Chlorine and chloramines

[_fish_a_holic_]

I read (on the label of a product I used once, sorry can't remember what it's called),

...that products that "break up the chloramine bond" breaks the compound INTO
*chlorine (which the product should take care of) AND
*ammonia (which you need to use another product to take care of...)

Is this fact or fiction? Or maybe just a figment of my imagination??

 

[sinistral]

Actually, I believe this is correct. Most products will split chloramines into chlorine and ammonia.

Fortunately, the ammonia which is liberated is scant enough that your biological filter should be able to handle it without problems.

I will double check that part of it later on today.

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

Phew! These days I doubt my sanity

So I suppose chloramine is more harmful than ammonia?

Fortunately, the ammonia which is liberated is scant enough that your biological filter should be able to handle it without problems.

....hence, cycle, cycle, CYCLE!

 

[sinistral]

So I suppose chloramine is more harmful than ammonia?

Boy...this is a good question that I don't know the answer to. I do know that chloramine is less toxic to animals (including humans) that lack gills.

The mechanism by which chlorine and chloramine cause damage is:

Chlorine destroys the cells of the gills by oxidation, causing an impairment of normal gaseous exchange. Affected fish exhibit labored respiration due to an inability to utilize available dissolved oxygen in the water. Chloramine however, crosses the gill epithelium with an insignificant amount of cellular damage as compared with chlorine. Once the chloramine has entered the bloodstream it chemically binds to iron in hemoglobin in red blood cells causing an inability of the cells to bind oxygen.

cf. this webpage.

I'll try to see if I can find any tables comparing the LC50 of ammonia and chloramine on fish.

 

[pica_nuttalli]

chloramine is worse than ammonia in that chloramine will kill off the beneficial bacteria in your tank. ammonia will feed it.

 

[jflowers]

:stupid: no offence pica.

Jon

 

[pica_nuttalli]

thbbbbbth!!!!!!!!!!

the question was asked in terms of the chemicals dealt with by the dechlorinator. the small amount of ammonia produced by the neutralization process is less harmful than the chloramine it neutralizes because the ammonia will feed your bacteria while the chloramine will kill it, resulting in more ammonia than could have been introduced originally by the dechlorinator. so if you have to pick between two deadly chemicals present in trace amounts, the one that kills more of the things you want in your tank is the worse of the two.

how do you pick the lesser of two evils?

 

[jflowers]

Ummm, it meant I agree thats what that smily means.

Jon

 

[Inchworm]

how do you pick the lesser of two evils?

Hi pica_nuttalli

I go by the experience of others.

In all the time I have been posting on this forum, I've never seen anyone report a problem that could have been traced back to the ammonia caused by neutralized chloramines.

But, we all know what will happen if you don't use the appropriate product to remove either chlorine or chloramine.

I wouldn't take the chance with my tanks.

 

[pica_nuttalli]

then you should just call me by my alternative identity: Captain Obvious!! :strikes a pose: :a really cool and inspiring pose: :yes:

actually, the original phrasing could be misread into a semi-moronic statement. i'm bad to do that the first time i approach an idea....

 

[Tropjunky]

sounds right chloramines are broken down but the chlorine is treated after wich is y they tell you to use a higher doseage for chloramines than for the other you should get a product that takes care of the ammonia as well jus incase.

if u lfs is selling RO water then you should get some as it means that anything in ur tank can be controled as in pure water and any minerals u add + wot ur fish puts in. I've been using it for yrs and it's been gr8

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

I go by the experience of others.

In all the time I have been posting on this forum, I've never seen anyone report a problem that could have been traced back to the ammonia caused by neutralized chloramines.

Whew! That's why I lurve you guys! All of ya! So what you are saying is, you don't have to use:
(1)de-chlorinator/de-chloraminator AND
(2)ammo-lock?? (which I don't believe works anyway *shrug*)

One less worry.. hehee thanx peeps