Why Can't I Get My Water Right?!

[isaac338]

Hey,

I've had my 20gal tank running since November of last year. I cycled it with 15 white cloud minnows (fish store recommendation), which was fine. I added a red lizard plec (red whiptail catfish?), and everything was fine. I noticed ammonia was up a bit, at maybe 0.25ppm. I put in a new filter cartridge (I have a penguin biowheel filter) and the ammonia came back down. I think I was doing far too big water changes (like 50%), which may have contributed - newbie mistakes..

A few weeks ago I bought 6 bleeding heart tetras, four small snails (no idea what type), an air pump, and a bubble wand. After introducing it all to the tank, my ammonia levels went sky high, and have stayed there. I've tried adding filter media from the fish store, no good. I've been doing daily water changes for like four weeks now, and ammonia is still through the roof. One snail died but otherwise the fish are ok - eating and swimming around like normal. I've been using ammo-lock.

With the Aquarium Pharmaceuticals kits, if a result is outside of the test range, will the kit just show you the closest it can? (ie if pH is 2, will it register as 6.0 as that's the lowest the kit will go).. Cause my pH is consistently 6.0, and I'm thinking now that my water is far too acidic and that's why I can't get any bacteria to live.

Results are consistently as follows:

Ammonia 8.0ppm,
Nitrites/Nitrates 0,
pH 6.0.

Note though that if what I think is correct, ammonia could be far higher than 8.0 and pH could be far lower than 6.

I've removed all my decorations (rocks and driftwood), vacuumed the hell out of the gravel, and am doing regular water changes. The pH of my tap water is 7.0.. so why can't I get my tank pH to come up?!

Does anyone have any ideas? I'm honestly about ready to break the tank down completely, boil the gravel, throw out the plants, and try to start afresh (and hope the fish can survive the cycling).

Thanks for any ideas,

Isaac

 

[isaac338]

I should also add I'm checking my tap water pH after adding the dechlorinator (stress coat), but haven't checked after letting the tap water sit around for a bit. I'll do that today.

 

[celaeno]

your problem is that you're way overstocked. the excess co2 from fish respiration causes ph to decline, i would guess. ammonia is due to your filter not being able to handle the bio-load.

 

[01edmn]

right i cant say i know loads but i'd say the water changes arnt helping and nor are 15 white clouds the w/changes gravel cleans and replacement of filter media dont help bcoz your not letting the nitrates(good bacteria) build up braking the cycle but defo get rid of some fish

 

[scorphonic]

The reason why the ammonia is so high is simply the fact that your tank is not cycled. You should have continued using the hardy fish and not put in the new stock of fish.

You said you put in a new filter cartridge? Did you seed it with bacteria from the filter you were removing? If you didn't then this is the problem...with no bacteria in your filter you were back to square one.

You were using the fish store media to seed your filter? This should have worked but it could have failed because of your low pH, the bacteria dont work or grow under a set pH...I'm not sure exactly what it is but maybe you are below it?

You should try to get your pH between about 6.5 and 8. This is a good range to keep the water at.

 

[rdd1952]

Your problem is 2-fold. First, I don't think your tank is cycled. If it were, you wouldn'thave ammonia. Second, your pH is too low to allow for nitrification. As the pH gets lower, nitrification slows to the point that at around 6.0 and below it stops all together. The one thinkg you have in your favor is that as the pH goes below 6.0, ammonia takes on it's non-toxic form of ammonium so the reading you are getting most likely isn't toxic.

You said you cycled with white cloud mountain minnows. Does that mean you don't have a heater since those are coldwater fish? If that is the case, there is another problem that is preventing your tank from cycling. As temperatures drop, once again, so does nitrification.

In either case, the white clouds should not be in a tank with the tetras and the pleco. They prefer temperatures in the upper 60s. With the stocking level of your tank, as mentioned, CO2 could be a problem too.

As for your pH, most likely ther is something in the tank that is lowering it. Driftwood will cause a drop on the pH as will CO2. Don't try to use pH adjusters to raise the pH. They are only temporary and will keep your pH in a constant swing up and down. Aeration will help as that will drive out CO2. Small, daily water changes are the best way as they will gradually bring it back up. You could also try adding a small amount of crushed coral to your filter. That too will help raise it.

 

[isaac338]

The tank was cycled fine before adding the tetras.

The tank has a heater and is sitting at 74 degrees.

I replaced the filter by putting in a second cartridge for two or three weeks and then replacing the original cartridge. There was always at least one cartridge that had had a chance to grow bacteria seeded from an older filter.

I realize the tank is re-cycling. What I don't understand is why, and why it's taking so long - after probably two months of this I still have no nitrite reading at all. I'm doing water changes daily to try and remove the ammonia - should I stop doing these as they're probably doing more harm than good?

I've removed all the ornaments but left the live plants. That combined with daily water changes (which I've been doing for weeks) as far as I can tell should be raising the pH to 7. Why isn't my pH changing?

I only removed the ornaments a few days ago; if the pH remains unchanged in a week or so I'll try the crushed coral. Maybe I'll take the tetras back to the fish store; there's no point them dying because my tank is overstocked..

Thanks for the help,

Isaac

 

[rdd1952]

I think the problem is that even though the tank was cycled, the pH has dropped to a level where the nirtification process has stopped. The bacteria, though probably still present, have gone dormant and aren't processing ammonia any more.

It may take a while to get the pH back up. The quantity of fish you have may be producing too much CO2 and driving the pH down. Adding some aeration may help drive out the CO2 and raise it back up some. Water changes will raise it back up temporarily but what ever is causing it to drop will pull it right back down.

The one good thing with the low pH is that the ammonia is probably ammonium and non-toxic.

 

[isaac338]

I think the problem is that even though the tank was cycled, the pH has dropped to a level where the nirtification process has stopped. The bacteria, though probably still present, have gone dormant and aren't processing ammonia any more.

It may take a while to get the pH back up. The quantity of fish you have may be producing too much CO2 and driving the pH down. Adding some aeration may help drive out the CO2 and raise it back up some. Water changes will raise it back up temporarily but what ever is causing it to drop will pull it right back down.

The one good thing with the low pH is that the ammonia is probably ammonium and non-toxic.

That's probably true as the fish all seem happy and active, and are all eating.

I'm going to put the bubble wand and air pump back in to help with aeration. Once the pH rises again I'll reintroduce ornaments one by one and monitor the pH.

Thanks for the advice.