Starting A New Low Light Planted Set-up

[scouse_andy]

I am planning a complete overhaul of my Juwel Rio 300 in the coming weeks and had a few questions....

Just to give you some background, I have some experience of low light set-ups and over the last 6 months have finally got a nice balance in my Rio 240, about 1.5 WPG, no CO2 or ferts, garden soil substrate under silica sand but I had to do a lot of rescaping and throwing out of unsuitable plants and deal with algae outbreaks to get to that point.

I have already bought Tetraplant complete substrate and will put a layer of fine rounded gravel over the top of this. Light in the tank is going to be just under 1.5 WPG, it's the same lighting unit as in my Rio 240 but the tank is a few cm deeper and I do not especially want to dose EI or use CO2. I am satisfied with fairly slow but steady plant growth of some relatively undemanding species (this has the added benefit of little or no pruning ).

The plants I would like to include are a selection of crypts and some Sagittaria Subulata for the foreground, an Onion plant and some amazon swords for the midground and a line of vallis all along the back of the tank.

I am fairly confident that the substrate and light level will be enough to sustain plant growth although I have no experience of the Sags for the foreground, this month's PFK seems to suggest I will be OK with this.

My questions are the following:

1. If I were to plant all of this together at the same time with a photoperiod of about 5 hours (as I have in my existing set-up under very similar conditions) would I be likely to have major algae problems? Do I have to go through the rigmarole of planting lots of fast growing stems to cover most of the substrate at the start to win the algae battle before gradually replacing them with the crypts, swords etc.?

2. I am going to be stocking 6 plecs with caves and bogwood etc. They are all plant friendly in terms of diet and none are bigger than about 6 inches but is their clumsiness going to cause major uprooting problems? I'm thinking here mainly about the sags and maybe the vallis too.

3. Co2 is really a definite no-no, I found all the fiddling with diffusers and yeast mix far too much of a hassle personally and can't justify the expense of pressurised. Would adding ferts but no Co2 make a big difference to a set up like this where I am after healthy sustained growth rather than rampant growth requiring loads of pruning?

I'm particularly interested in answers to Q1 as I would really like to just plant how I want from the outset as I know from experience the kind of light demands (number of hrs) that most of these plants need in this type of set-up. I do have a pair of BN plecs and some SAEs to put in there to eat small amounts of algae but am obviously keen to avoid a major outbreak.

Any help much appreciated as always.

Cheers, Andy

 

[lljdma06]

1. If I were to plant all of this together at the same time with a photoperiod of about 5 hours (as I have in my existing set-up under very similar conditions) would I be likely to have major algae problems? Do I have to go through the rigmarole of planting lots of fast growing stems to cover most of the substrate at the start to win the algae battle before gradually replacing them with the crypts, swords etc.?

If I were doing this, I would plant some stems initially. Bacopa caroliana will do particularly well in your setup, it has done well for me. It is a relatively sturdy stem and its leaves are pretty tough (good for plecos). You can also plant the majority of your rooted plants, especially the crypts and swords. I've not worked with Sag and vallis, but they should be fine as well, though the plecs may uproot runners. Why only a 5 hour photo period? That seems awefully short to me. My low-light tanks usually have between 8-12 hours depending on the system. Is this tank near a window, or is the room well lit? If so, I've a trick for you that I use with my tiny nano to avoid algae. The cuttings of Pothos (Epipremnum aureum), a terrestrial house plant, grows extremely well with its stems partially submerged, with the leaves emergent. They are excellent consuming excess nutrients that may trigger an algae bloom. I have used it in my nano with great success, as it is quite overstocked and I feed robustly. Just make sure that the cuttings have been rinsed thoroughly to avoid contaminating the tank with chemical fertilisers. This may not work, however in your tank, if it is completely closed. Then, the stems are your best bet.

2. I am going to be stocking 6 plecs with caves and bogwood etc. They are all plant friendly in terms of diet and none are bigger than about 6 inches but is their clumsiness going to cause major uprooting problems? I'm thinking here mainly about the sags and maybe the vallis too.

I don't forsee a huge problem with the plecs if the plants are established, with the initial planting, however, possibly with the sags and vallis, especially with any runners that may develop. I have pretty clumsy Brochis, so when they uproot, I just stick it back in. If you plant correctly, that is, deep enough, I really don't see a problem.

3. Co2 is really a definite no-no, I found all the fiddling with diffusers and yeast mix far too much of a hassle personally and can't justify the expense of pressurised. Would adding ferts but no Co2 make a big difference to a set up like this where I am after healthy sustained growth rather than rampant growth requiring loads of pruning?

In the tank's initially stages, I used CO2, and only had brief occurance of greenwater and thread algae. It is up to you, however, I don't think it is required for a tank of the type you're considering. The growth will be sufficient. Anubias are also an option for this setup.

Good luck, I look forward to seeing pictures of this setup. Your plecos will be pleased, I'm sure.

llj

 

[scouse_andy]

Thanks for all your advice and congratulations on being made moderator by the way.

Bacopa caroliana

I will definitely check this out

Why only a 5 hour photo period? That seems awefully short to me. My low-light tanks usually have between 8-12 hours depending on the system.

I started off with about 5 hrs then 2 hrs siesta then a further 5 hrs in my other tank and had algae problems. I played around with the times of the lighting and 5 hrs seemed about optimum to me - I realise this conflicts with the experience of many others - maybe now things are well established in my 240 I should up it a fair bit.

Anubias are also an option for this setup.

Yes, I've had anubias and java fern in the past, I don't plan to use it in the initial stages but when it's properly set-up I may add some to it.

Good luck, I look forward to seeing pictures of this setup.

Thank you, I will no doubt set up a new tank journal for this over the next few weeks.

 

[Kevstir]

would using excel be of benefit for the first wee while?? you could slowly decrease it to nil once the plants have established.

 

[scouse_andy]

That's the liquid CO2 stuff from Seachem right?

Yeah I could give that a go. What do others think?

I looked up the Bacopa Caroliniana and the light demands seem to be far in excess of my tank.

 

[lljdma06]

That's the liquid CO2 stuff from Seachem right?

Yeah I could give that a go. What do others think?

I looked up the Bacopa Caroliniana and the light demands seem to be far in excess of my tank.

Excel could work. I've never used it in such a large system, and it may be impractical.

Poopoo on the lighting demands for Bacopa. I've grown both monnerii and caroliniana in all my tanks at one point and it's done well. The lowest WPG was 1.4WPG in my 20g. Of course, there could be something in my water that Bacopa particularly likes. Could never get Cabomba to grow at all, whether it was a high-light or low-light tank. Cabomba never liked me. Other plants to look at include R. rotundifolia, Hygro species, Limnophyla, and everybody's favorite Egeria. The list in my signature lists more species.

llj

 

[scouse_andy]

That's the liquid CO2 stuff from Seachem right?

Yeah I could give that a go. What do others think?

I looked up the Bacopa Caroliniana and the light demands seem to be far in excess of my tank.

Excel could work. I've never used it in such a large system, and it may be impractical.

Poopoo on the lighting demands for Bacopa. I've grown both monnerii and caroliniana in all my tanks at one point and it's done well. The lowest WPG was 1.4WPG in my 20g. Of course, there could be something in my water that Bacopa particularly likes. Could never get Cabomba to grow at all, whether it was a high-light or low-light tank. Cabomba never liked me. Other plants to look at include R. rotundifolia, Hygro species, Limnophyla, and everybody's favorite Egeria. The list in my signature lists more species.

llj

Many thanks for this, I've grown bacopa monnieri no problems in similar light. Another one that worked amazingly well in my low tech set-up was mexican oak leaf, shame I threw it all out a while back.