Help me understand my hardness test results

[Byron]

Sorry, my bad - I meant bicarb soda, not baking soda.
I was just curious why it keeps dropping, as it was a sudden and extreme pH drop that caught me out 25 years ago when I last kept fish and knew even less than today.
I lost a load of fish due to me using rain water, thinking this was a good move - the pH plummeted to about 4 from memory, and the fish died.
Only when I took a water sample to my local fish store did they explain about buffering and the dangers of using water too soft.
I guess I've been a bit over sensitive about the risk of ph drop due to insufficient KH - old habits etc.

Bicarbonate of soda is baking soda, same thing. Don't use it, it is not a good buffering agent. If you were to continue using this with fish, you could see sudden pH crashes, or at least fluctuating pH because of its minimal buffering capacity.

I explained in post #9 that with soft water fish, with a few exceptions, you will not have any problem with pH. Your previous experience was due to the sudden drop, which can be fatal as you saw. Which is another reason not to be adding buffers unless it is well researched and safe. If you want hard water species, like livebearers, then you are better to use a calcareous substrate which is permanent; they last years and years. But soft water fish come from waters with no GH, no KH and low pH.

 

[seangee]

I'm in the UK so don't have access to water authority numbers.

They have to publish them. Not suggesting they'll be easy to find but they are published.

 

[Last Triumph]

I didn't want to start a new thread for this, but whilst I'm discussing my water, I'm finding that my ammonia levels are returning to zero rather quickly during the early stage of my cycle.

I've had the tank set up one week now (150 litres) and have been adding 5ml per day of BioSafe ammonia as per the instructions.

My nitrites started to appear after about 3 days and have risen a touch each day with the ammonia levels falling from 5 down to about 2 every 24 hours, rising again to about 5 each time I add the BioSafe.

The nitrite is not getting any higher, despite adding daily doses of ammonia and between tests, the ammonia is now falling to zero.

Do I need to be adding more ammonia, or perhaps adding it more frequently as the bacteria in the filter appear to be combating it rather quickly.

I'm asking myself, why is the nitrite no longer getting any higher?

Water is 86 degF to promote bacteria growth and I have 10 live plants in the tank.

For the record, I have a large, high capacity canister filter which some might argue is too large for the tank - do I need to put the filter under a higher load?

Sorry for all the questions - I just want to get this right.

 

[Byron]

I didn't want to start a new thread for this, but whilst I'm discussing my water, I'm finding that my ammonia levels are returning to zero rather quickly during the early stage of my cycle.

I've had the tank set up one week now (150 litres) and have been adding 5ml per day of BioSafe ammonia as per the instructions.

My nitrites started to appear after about 3 days and have risen a touch each day with the ammonia levels falling from 5 down to about 2 every 24 hours, rising again to about 5 each time I add the BioSafe.

The nitrite is not getting any higher, despite adding daily doses of ammonia and between tests, the ammonia is now falling to zero.

Do I need to be adding more ammonia, or perhaps adding it more frequently as the bacteria in the filter appear to be combating it rather quickly.

I'm asking myself, why is the nitrite no longer getting any higher?

Water is 86 degF to promote bacteria growth and I have 10 live plants in the tank.

For the record, I have a large, high capacity canister filter which some might argue is too large for the tank - do I need to put the filter under a higher load?

Sorry for all the questions - I just want to get this right.

The live plants are taking up most of the ammonia. The faster growing plant species do this faster than slow growing plants. Plants are able to take up ammonia faster than the bacteria.

I do not advise using ammonia with live plants. It is possible to kill the plants. Better to stop the ammonia, monitor, and add the first fish later. I would wait until you see zero ammonia and nitrite for consecutive days before fish are added.

 

[Last Triumph]

If I stop adding ammonia, how will the fishless nitrogen cycle complete from this very early stage before I'm any where near a nitrite spike?

 

[Byron]

If I stop adding ammonia, how will the fishless nitrogen cycle complete from this very early stage before I'm any where near a nitrite spike?

I do not recommend doing any "cycle" when you have live plants. I don't know what plants you have, but it is possible they will take up any safe level of ammonia. If you add ammonia beyond what is safe for the plants, you will kill them. And risk killing bacteria too. High ammonia levels can inhibit the Nitrospira sp. bacteria, the ones that consume nitrite.

 

[Last Triumph]

Thanks once again for your help.
Out of interest, is there an established max level of ammonia that plants and the bacteria will tolerate - I read anything from 5-10, but there's a lot of conflicting info out there.

 

[Byron]

Thanks once again for your help.
Out of interest, is there an established max level of ammonia that plants and the bacteria will tolerate - I read anything from 5-10, but there's a lot of conflicting info out there.

I discussed this issue with an aquatic botanist some time back. Different species of plants have varying capacity for assimilating ammonia/ammonium. The only safe course is not subject them to ammonia under these conditions. Ammonia from fish and organic decomposition is (or should be) easily handled by plants, again depending upon the species and number and assuming the fish/organic load is not excessive beyond what the system can handle.

I have never "cycled" an aquarium in my life, and I have set up hundreds. I always have live plants, including floating, at the beginning. I have never seen ammonia or nitrite above zero. I have been doing this for 20+ years.

On another issue that I forgot earlier...temperature. Not all plants can manage long-term at temperatures as high as 86F. The couple times I have used this temperature to deal with ick I have seen a visible detriment to my floating plants especially.