapted (maybe except the koi) to their environment since the common carp are mostly seen in asia, the leather carp is mostly seen in europe and the mirrors are mostly seen in US/Europe.

Yep, absolutely right! They probably still consider these all the same species because they can and do freely interbreed. You could hypothetically make the argument that certain breeds of dog are no longer the same species since there is a mechanical barrier keeping chihuahuas and great danes, for example, from breeding, but that's another story

 

[pica_nuttalli]

what, like that?