Urgent Help-Rummynose Deaths

[Jamie24]

130 ltr tropical tank, I've got 8 Sterbai Cories & 5 Otto's that I've had for about 2-3 months with absolutely no problems & no deaths, I went out yesterday & purchased 10 Rummynose Tetra, all seemed well darting around, red faced & they were feeding until around 9pm lastnight the group split up in the tank & some hung around the top, there was no visual problems but I just sensed something was wrong so tested the water... I dont see a problem with these results but tell me what you think

PH 6.7
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0.05
Nitrate 0
Temp 25


I did my weekly waterchange on Friday the day before getting the fish & those were the results last night at 9pm.

This morning I've woken up to 3 Tetra on there back/side not looking very good at all & I'm sure they will die despite my moving & treating them for infections, 1 Tetra I can't find at all despite a good search & up to now the other 6 are still living in the middle level, seem ok but not schooling.

Anyone any ideas as to what might cause this or might it simply be the stress of the move ??

 

[garry123]

how did you introduce you rummynose into your tank?

your nitrite should also be zero so that may need to be adressed

rummynoses are sensitive fish and the are more likely to be affected by the above

garry

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Nitrite 0.05? Are you sure that is not 0.5, normal test kits cannot detect 0.05?

0.5 nitrtite is lethal, I would do a massive water change, at least 75% (basically removing all but enough water to cover the fish).

In fact, I would do a massive water change anyway, if fish are looking bad with no obvious syptoms of disease.

If you have a dechlorinator like Seachem Prime that will mop up ammonia/nitrite/nitrate temporarily, add an emergency excess dose (5x for Prime i.e. 25ml per 200 litres).

 

[Jamie24]

how did you introduce you rummynose into your tank?

your nitrite should also be zero so that may need to be adressed

rummynoses are sensitive fish and the are more likely to be affected by the above

garry

I introduced them same as the others, float the bag for 30 mins, gradually add water & all that... How to address the 0.05 Nitrite ? It'll get converted into Nitrate soon enough, possibly already done but I've not tested yet this morning... I read somewhere that Rummynose were hardy fish & thought the Otto's were the most sensitive from my bunch ??

Nitrite 0.05? Are you sure that is not 0.5, normal test kits cannot detect 0.05?

0.5 nitrtite is lethal, I would do a massive water change, at least 75% (basically removing all but enough water to cover the fish).

In fact, I would do a massive water change anyway, if fish are looking bad with no obvious syptoms of disease.

If you have a dechlorinator like Seachem Prime that will mop up ammonia/nitrite/nitrate temporarily, add an emergency excess dose (5x for Prime i.e. 25ml per 200 litres).

I use prime & a JBL test kit which does have 0.05 as a reading on the sheet

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Just googled that JBL nitrite test kit, something new learnt in the last few minutes.

In your situation, I would add 5ml of Prime now (to try and give instant relief to those Rummynose on thie sides/back against any toxins) and then start a 90-95% water change.

 

[Jamie24]

Just googled that JBL nitrite test kit, something new learnt in the last few minutes.

In your situation, I would add 5ml of Prime now (to try and give instant relief to those Rummynose on thie sides/back against any toxins) and then start a 90-95% water change.

I've added Prime to the tank for the reason you've given, the three fish that I've removed (been primed) are well on the way to fish heaven unfortunately, I'll crack on with the water change but all in all are we now saying 0.05 isn't all that bad which I first suspected ??

The other fish are lively as anything but you any idea where the missing tetra might have gone, I've checked the filter plus the intake isn't big enough & I searched under wood/rocks & still no joy, 98% sure the Cories & Otto's wouldn't have touched it.... I'll gve it another week then I purchase some more Rummynose (from a different place) to get the numbers back into double figures.

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Detectable nitrite is not good, but 0.5 is a much mire serious situation than 0.05, thats for sure.

Has the tank got a lid? Nitrite will initially bring the fish towards the water surface and perhaps one could have jumped out of the tank. Pretty much all fish will treat dead tankmates as extra food and in warm water, dead fish decompose very quickly. At other times, you can be convinced someone is missing and then discover everyone is present and correct some hours later (I thought my female Golden Wonder Killifish swallowed two Rainbow Congo tetras whole within seocnds of their introduction, only to find all 7 were still alive ~30 minutes later and having removed the "naughty" killifish).

If it was me, I would hold fire on new Rummynose until I had at least two weeks of 0 ammonia or nitrite, plus no more deaths.

As a general comment on your stocking, you do have a lot of water quality sensitive species for such a young tank, I would not consider adding any of them to a tank that was not stable (as in no ammonia/nitrite spikes) and had not matured for at least two months.

 

[Jamie24]

Detectable nitrite is not good, but 0.5 is a much mire serious situation than 0.05, thats for sure.

Has the tank got a lid? Nitrite will initially bring the fish towards the water surface and perhaps one could have jumped out of the tank. Pretty much all fish will treat dead tankmates as extra food and in warm water, dead fish decompose very quickly. At other times, you can be convinced someone is missing and then discover everyone is present and correct some hours later (I thought my female Golden Wonder Killifish swallowed two Rainbow Congo tetras whole within seocnds of their introduction, only to find all 7 were still alive ~30 minutes later and having removed the "naughty" killifish).

If it was me, I would hold fire on new Rummynose until I had at least two weeks of 0 ammonia or nitrite, plus no more deaths.

As a general comment on your stocking, you do have a lot of water quality sensitive species for such a young tank, I would not consider adding any of them to a tank that was not stable (as in no ammonia/nitrite spikes) and had not matured for at least two months.

Thanks for the advice, I did do a 3 month fishless cycle before adding the Cories then the Otto's 1 month after, Including the fishless cycle the tank has been going for 5 month (it's in it's 6th) the tank does have a lid yes.

 

[pablothebetta]

While it's great you did a fishless cycle, I'm not sure why you've got nitrItes in the tank now - are you sure you completed it fully (time-wise this would seem acceptable though)?
I'd definitely do a w/c as previously advised and check the nitrIte levels again.

 

[Jamie24]

While it's great you did a fishless cycle, I'm not sure why you've got nitrItes in the tank now - are you sure you completed it fully (time-wise this would seem acceptable though)?
I'd definitely do a w/c as previously advised and check the nitrIte levels again.

From the 10 Rummynose only 2 are now left, did a 30% water change as that's all I had time to do due to me going the rugby today & overdosed with Prime ... Tested Nitrites when I got home just & there 0.01 possibly 0.02 but now my Otto's are near the top of the tank clinging on the back wall but still near the top.

 

[Prime Ordeal]

You added 10 fish to a tank containing 13 fish. You will always get a small cycle happening when you almost double the quantity of fish all at once. That explains your nitrite. In fact I think you got off lightly as I would have exected an ammonia and nitrite rise. Anyway it'll correct itself in a couple of days.

There are then three possibilities for the rummy deaths.

1. Not enough care taken with the acclimatisation - I know you did the bag float and add tank water, but perhaps it just wasn't sufficient.
2. Dodgy batch of rummies
3. There isn't enough oxygen in the tank. The corys and otos will be ok because they can breath from the surface but the rummies can't. Is your filter output disturbing the surface water as much as possible. Do you have an airstone?

 

[Jamie24]

You added 10 fish to a tank containing 13 fish. You will always get a small cycle happening when you almost double the quantity of fish all at once. That explains your nitrite. In fact I think you got off lightly as I would have exected an ammonia and nitrite rise. Anyway it'll correct itself in a couple of days.

There are then three possibilities for the rummy deaths.

1. Not enough care taken with the acclimatisation - I know you did the bag float and add tank water, but perhaps it just wasn't sufficient.
2. Dodgy batch of rummies
3. There isn't enough oxygen in the tank. The corys and otos will be ok because they can breath from the surface but the rummies can't. Is your filter output disturbing the surface water as much as possible. Do you have an airstone?

Yea the output is disturbing the water but cant be adjusted however I also have an airstone on near enough full power so honestly don't see that as the problem, I was thinking the same about the spike, maybe I should of added 6 then 6 or something around that mark, the most I've added at one point was the 8 Sterbai's... After doing more research I think the Harlequin Rasboras are the safer route as Rummynoses can be very sensitive.

Problem I now have is I have 1 Rummy left which has survived the 3 days & although I don't want to add any more for the reason above will I have to so that he has his own type ?? Will be die on his own ??