Nitrates Issues

[GobyMaster11276]

So I have a 70l well planted (if not over) tank with two bettas (divided). I have two corner sponge filters, and do about 40-50% water changes weekly. Last week, when testing the water, I discovered the nitrates were alarmingly high (at the very top), even though the week before they had only been just above 0ppm. I did a 60% w/c. This week, I tested again and it was back at the top. I did a 50% w/c, then about a hour later I retested and it is still at 160ppm. How is this even possible? I retested twice just to make sure it was correct. Thanks in advance.

 

[VladVenger]

Plants and only 2 bettas, really high nitrates for that.
Have you cycled your tank?
Are your test kits in-date?
How much nitrate does your tap water have?

 

[GobyMaster11276]

My tank is definitely cycled (it's been going for 6 months) and my test kits expire in June next year. I'm not sure what our tap water is at, so I will test that for you later.

 

[StandbySetting]

What dechlorinator do you use?

 

[GobyMaster11276]

What dechlorinator do you use?

I've recently changed to Biotop Conditioner and Vitamin Supplement.

 

[StandbySetting]

The only reason I ask is a dechlorinator I was using recently would give me false positives on my nitrate test kit up to 48 hours after dosing. The primary ingredient in dechlorinator is sodium thiosulfate but many have additives in for binding ammonia as well as heavy metals, I'm unsure what the specific chemical is that manufacturers use to bind these compounds but I've found over the years that a few brands of dechlorinator can cause inaccurate results on hobby test kits.

 

[GobyMaster11276]

How much nitrate does your tap water have?

My tap water read 0ppm. So, what is actually going on here?

 

[GobyMaster11276]

The only reason I ask is a dechlorinator I was using recently would give me false positives on my nitrate test kit up to 48 hours after dosing. The primary ingredient in dechlorinator is sodium thiosulfate but many have additives in for binding ammonia as well as heavy metals, I'm unsure what the specific chemical is that manufacturers use to bind these compounds but I've found over the years that a few brands of dechlorinator can cause inaccurate results on hobby test kits.

Thanks, I will try to test again today.

 

[Byron]

What nitrate test are you using? I ask because the API requires considerable shaking the the Regent #2 before adding it, otherwise the result can be false. Not as likely if the tap water is testing zero, but one never knows.

Second question, are you adding any supplements (fertilizers, etc) for the plants? These may contain nitrate.

Third, related to previous...can you tell us the ingredients in the conditioner and vitamin supplement? I searched and assume for Biotop you mean Biotope (?) and there are a number of products.

Byron.

 

[GobyMaster11276]

What nitrate test are you using? I ask because the API requires considerable shaking the the Regent #2 before adding it, otherwise the result can be false. Not as likely if the tap water is testing zero, but one never knows.

Second question, are you adding any supplements (fertilizers, etc) for the plants? These may contain nitrate.

Third, related to previous...can you tell us the ingredients in the conditioner and vitamin supplement? I searched and assume for Biotop you mean Biotope (?) and there are a number of products.

Byron.

Yeah, that was just a typo. I do use API, and shake each bottle solution for about a minute before use. After putting in the first lot, I wait 10 minutes before adding the second bottle. I am not adding any supplements, and as for the Biotope I use, it has the vitamins:
B1 (Thiamine)
B3 (Niacin)
B9 (Folic acid)
B5 (Calcium pantophenate)
B12 (Cyanocobalamin)
B6 (Pyridoxine)
B2 (Riboflavin)
C (Ascorbic acid)
H (Biotin)
D3 (Doesn't say).

As for its ingredients, it is a bit lacking that area as I couldn't find that anywhere on the bottle.

 

[Byron]

Yeah, that was just a typo. I do use API, and shake each bottle solution for about a minute before use. After putting in the first lot, I wait 10 minutes before adding the second bottle. I am not adding any supplements, and as for the Biotope I use, it has the vitamins:
B1 (Thiamine)
B3 (Niacin)
B9 (Folic acid)
B5 (Calcium pantophenate)
B12 (Cyanocobalamin)
B6 (Pyridoxine)
B2 (Riboflavin)
C (Ascorbic acid)
H (Biotin)
D3 (Doesn't say).

As for its ingredients, it is a bit lacking that area as I couldn't find that anywhere on the bottle.

That helps us clear up a few things. One has to examine everything when trying to diagnose an issue, as you may know.

On the API nitrate test...shake Regent #2 for a good two minutes, then add the drops. The instructions used to say 30 seconds, but this results in (usually) high false results. Add the drops according to the instructions (I thought it was 5 minutes, not 10, between...but maybe I have an older test). Whatever they say, except for the Regent #2.

I would re-test tap water alone and tank water and see what comes back.

Another factor...what is your substrate? Plant folks sometimes use soils of some sort, which can really mess with nitrogen. Again, another possible to eliminate (or confirm).

And the filter, are you cleaning it regularly? Any buildup of organics can increase nitrates. Mine are normally between 0 and 5 ppm, but in one tank they doubled to 10 ppm (not really serious of course, but given my 20-year 0-5 ppm I looked into it), and it was partly from organics in the canister filter.

Byron.

 

[GobyMaster11276]

That helps us clear up a few things. One has to examine everything when trying to diagnose an issue, as you may know.

On the API nitrate test...shake Regent #2 for a good two minutes, then add the drops. The instructions used to say 30 seconds, but this results in (usually) high false results. Add the drops according to the instructions (I thought it was 5 minutes, not 10, between...but maybe I have an older test). Whatever they say, except for the Regent #2.

I would re-test tap water alone and tank water and see what comes back.

Another factor...what is your substrate? Plant folks sometimes use soils of some sort, which can really mess with nitrogen. Again, another possible to eliminate (or confirm).

And the filter, are you cleaning it regularly? Any buildup of organics can increase nitrates. Mine are normally between 0 and 5 ppm, but in one tank they doubled to 10 ppm (not really serious of course, but given my 20-year 0-5 ppm I looked into it), and it was partly from organics in the canister filter.

Byron.

My substrate is just gravel. I think it may be the filters, as they're due for a clean sometime soon. I will clean those now, and then maybe retest? Should I be doing another water change, as I only did one yesterday? Let me know what you think.

 

[StevenF]

Aquarium filters generally don't affect nitrate. Have you checked for ammonia or nitrate? Perhaps you had an ammonia spike. Also I would take a container fill it with water and add 1/4 cup of your gravel.and then added your conditioner and vitamin supplement and then test the water in the container. If you get no reading wait a day and retest. Keep testing once per day for nitrate. Also test your tap water for high nitrate.

The contents of your vitamin supplement are vitamins known to help people and animals. I have some doubts that they do anything good for the fish. Vitamins are mainly organic molecules with some nitrogen, sulfur, and cobalt atoms. You can look up each vitamin in wikipedia.org. All those decaying organic vitamins might be creating your nitrate spike. you could also stop the use of the vitamins and see if the nitrate comes down with water changes.

Vitamins have also been used in fertilizers recently and if your a skillful chemist you might get a very good balance of nitrogen potassium, sulfur and other elements. Traditional fertilizers typically have more potassium than needed due to the use of potassium nitrate and potassium phosphate salts and some unavoidable constraints in mixing the various components. However I personally think the vitamins are being added to aquarium products strictly for marketing reasons. I personally don't use any vitamin containing supplements.

 

[GobyMaster11276]

So this is what I've done so far:
-Cleaned filters
-40% water change
-Added new water in.
Gonna wait an hour before testing again. I forgot to mention I siphoned the gravel around the feeding area yesterday, in case that helps.

 

[GobyMaster11276]

UPDATE:
Retested the water. Nitrates are still at somewhere between 40-80ppm (maybe even higher)! After 150% worth of water changes and having both filters cleaned in the last two weeks, as well as having the gravel vacuumed it is still up that high! What am I supposed to do now? Maybe retest tomorrow after it has settled for longer? Let me know what you think.