Very Unhappy Dwarf Gourami

[gforce17]

My blue male dwarf gourami is not a happy bunny, or fish. He seems healthy but has been skulking quietly at the bottom of the tank for days now, not bothering to come up to the surface to feed. The other dwarfs are fine. I think you'll advise me that the beta is the problem but I don't witness him pestering the sad one. The neons are not shoaling either. Any thoughts please?

64 litre aquarium

4 zebra danios
1 male dwarf gourami (blue)
1 female dwarf gourami (blue)
1 male dwarf gourami (orange)
1 female dwarf gourami (orange)
1 male honey gourami
1 female honey gourami
4 neon tetras
1 Siamese Fighter
2 male rainbow platys

 

[ZoddyZod]

that's quite a few male gourami in together.....not something I'd recommend. However, if you aren't seeing any bullying then it sounds like he's ill. The problem with DGs is that they can become quite reclusive and then drop dead on you for apparently no reason (I've had a couple do this).

Are there any signs of bloating or stringy faeces?

 

[fizzlesticks]

That seems overstocked for 64 L. What are the water parameters? Perhaps something's up due to overcrowding.

 

[gforce17]

All water parameters OK - measured regularly and monitored by Seneye. Weekly water changes 25%.

 

[Fishy friend2]

What are the specific water parameters, and could it be DG disease?

 

[gforce17]

ammonia 0.001
PH 6.42
Nitrate 0
Temp 75.2

Dwarf Gourami Disease - could be - no real external symptoms, but I think that's quite common

 

[gforce17]

Just noticed a bump developing under the gill area. I think its the disease. According to one site I just read we should never buy DGs because they're all likely to be infected due to farming processes. Do others agree???

 

[afremont]

Just noticed a bump developing under the gill area. I think its the disease. According to one site I just read we should never buy DGs because they're all likely to be infected due to farming processes. Do others agree???

After you do a bunch more reading you'll see that dwarf gourami disease is blamed for virtually everything that kills one. One person (neal?) seems to be single handedly responsible for most of the accusations you read about when trying to research DGD. It's my understanding that DGD takes a fair amount of time to kill the fish and in the end the fish will be wasted away and have open sores. I have seen many die, but I've yet to personally see one die like that.

I see that your ammonia levels aren't exactly zero, but they are close. I'm more concerned about your nitrIte levels, DGs are especially sensitive to nitrIte levels. They also seem to be quite prone to parasites, both external and internal as well as to bacterial infections. I believe the infections are due to them being basically sickly fish. They are extremely inbred to obtain the almost solid colorations of the varieties. I have also read that many breeders feed the fish antibiotics continually. No wonder they seem to drop like flies when they are shipped.

The virus was a big deal, but it has been several years since then. It was fish originating from Asia that were responsible for the disease. Now, I believe many are bred in the US so they shouldn't be carrying anything by now. I would think by now that if true DGD were still a serious issue then they just wouldn't bother selling them since there is no stopping the virus. I also can't help but wonder how such a high percentage (as they used to claim) would be infected without virtually wiping out the world population back then.

I'd really suspect parasites in the case of your fish, but I'd also expect the fish to still have an apetite. Does he look thin anywhere? Have you seen any poop, that's a pretty good indicator of what might be wrong depending upon how it looks. Of course fish that don't eat tend not to poop much. Try enticing him with some frozen bloodworms. Is the fish panting and hiding?

 

[gforce17]

Thanks for that very useful info! He's not panting, but hiding. I fed them some frozen tubifex this morning and he didn't seem to eat any as it loaded past him. He doesn't look particularly thin at the moment. Should I try some anti parasite medication?

 

[afremont]

Thanks for that very useful info! He's not panting, but hiding. I fed them some frozen tubifex this morning and he didn't seem to eat any as it loaded past him. He doesn't look particularly thin at the moment. Should I try some anti parasite medication?

To be honest, I haven't had all that great of luck with them when they won't eat. If it won't eat bloodworms, then it's probably not going to eat. Since it's not panting that's a good sign it doesn't have gill parasites. Fish with internal parasites usually eat fine because they are very hungry since the parasites are taking it all.

I really don't know what to suggest. It could be some kind of infection causing the bump to come up. Is it red? Does it look like it might develop into an open sore? Does he go to the surface every few minutes or so for a breath of air?

EDIT: Seachem has a product out that treats "everything".
http/www.seachem.com/Products/product_pages/PolyGuard.html
I have never even seen it, much less used it. I think it must be fairly new. It's a shotgun approach, but at least it's supposed to be a safe combination. You don't seem to have any fungal issues though, so there may be better choices. Another broad spectrum antibiotic that might be worth a try is Maracyn Plus. They claim it sticks to the fish to help get it into their bodies when they don't want to eat. It's apparently a pretty good antibiotic to boot.

He could have a virus, but there's really no way to treat that so ruling that out should do no real harm. Either the fish's immune system will beat it or not. So you want to do everything you can to boost his immune system regardless. This means plenty of fresh water and a good temperature of around 80F. You want to keep his stress level down as much as possible too. Keeping the lights down will help.

Since your fish is not very thin, then it should take at least a couple of weeks to starve. If it dies after a couple of days of not eating then something else will have been responsible.

Everything I've written is with the assumption that you have not had any ammonia or nitrIte issues that brought this on. Also bullying tank mates can make the fish do what you're seeing.