Upgrading And "avoiding" Cycling.

[tanzen]

I tried searching the forums and couldn't find anything on my question.

So say you were to upgrade an already existing and well established aquarium to a much larger one. To "skip" the cycling process, could you simply transfer everything (all the water, substrate, decorations, plants, filter, etc.) from the old tank to the new? Being that the new tank would have all of the same elements and biological filter, even down to the same water as the old tank, theoretically, the new tank would be cycled, yes? Or would that just be a long and drawn out form of "mega-seeding" the new tank?

What are your ideas on this, would it work?

[And on transfering the filter, obviously the filter from the old tank would have to be able to accomodate the new.]

 

[mwood2]

It should work. I have done this a few times before and it worked out fine, no deaths or anything. Although I just upgraded my 10 to a 20 long and moving everything over and seem to have lost my cycle somehow. It should be fine but I dont know what I personally did wrong.

 

[timbruun]

That should work. I started a 90gallon with 1 of the 2 filters from my 55gallon and it worked perfect. And it was only the filter I used. New water, substrate. And the 90 was actually a stocked a bit more.

 

[blodhi74]

I moved from a 20 to 33GL and worked fine.

 

[ellena]

The other thing you'd have to keep the same between the 2 tanks that you didn't mention is the number of fish. The filter is up to coping with that bioload so you'd have to add further fish slowly in small numbers to build up the stock for the bigger tank

 

[JustKia]

By upgrade can I assume that all current fish will move into the new tank?
If so then simply set up the new tank with fresh dechlorinated water, try to match the pH and temp to your current tank as much as possible then swap over the filter and fish.

You don't need to move over the substrate and decor unless you want too.
You don't need to move the water over - the beneficial bacteria are in the filter not the water, so there's really very little point in doing that - unless of course you like hard work =)

 

[tubthumped]

I doubled my tank size recently, i kept the same filter (as it was adequate for the new tank) and the same number of fish.

I set up the new tank in location.
Filled with sand substrate.
Inserted all decoration (some from mature tank, some new).
Half filled with fresh, treated tap water.
Fitted a spare heater (I always have a spare, just in case) and set to the same temp as my existing tank.
I then left it for most of a day whilst the tank got up to temp.
Filled the rest of the tank with water from my mature tank.
I then set about catching the fish in the remaining 3 inches of water in my old tank - MUCH EASIER than chasing them around a full tank.
On catching they were plopped straight into the new tank.
Once all the fish were over into the new tank I moved my filter over and turned it on.

I had no problems, all fish survived and the tank is going from strength to strength. It was basically a long winded 50% water change.

 

[fatheadminnow]

It is perfectly doable!

Just make sure your filter is big enough for your new tank. Meaning that your filter will provide AT LEAST a 5x turn over rate of your tank in one(1) hour.

Also, if you do decide to use 100% new water, which I would not recommend, this could have a negative affect on your bacteria. It is not that the bacteria don't colonize in the water, because they colonize in the filter, it is because if you add 100% new water, meaning a 0 ppm of ammonia, this will usually "shock" the bacteria and the bacteria may stop in production for a couple days.

So, I would at least use a little bit of you old water, and mix it with new water, just not to "shock" you bacteria.

Other than that, you should be just fine!

-FHM

 

[JustKia]

The bacteria will be fine, so long as you dechlor the water - there is really no need to move the old water too.
Leave the filter on the old tank while the new one comes up to temp then move fish and filter at the same time.
It's not going to "shock" your bacs as the fish will start producing waste the moment they go in the tank - ammonia is produced as the fish respire, not just when they go to the "loo".

 

[fatheadminnow]

The bacteria will be fine, so long as you dechlor the water - there is really no need to move the old water too.
Leave the filter on the old tank while the new one comes up to temp then move fish and filter at the same time.
It's not going to "shock" your bacs as the fish will start producing waste the moment they go in the tank - ammonia is produced as the fish respire, not just when they go to the "loo".

Yes, I know that the majority of ammoina is produced through respiration. But, it takes time for the ammonia level to rise up to where it was in the previous tank. It is also like when doing a large 90-100% water change during a fishless cycle. Sometimes after which, the ammonia that was being processed before, has not gone down in a day or so.

I did not say it will happen, I just said it may happen, and it is best to use a little bit of water from your previous tank to ensure the bacs don't do this.

I have also witnessed this first hand with one of my tanks. Where I got MM from my 55 gallon tank and put it into my 10 gallon tank where I was fishless cycling. It took a while for these bacteria to start to process ammonia again. They did not do so right away.

Here is what I did:

Filled tank with 100% new dechlorinized water, added up to 5 ppm of ammonia and added mature filter media. The ammonia level did not start to go down for sometime.

Here is a link to my fishless cycle thread, as you can clearly see where I am coming from.

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=306731&hl=

-FHM

 

[JustKia]

All I'm saying is that you can move water if you want, but there is no need.
After all there is no build up of ammonia in the old water - if you do a test (one would hope) the ammonia will read 0.
This isn't a fishless cycle, it's moving fish and filter from one tank to a bigger one. I moved mine all over just a few weeks ago, from 33Gal to 72Gal.
New tank, new dechlor, temp matched water, move fish, move filter, sit back and enjoy

It's not like putting the filter on the new tank then filling up with untreated tap water, leaving it overnight then adding in the fish.