Suggest Some Plants?

[Ian H]

ok i have a 83gal tank with 160 watts of light (so that makes it just under 2wpg right?) so what plants would grow well? no co2 or ferts (i have root tabs under each plant though) I'm willing to get some ferts for it though but dont think i can afford a co2 system plus i dont think i have enough light for it to be worth while. Anyways heres a list of plants that i have now:

1 Echinodrus mix
1 Echinodrus cordifolius marble queen
1 Echinodrus rosea
3 Cryptocoryne beckettii
1 Cryptocoryne Wendtii
2 Hygrophilia Polysperma
1 Lindernia Rotundifolia
3 Java Fern

also can some one explain to me how good 2wpg in a big tank is compared to 2wpg in a small tank??

 

[lljdma06]

ok i have a 83gal tank with 160 watts of light (so that makes it just under 2wpg right?) so what plants would grow well? no co2 or ferts (i have root tabs under each plant though) I'm willing to get some ferts for it though but dont think i can afford a co2 system plus i dont think i have enough light for it to be worth while. Anyways heres a list of plants that i have now:

1 Echinodrus mix
1 Echinodrus cordifolius marble queen
1 Echinodrus rosea
3 Cryptocoryne beckettii
1 Cryptocoryne Wendtii
2 Hygrophilia Polysperma
1 Lindernia Rotundifolia
3 Java Fern

also can some one explain to me how good 2wpg in a big tank is compared to 2wpg in a small tank??

The plants on your list will do fine in the WPG you have. Infact, they'll do very well, but, for a tank your size, I highly recommend injecting CO2 and dosing ferts with your current WPG. The general WPG is based on tanks between 20-75g and normal output T8 flourescent bulbs, with the ideal gallonage between 20-55g. When a tank is larger, WPG breaks down as a guideline because it takes less light to get the equivalent light levels in say a 30g tank, which conforms well to WPG. On the other hand, when the tank is less than 20g, WPG as a guideline begins to breakdown because more light is needed to get the equivalent lighting level in say a 30g tank. That's why you see some 2g nanos here with crazy WPG (8+) and large tanks with only 1WPG growing plants that wouldn't grow in a 20g with 1.7WPG. T5s and CFs only further confuse the matter, as they have a higher light output. You need less light to get the same effect.

I haven't exactly figured out the ballpark ratios yet, but I've always wanted to see if I could adapt WPG for larger and smaller tanks, not to get a textbook accurate level, there are far superior light calculations for that (they are too taxing for my wee brain, though ) but to generalize enough that people like you should be able to proceed without freaking about whether or not their lighting levels are going to be sufficient or low enough that they don't need CO2 or ferts to grow plants well.

Hope this helps a bit.

 

[Ian H]

Well i'm off to buy some ferts tomorrow but not sure on the co2 due to the price of it! i thought about the fire extinguisher method but don't want to die/have my house blown to bits so i don't know

glad to hear i have decent lighting anyways

 

[backtotropical]

Don't dose ferts with high light and no CO2. Thats what i did and boy did i get algae!

You need CO2 before ferts, or neither, i think. I'm sure someone will correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[Ian H]

oh well there goes that idea then!! although i do fancy some ottos so it could come in handy

 

[Ian H]

Right this could be even more expenisive than i though!! was in a lfs earlier and saw a co2 kit for £199 cheaper than i though so was having a look at it but noticed it said for upto 250L, i have 380L so any suggestions?? looks like it cost bloody loads!

 

[Ian H]

bit of a bump

all the plants seem to be growing well with just water/light/root tabs

the java moss i got from smithrc (ta very much ) is slowly starting to grow out a bit now on the coconut shells i put in there so they are starting to look good. After christmas im hoping they will be loads better

I think i might treat myself to a co2 kit after chrimbo, i did think about a diy set up with coke bottles, but i don't want to over dose!!

 

[SuperColey1]

You can dose ferts without CO2 and this is part of the instruction on TBs Non CO2 tanks section. The difference is that you reduce the ferts to much smaller concentrations.

As to the lighting problem. The WPG rule was actually based on T12s and we have moved on quite a bit since those days. So if you have T12s with reflectors then you can quite rightly assume your WPG is as per the simple equation W/USG.

I am trying to find a simple table that was on APC that explained how many watts of each type of light were needed to place it in a group. I personally don't agree with the measurements but they are better than the basic WPG rule.

These articles were talking about 1W T12 = 1.25W T10 = 1.5W T8 = 1.75W PC T5.

This is due to reflection as much as the improved lights as more reflected light hits the bulb when it returns from the reflector if the bulb is wider.

The part I didn't agre with was when asked what about T5s the creator of this table laughably said "T5 Power Compacts are T5 linears just folded in half!!!!". This is correct but the reflected light part means that a T5 with reflector will (after reflection) put more light into the tank than a PC.

We also now have HO (High Output) T5 linears as well so the confusion goes on.

The figures quoted above are too high IMO as I don't beleive a PC is 1.75 x a T12 but it gives a jist of what I am saying.

I have had a darned good look for where I saw the chart with no luck but if I do come across it again I will post it up as even if I don't agree with the figures it is a better guide than the general rule guide.

Assuming that all examples have GOOD reflectors I would say that from T12 to T8 there would be a slight rise then a large jump to power compacts, a small increase to T5 and then another small rise to T5 HO where the T5HO may be up to as much as 2x the WPG rule!!!. Pure speculation but I can say from experience that the T5 HO is visibally brighter than all below it to the point that my '1.8WPG' grows high light plants with no problems.

As to your initial question I would get a single Nuphar Japonica. I put a small example which was 5 inches tall and about 3 inches wide in my 33USG (looked like a lettuce heart) and now it is 20" tall and the leaf tips touch the glass on all sides!!!

i.e. it is 80cm/30inches from tip to tip. (Sorry I have pruned it so can't show you a pic of this) The plants leaves are a glorious shade of green with 'alien nation' like markings around the edges of the plant.

In a longer larger tank I think it would make a stunning feature plant placed in 1 side of the tank and standing above all the plants below it, which allows you to fill that side with low light lovers whilst being able to put high light plants or a carpet in the other half.

It is the plant just left of centre and this is mid September this year

2½ months on and this is the same plant AFTER pruning. lol

Andy

 

[lljdma06]

As to the lighting problem. The WPG rule was actually based on T12s and we have moved on quite a bit since those days. So if you have T12s with reflectors then you can quite rightly assume your WPG is as per the simple equation W/USG.

Andy

Ooops! I meant T12. Gosh, do they still make those things? They must be huge!

Have you read this article Andy?

http/woo.gotdns.com/Aquarium/Lighting.htm

It helped me a lot.