Water quality

[Leigh]

Hi people.

I have been having problems when changing old water with new as follows ...

I  had not changed the water for 2 weeks.  All was well, but as part of the regular maintenance of my tank i replaced 1/3 of the old water with new.

The new water was the correct temperature and contained the correct amount of "stuff" to make the tap water safe. At the same time I gently washed out the filters using the old water.

2 days later all #### lets loose. All the fish are sitting on the bottom of the tank, my neons having been drained of all colour and my blue discus has turned black.

To overcome the situation I quickly changed 1/2 of the water and all now seems ok (i hope!)

This is the second time in succession this has happened to me and I am confused as to what is going on.

I know i need to regularly change the water in my tank but am now scared to do so.

The tank is around 1 year old and not over populated.  I have never experience this before.

Any ideas? because I am confused.

*leighsurman*@hotmail.com
Remove * for correct email, Edited to protect from spiders. DR.

 

[Davy Reynolds]

Sound mysterious Leigh,

First thought was that the bucket was contaminated, but then your using it the next day with no probs. So it's not that.

It may be your filter, or the cems in the water. So info please
What size is your tank?
What type of filter do you use?
What type of "stuff do you use in the water?
DO you mesure the stuff, or just chuck some in ?

 

[Leigh]

Size = 30x12x15
Filter = black sponge filter (sits in container in tank)
Stuff put in to neutralise water (not sure i'll come back to you)
Amount - measured.

Would you recommend putting more "stuff" in with the problems I have been having? (ie as if the tank was new) or the "normal" amount (as if the tank was mature).

I have been putting in slighltly more that the "normal" amount.

Could this be the reason?

Thanks for quick response by the way. I only joined the site today.

Many thanks

Leigh

 

[adeyc]

Hi Leigh.  
As Davy says " Mysterious".
have you checked the tank for ammonia, nitrate,nitrite etc?
it would be a good idea to check the new water as well before you put it in the tank. It could be that the water in the tank is has high levels of nasties and changing the water is stressing the fish because of the sudden change in quality. (fish will get acclimatised to water with high levels of nitrite/rates and ammonia if it all builds up over time). also check the date on all the Chems you use, some might be out of date. If the dates are alright I'd stick with just using the normal amount in you're water changes. If not get some new "stuff".
Puting more than the recomended amount may have some affect depending on what the "stuff is" ie water buffers(hardness, ph etc) also any medications added to the tank will change the water quality. If you're just using a basic water conditioner I dont see that effecting things to much but it depends on the make and ingredients etc. most additives have a safety margin so if the recommended dose is 5ml per 10 gallons you would be safe with 6 or 6.5ml but these change with the manufacturers, I did read about types of chems and safe usage in another board( how much to add/safety margins/etc) but that was for med's and the board is now closed.

What do you have your tank stocked with? fish, plants etc

 

[Leigh]

Thanks for comments/advice adey.

Before I answer your questions, the same problem has happened again. I woke up this morning to find all my fish on the bottom, neons translucent, blue discus gone black. I changed about 1/2 the water 2 days ago per my previous posting.

I have not checked the amonia/nitrite levels. Can they really get to dangerous levels in 2 days when 1/2 the water is fresh? Forgive my lack of knowledge in this area - i very rarely loose fish or encounter problems so toxicity levels have never been a concern.

The "stuff" I am putting in is just water conditioner and the levels I am adding are fine. With regard to the new water being suspect - the fish seem to rapidly improve with the clean water. I don't think this is the issue.

Fish (please forgive the spelling errors)
1 clown loach (4")
1 black with yellow spots plec (3")
2 dwarf gorami's
2 pepper spot cory doras
1 elephant nosed black thing
2 neons
1 south american puffer
2 pentazon barbs
1 cobalt discus (3")
1 dwarf frog

Plants are all plastic. One bit of bog wood. Tank size 30 x 18 x 12

Any ideas anyone? becuase I am stumped.

Thanks for help

Leigh

 

[adeyc]

Stumped :laugh: Bogwood :laugh:

Sorry about that I've just woken up in a funny mood.

K the serious stuff, I would say that the fish are somehow being poisoned by something, as to what it is...?
Your tanks not exactly over stocked and i wouldn't think that would cause such a drastic effect in the time.
I do know Discus should be kept seperate from other fish (Species tanks not community),Gouramis can be nippy buggers as well, But I don't think that the answer s they're affected too.
Right we need to narrow some things down.
What if anything have you added to the tank just before the problems started?
Was the bogwood shop bought if so was it pre treated or has the water turned a sort of rusty brown colour?
What brand is the water conditioner? or is it a shops own recipe?
No more questions for now.
It may be an idea if you havent got test kits to take a sample of the water to your lfs and ask them to give it a test.
Also check with you water supplier to see if they've added anything new to the supply as with the change of seasons the tend to put more of this and that into the water.
As for the levels of nitrates etc they could have that affect if the levels are really high (your fish would have acclimatised to them) but if they are ok just after a water change they should be fine. It's a good idea to check levels every couple of weeks or so anyway.

Your not switching the tank light on before opening the blinds/curtains or puting on the room lights are you? I'm just asking as I've done this a couple of times when I've suspected a fish was dead in the tank, the result being my neon and rummy nose tetra's were very pale and a bit motionless, while the rest were spooked and slightly paler.
if the fish don't improve though I suspect that's not the case.

K I'm off to do some checking again. Oh yeah. Do you have an air supply in the tank such as an airstone or from the filter?
or is the surface water being broken up some how(power filter) to allow O2 to get into the water?

I'll post later on tonight

 

[Davy Reynolds]

Do you fish breath heavily?

If so it could be something to do with co2 or o2
The colour loss is something to do with the health of the fish.

Now on to the daft bit.
If you change 3rd of the water and clean the filter. Thus having the problem. Then change more woter and the problem goes away, this means the water is okay. Leaving only the filter.
It's sometimes not wise to do a water change at the same time as cleaning the filter.
If you work in 2 week cycles, do the water one week and the filter the next, so how this goes. If you've just done a maintance to your tank, leave it aweek clean the filter, If you want drain a small ammount of tank water to clean it in. Then replace it all.

See if there is any change. If it's fine, wait a week do the water change, and if thats fine we've cracked it.

 

[adeyc]

Sorry Davy I'm a bit sceptical about an O2 as the fish aren't gasping for breath near the surface. could be co2 though not sure yet. Apart from the fish losing their colour are they showing any other symptoms such as rapid gill movements reddning around the gills anything else will be of help no matter how insignificant it seems.

 

[Leigh]

Thanks for advice/comments/questions.

I'll keep an eye on the tank over the next couple of days and let you know how we are doing.

Leigh

 

[Davy Reynolds]

No prob just keep us posted on the events.

If you need anything you know where we are

 

[adeyc]

I've just trawled the web to no avail. everything seems to point to water conditions, but haven't come across anything like the same as you've mentioned. let us know the behaviour of the fish and any other symptoms they might have over the next few days.
Sorry I can't be of more immediadte help at the moment.

 

[Leigh]

I think i've cracked it.

For the first time ever (and I don't know what made me do it) I washed the piece of plastic that protects the light from the water with bathroom cleaner.

The piece of plastic is old and regularly sits in the water. The consequnce of which is that I freaked out all my fish, although they do look a lot cleaner now (joke!).

Do you think this was the cause or am i barking up the wrong tree? If it was the cause i think my experience is worth sharing with everyone else.

I look forward to your thoughts

How do i get a funky moving character next to my name?

Leigh

 

[adeyc]

conGratulations. Going by what davy though( chloramines and chlroine) initialy and my agreement is seems as it was chlorine poisoning. Bleach contains the stuff and bathroom cleaner contains bleach. You can keep cleaning the cover but you must remeber to scrub/rinse thouroughly to get rid of any trace elements that may be left.
Were all glad you've found the problem and things will get better.
I'n the meantime if you need any more help just ask, just try an easier question next. :laugh:

 

[Davy Reynolds]

Time will tell if thats fixed it.
What made it dirty any way?