Using food, or bottled amonia for cycle?

[Luke_burrell]

Just a quick question really, I have been cycling my tank for about 2 weeks using tropical fish flakes to generate amonia. I have one live Anubis plant that is growing exceptionally well. The cycle is going well and all water parameters are normal for an ongoing cycle. I am just curious to know if I should start using pure bottled amonia like a lot of people reccomend and dosing to 4ppm?

 

[Essjay]

Using fish flakes has two problems.

Modern flakes are designed so they don't make much ammonia.
With flakes you have no idea how much ammonia is actually going into the water so you can't know if you have grown enough ammonia to get a lot of fish after the cycle. You have to stock slowly as for fish-in cycling.

Using a bottle of ammonia is far easier and means you can get all but the more sensitive fish (ie fish that do better in mature tanks) once the cycle has finished. But don't use 4 ppm, 3 ppm is plenty. The method for using ammonia is written up here http://www.fishforums.net/forums/cycle-your-tank.291/ If followed exactly, it won't generate enough nitrite to stall the cycle, which is what happens if too much ammonia is added. If you look at the How To Tips at the top of the page you'll find the calculator. At the bottom of the calculator is the dosage calculator for ammonia.


Since the anubias on its own won't use much ammonia (and a lot of plants in a tank avoids the need for fishless cycling, but I mean a lot of plants) you'll need to use the full 3 ppm ammonia for cycling. But I would take the plant out during cycling - since anubias is grown attached to decor that shouldn't be a problem. Just keep it in a container of water till it can go back in the tank.

 

[Luke_burrell]

Using fish flakes has two problems.

Modern flakes are designed so they don't make much ammonia.
With flakes you have no idea how much ammonia is actually going into the water so you can't know if you have grown enough ammonia to get a lot of fish after the cycle. You have to stock slowly as for fish-in cycling.

Using a bottle of ammonia is far easier and means you can get all but the more sensitive fish (ie fish that do better in mature tanks) once the cycle has finished. But don't use 4 ppm, 3 ppm is plenty. The method for using ammonia is written up here http://www.fishforums.net/forums/cycle-your-tank.291/ If followed exactly, it won't generate enough nitrite to stall the cycle, which is what happens if too much ammonia is added. If you look at the How To Tips at the top of the page you'll find the calculator. At the bottom of the calculator is the dosage calculator for ammonia.


Since the anubias on its own won't use much ammonia (and a lot of plants in a tank avoids the need for fishless cycling, but I mean a lot of plants) you'll need to use the full 3 ppm ammonia for cycling. But I would take the plant out during cycling - since anubias is grown attached to decor that shouldn't be a problem. Just keep it in a container of water till it can go back in the tank.

Using fish flakes has two problems.

Modern flakes are designed so they don't make much ammonia.
With flakes you have no idea how much ammonia is actually going into the water so you can't know if you have grown enough ammonia to get a lot of fish after the cycle. You have to stock slowly as for fish-in cycling.

Using a bottle of ammonia is far easier and means you can get all but the more sensitive fish (ie fish that do better in mature tanks) once the cycle has finished. But don't use 4 ppm, 3 ppm is plenty. The method for using ammonia is written up here http://www.fishforums.net/forums/cycle-your-tank.291/ If followed exactly, it won't generate enough nitrite to stall the cycle, which is what happens if too much ammonia is added. If you look at the How To Tips at the top of the page you'll find the calculator. At the bottom of the calculator is the dosage calculator for ammonia.


Since the anubias on its own won't use much ammonia (and a lot of plants in a tank avoids the need for fishless cycling, but I mean a lot of plants) you'll need to use the full 3 ppm ammonia for cycling. But I would take the plant out during cycling - since anubias is grown attached to decor that shouldn't be a problem. Just keep it in a container of water till it can go back in the tank.

so using bottled amonia would be quicker and overall a more reliable solution for cycling the tank? Would I also have to account for current amonia levels in the tank before dosing?

 

[Essjay]

Ooops, the link I gave was to the whole cycling section
This is the fishless cycling method http://www.fishforums.net/threads/cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first.421488/

You could do one of two things:
Check your tank water to find the level of ammonia in there, then add enough ammonia from a bottle to top it up to 3 ppm for the first dose and count this as Day 1 (in the actual method, second link).
Or if you prefer, empty and refill the tank and add the whole 3 ppm from the bottle.

Whichever you do, remove as much fish food as you can.

 

[eaglesaquarium]

I would recommend the bottled ammonia as well, because it is easier to control... but the full dose amount is 3ppm, rather than 4. And it only gets added a few times, when certain milestones are hit. Follow the directions on the second link essjay posted (haha). The only change to those instructions I'd suggest in this particular situation would be daily tests rom the beginning, as your cycle has already been going for a while, so that you know where in the process you are already.

If I had to guess, the ammonia bacs are probably doing a nice job ticking over some ammonia already, and the nitrite colony is just about to get going in earnest.

 

[StevenF]

Modern flakes are designed so they don't make much ammonia.

This is largely a myth. you cannot remove nitrogen from food without destroying its nutritional value. I believe this myth got started because people put food in the tank and got less ammonia than they expected. I reality they just didn't add enough food. to get the amount of ammonia they wanted. Also different foods have different levels of nutrients in them.

The key to using food to cycle is to measure the ammonia in the water and adjust the amount of food you add until you reach your target. Another thing to keep in mind adding food brings with it a lot of minerals that can speed up the cycling process. Bacteria don't just need ammonia to grow, They also need potassium, sodium, phosphate, sulfate, iron and about a dozen more. So in some ways adding food will be more effective than just adding ammonia. It all depends on the mineral content of your water out of the tap. If you water is hard just adding ammonia will probably work. if you have soft water just adding ammonia it will cycle slowly. If you have distilled or RO water just adding ammonia will not work at all.