Stalled Fishless Cycling

[Irf]

Hi all,

I've mentioned this on here before but the problem persists.

My sister's fishless cycling has stalled again, this tgime just after she's added a bit of extra ammonia to cover her absence for two days. The ammonia has not reduced from being at 8ppm.

The temp was 28c, and when it stalled she was at the stage where the ammonia was being processed within 24 hrs and she was waiting for the nitrite to drop.

She's now increased the temp to 30c, and done a 50% water change which ha brought the ammonia down to 4ppm. She's also done a pH test and found it to be 6! Oh, and she lives in Newport, apparently a soft water area. She doesn't have a hardness testing kit, but i will be taking mine up there on Monday.

Any ideas anyone? She's almost at her wit's end, having been fishless cycling now almost 3 months!

I may also take her some media from one of my tanks when I visit next week.

Thanks,

Irf.

 

[rdd1952]

Her pH is most likely the problem. As pH goes lower, nitrification slows until it almost stops at or below 6.0. She may need to add some crushed coral or other natural additives to raise the pH at least until the tank finishes cycling. She should also take some tap water to the fish store nd have them check the KH & GH so she knows what she is dealing with. Even in very soft water areas, it is possible to keep pH at least close to where it is from the tap. My KH is as low as it can get as my test never even turns blue but goes straight to yellow and my tanks do fine, even with some driftwood in them.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

is her pH actually reading 6? i ask because on a lot of test kits 6 is just the lowest reading, and any reading of that could actually be lower.

the nitrifying bacteria who develop below a pH of 5.5 are different to the ones you would usually find in your tank, they develop significantly slower. if these have developed you will find when she brings the pH up they die off and the cycle will start again.

I'd stop trying to even cycle the tank for now and try and get the pH up and start again, kick starting it with some media from your tank will mean it happens nice and quickly once the pH has been brought up.

 

[Irf]

This is great guys, thanks a lot.

Just so I'm sure I've got this right, the next steps should be.....

1. Stop trying to cycle until the pH can be raised
2. Carry out the pH rise by adding crushed coral into the filter media (I have some)
3. Add media fom my cycled tank that should kick-start the cycling process

At what stage should a water change be done in this list (if at all)?

Finally, still connected to this topic, if I was to transport some media to her - what's the best way to do it? I'm guessing in a "fish bag" with tank water, but considering that it will take around 12hrs to get to her do I need to add a drop or two of ammonia to the bag? Do you have experience of this?

Many many thanks again - she'll be so pleased that there is help out there!

Irf.

 

[rdd1952]

Since she is doing a fishless cycle, I would do a very large water change to get the pH up immediately and then the crushed coral can keep it up. After doing that and adding the media from your tank, it should proceed well.

 

[Irf]

Great, thanks for the advice. Any idea on the "transporting media" issue, or should I start another thread?

Irf.

 

[rdd1952]

It depends on how far you have to go. As long as you keep it wet, it should be fine for a couple hours.

 

[Irf]

Ahh - that's the problem you see. It's more like 12 hours! I've got to bring the filter in to work (Eheim Ecco), keep it here all day, and then take it up to Newport on the train. Perhaps if I put some ammonia in the tank water with the media? Or is that just plain silly?

Failing that, she's coming to visit the weekend after and she could take it home in the car. Max journey time of around 3 hours I guess.

What do you think?

Irf.

 

[rdd1952]

I'm not sure about the 12 hours. You could try the ammonia. The main thing is that there needs to be water flow to feed the bacteria. I would think that being in a bag with a little ammonia would help keep them alive. All of the bacteria wouldn't die off in that time frame anyway. I have accidentally left my filters off for 8 to 10 hours and experienced no problems. The 3 hour trip would be better but that would mean waiting another week and a half.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

bacteria will start to die off after 12 hrs, it may not be quite as effective as transferring it within an hr or two however it will still have some effect. i think adding some ammonia to the bag would help, and silly as it may sound giving it a bit of a swish around every couple of hrs if you can so teh water flows through the media at least a little.

 

[Irf]

OK, thanks all - will give it a try.....

Got a call from sis last night and she did a 50% water change. That took the pH back up to 7.3! And she reckons that th pH out of the tap is 7.5.

So what we're wondering is if it's possible that something in the tank is causing the pH to drop.... but there's nothing in there. No gravel, plants, wood, rocks or fish. Weird?

Anyway, now the ammonia is at 4ppm and the nitrite seems to have risen so hopefully it will resume.

Irf.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

pH does funny things while tanks are cycling sometimes!? Afraid it's a bit beyond me to explain the science behind it.