Gardeners World - Update Pg 5

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JamieH,

A good setup post and a good start.
Glad you chose to follow Georges advice on the dayllight tubes and leaving out the substrate heating cable. His advice is pretty reliable !

Your choice of substrates is interesting. I think you may find that the top layer combination of silver sand and gravel will separate out over time, with the finer grained sand working it's way lower down. But that shouldn't be a problem.

I was a little suprised to see you have chosen Ferka ferts after reading another thread where you thought their root tabs were the cause of a problem in another setup of yours. Although I've never used Ferka, I know lot they are a popular choice and I dont think you'll have a problem with them.

None of the above should cause you any worries at all, I think the one place where you may have problems is with your Co2 levels, but you already seem to be aware of this.

Yeast/DIY Co2 in a 240Ltr tank is going to struggle to give you the sort of levels you'll need with 2.4wpg lighting. You really need to be aiming to be above 25ppm, preferably a stable 30ppm.
Your DIY reactor will help, but I dont think it'll get up high enough for your fast growing stems to out compete the algae. Keeping your Co2 at a stable level will also be an issue with a DIY system and is also an important part of Co2 in a planted tank. At first your mix will produce lots of bubbles, but it won't sustain that output and levels will fluctuate.

Keep an eye on that permanent Co2 kit ..... I think you'll need to plan for an upgrade to a pressurised system. Low or fluctuation levels of CO2 will let algae get a hold ... watch out for BBA, it'll take advantage of both of those conditions ( speaking from bitter experience ! )

Just for info ....Some of the permanent test kits can give a 'good' indication over quite a large depending on the PH of your tank. For example the JBL kit at PH 7 gives a good for 24 - 36ppm Co2 (not too bad), but With different PH's the Co2 can be as low as 19ppm or as high as 38ppm and still be shown as 'good'.
I'd also check your Co2 levels by testing your PH/KH, jsut to be sure.
Or use a reference solution with a known KH in your drop checker.

It's never easy to judge how a tank will fill out once the plant get established, but I think the fern, on the left, high up on bogwood looks a little out of place. IMHO it would look more natural placed lower down on the bogwood.

Keep us updated on progress.

Cheers
 
JamieH,

A good setup post and a good start.

Thanks


I was a little suprised to see you have chosen Ferka ferts after reading another thread where you thought their root tabs were the cause of a problem in another setup of yours. Although I've never used Ferka, I know lot they are a popular choice and I dont think you'll have a problem with them.


TBH - i would never use the substrate capsules again. having experimented with them after i used them before, they contain a lot of air, so unless you push them right down to the bottom, some of the mixture inside - which is very dry and floats - will be drawn into the water when the air bubble rises. thing is... i'd also thought root ferts would be better just under the plants. whether that was the cause of the problem i had before, i guess i'll never know.

in reality i think most liquid ferts in that price range are much of a muchness... so i bought ferka because it comes in nice bottles!!!! :blush: :shout:



Yeast/DIY Co2 in a 240Ltr tank is going to struggle to give you the sort of levels you'll need with 2.4wpg lighting. You really need to be aiming to be above 25ppm, preferably a stable 30ppm.
Your DIY reactor will help, but I dont think it'll get up high enough for your fast growing stems to out compete the algae. Keeping your Co2 at a stable level will also be an issue with a DIY system and is also an important part of Co2 in a planted tank. At first your mix will produce lots of bubbles, but it won't sustain that output and levels will fluctuate.

Keep an eye on that permanent Co2 kit ..... I think you'll need to plan for an upgrade to a pressurised system. Low or fluctuation levels of CO2 will let algae get a hold ... watch out for BBA, it'll take advantage of both of those conditions ( speaking from bitter experience ! )

Just for info ....Some of the permanent test kits can give a 'good' indication over quite a large depending on the PH of your tank. For example the JBL kit at PH 7 gives a good for 24 - 36ppm Co2 (not too bad), but With different PH's the Co2 can be as low as 19ppm or as high as 38ppm and still be shown as 'good'.
I'd also check your Co2 levels by testing your PH/KH, jsut to be sure.
Or use a reference solution with a known KH in your drop checker.

I'm going to change 1 of the 2 bottles every 5 days - so there should always be one thats relatively 'fresh' in the medium term i may also add some flourish excel to enusre there's plenty of carbon available..

Your right though... my longer term plan is to add pressurised c02 to the system.


It's never easy to judge how a tank will fill out once the plant get established, but I think the fern, on the left, high up on bogwood looks a little out of place. IMHO it would look more natural placed lower down on the bogwood.

theres a smaller bit further down - to the left, i want the both to fill out into a 'bush' - i'm to get something red to put in there too today.


Keep us updated on progress.

Cheers

thanks for the advice and encouragement.... i really appreciate it
 
TBH - i would never use the substrate capsules again. having experimented with them after i used them before, they contain a lot of air, so unless you push them right down to the bottom, some of the mixture inside - which is very dry and floats - will be drawn into the water when the air bubble rises. thing is... i'd also thought root ferts would be better just under the plants. whether that was the cause of the problem i had before, i guess i'll never know.

in reality i think most liquid ferts in that price range are much of a muchness... so i bought ferka because it comes in nice bottles!!!! :blush: :shout:

I find that root tabs are an excellent way of delivering ferts to plants like swords, especially in old or inter substrates. I use them regularly in my low tech tank (sand substrate) and have never had a problem.

If you want to check out how 'much of a muchness' many of the liquid ferts are, check this link.
FertFriend
It doesn't include Ferka ferts (hopefully it will be updated) but it does include Tropica, Seachem, Nutrafin and Kent ferts. There is quite a difference in not only the nutrients, but also the quantities in some. Interesting either way

The Flourish excel will obviously help the situation, but in a large tank the quantity required to make a real difference will be a costly addition.

One thing I did mean to ask in my last post is .... are you planning on planting any foreground 'carpeting' plants. You seem to have gone to a lot of trouble in providing a nutrient rich substrate, but at least half of it is open sand/gravel. You would seem to have enough light for a glosso carpet.

Al
 
TBH - i would never use the substrate capsules again. having experimented with them after i used them before, they contain a lot of air, so unless you push them right down to the bottom, some of the mixture inside - which is very dry and floats - will be drawn into the water when the air bubble rises. thing is... i'd also thought root ferts would be better just under the plants. whether that was the cause of the problem i had before, i guess i'll never know.

in reality i think most liquid ferts in that price range are much of a muchness... so i bought ferka because it comes in nice bottles!!!! :blush: :shout:

I find that root tabs are an excellent way of delivering ferts to plants like swords, especially in old or inter substrates. I use them regularly in my low tech tank (sand substrate) and have never had a problem.

If you want to check out how 'much of a muchness' many of the liquid ferts are, check this link.
FertFriend
It doesn't include Ferka ferts (hopefully it will be updated) but it does include Tropica, Seachem, Nutrafin and Kent ferts. There is quite a difference in not only the nutrients, but also the quantities in some. Interesting either way

The Flourish excel will obviously help the situation, but in a large tank the quantity required to make a real difference will be a costly addition.

One thing I did mean to ask in my last post is .... are you planning on planting any foreground 'carpeting' plants. You seem to have gone to a lot of trouble in providing a nutrient rich substrate, but at least half of it is open sand/gravel. You would seem to have enough light for a glosso carpet.

Al

oh... i will use root tabs... but they will be the 'solid' pill type rather than the ferka capsules which are powder and air in a gelatin cap.

i want to use E Tenellus as a carpet at the front, maybe even dwarf sagiteria - but i think that will grow too high. i want to have a few more c beckettii clumps around the edge of the forground too.
 
Wow ! I really like this !

I found this journal very helpful and informative so far !

Thanks alot !

Cant wait to see it when it has matured

Richie
 
Wow ! I really like this !

I found this journal very helpful and informative so far !

Thanks alot !

Cant wait to see it when it has matured

Richie


thanks very much!!!

Me either... i added some alternanthera reinicki today... the tank needed some red. i just hope it does well because it's a stunning plant.
 
I saw the clips and the lights in the hood, but would be really interested in seeing the end caps, starters etc.

Just interested to know how it all fits together and also how you stop the bulb that is attached to the original from sliding underneath the original.

Andy
 
I saw the clips and the lights in the hood, but would be really interested in seeing the end caps, starters etc.

Just interested to know how it all fits together and also how you stop the bulb that is attached to the original from sliding underneath the original.

Andy


The clips are tight enough that the tubes don't slide, but also the reflector thats attached to the two additional tubes rests on top of the reflector thats attached to the original two tubes so that adds extra support. TBH thats not the biggest problem - the cable tension and the wide centre brace on the juwel tank would be enough to support the tubes.

the real trouble... as i discovered today, is when you need to lift the hood. then all hell breaks loose!
 
Great journal and a great project, detailed journals like this do inspire people to try similar projects, ie me, I started off with some plants and now wish to expand more so in this area (especially as my little bro is a pro gardener - not aquatic, but he very interested).

Once again very well done, keep it posted (I've subscribed to this thread now)

Hope it all goes well

Biff0r
 
Hi Jamie, how are things going?

Where did you buy your Eheim Compact Pump? Can't seem to find them and it seems ideal for my project....
 
And .... yeah !

Your home made c02 deffuser thing looks like a great idea to me !

As i have a tank the exact same size as yours im thinking that this idea could work for me ?

What does your homemade diffuser do that a glass diffuser from aquaessentials doesnt lol Dont mean that rudley i just would like to know if your difffuser would work better for me ?

Thanks

Richie
 
Great journal and a great project, detailed journals like this do inspire people to try similar projects, ie me, I started off with some plants and now wish to expand more so in this area (especially as my little bro is a pro gardener - not aquatic, but he very interested).

Once again very well done, keep it posted (I've subscribed to this thread now)

Hope it all goes well

Biff0r

Thanks mate...!


Hi Jamie, how are things going?

Where did you buy your Eheim Compact Pump? Can't seem to find them and it seems ideal for my project....

eheim compact pumps from aquatics-online.co.uk - only 8.99 for the 300lph model. they are silent... no, SILENT.

Things are going ok... there's quite a bit of growth from some plants already... but some of the crypts don't look great, despite the ferts and light.


And .... yeah !

Your home made c02 deffuser thing looks like a great idea to me !

As i have a tank the exact same size as yours im thinking that this idea could work for me ?

What does your homemade diffuser do that a glass diffuser from aquaessentials doesnt lol Dont mean that rudley i just would like to know if your difffuser would work better for me ?

Thanks

Richie


Two MAJOR advantages to myh homemade power diffuser....

1: I didn't spend £40 on £1 worth of glass.
2: it's on the same timer as my lights now... so my diy c02 is dosed only when the plants need it.


Pics update coming on sunday!
 
Guess you have a valve on it somewhere then ?

And i think i might make one !

Richie


no... all the components of the reactor are in the pic. the pump just switches off with the lights... then the co2 just escapes into the atomosphere - not cost effective if you are using pressurised c02, but not really a problem with yeast!

Here's the design again

Image007.jpg



And the reactor in action:

Image005.jpg
 
I dont want to knock your reactor, it's a nice little DIY solution to dissolving CO2, but I have to say that I disagree with your earlier statement about "1: I didn't spend £40 on £1 worth of glass.".
There is no need to spend £40 on a glass ceramic diffuser, in fact you can easily find one for about the same price as your Eheim pump and they certainly take up less space.

Can you tell us what your Co2 levels are like using this DIY reactor, if you are getting almost 100% of the Co2 dissolved then you shoud be getting quite high levels. it would be interesting to see the results.

Either way, if you are taking the trouble to introduce Co2 into your tank, you should really have an idea of the level it's reaching.

Cheers
Al
 

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