Poorly White Clouds

[Gypsy5]

Hi all, hoping someone may be able to enlighten me. I purchased four White Cloud Mountain Minnows nearly 2 weeks ago. All was fine until last Wednesday evening one of them looked as though it couldn't close it's mouth - it had it permanently open. Within half an hour it was floating about, sometimes upside down, in the water and then it would start swimming normally again. It kept on doing this, floating head down/up, tip over and then float about the tank until an hour later it just drifted to the bottom of the tank and died. No other marks on the fish.

All the other fish in the tank (2 Honey Gouramis, 2 Twin-tailed Guppies, 2 male Guppies and the 3 remaining Minnows) all seemed fine until today. We had noticed that the small Minnow was hanging around above the heater for the past few days but didn't put it down to anything. Noticed an hour ago that it's lost it's balance and is floating about the tank like the other did, it's mouth is closed though. Have done a 30% water change because of quite high nitrate reading last night and used API Tap Water Conditioner.

Last nights readings are: Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 40ppm (was 20 the evening before). The tank is 18" x 13" x 15".

Any advice?

 

[WILDER]

An open mouth can mean there something lodged in the mouth, or a sore to ulcer.
Hows the fish now.

 

[Gypsy5]

The one that is ill now doesn't have an open mouth, it was the one that died last week that had that. Sorry for any confusion.

The little fella is still with us but having to lodge himself in plants to keep from floating around. I have put some King British Revitaliser Tonic in the tank and done another (small) water change. Could it be Nitrate poisoning? I have some Melafix, do you think it would be worth using that and if so would it be safe for use on the same day as I've used the Tonic? Don't want to poison any of the fish in there but really really want to help this little guy.

 

[WILDER]

Sounds like they may have a bacterial infection a sore or ulcer in the mouth.
No your nitrate reading high enough to cause poisoning, what your tap nitrate reading.
I would use a stronger bacterial med then melafix.

http/www.fishtanksandponds.info/care-mai...swimbladder.htm

 

[Gypsy5]

I only have the Melafix in at the moment, could get something stronger tomorrow if he's still with us (recommend anything?) Could I use this with the Tonic?

 

[WILDER]

Tonics are a complete waste of money to be honest.
Anti internal bacteria med by interpet.
Good luck.

 

[-germ-]

I've had exactly the same thing happen recently,
1) died mouth open no lesions, mouth not blocked, behaviour similar to swimbladder
2) second died, no damage, mouth closed, same behaviour
3,4,5,6) died, pale saddle like marking either side of stomach, resting on plants then strong spasming before death
Hope that may add to the info for any disease knowledgable posters, if the early deaths are related to the latter and the problem you have is the same i encountered.
I still have two left although one has a slightly distended stomach i'm not sure if this is related.

Good luck!

Sorry quick one, gyp5y5 are you from manchester?
It may be a bad batch if we have used the same LFS....

 

[vinylman]

I only have the Melafix in at the moment, could get something stronger tomorrow if he's still with us (recommend anything?) Could I use this with the Tonic?

Just as a matter of interest, what temperature do you keep the tank at?. WCMM are essentially cool water fish; while they can be kept in lower Tropical temperatures, anything higher wouldn't be good for them.

 

[Gypsy5]

Not in Manchester, in Wakefield. My LFS where I got them from did comment last time I was in that they had to send loads of fish back to their supplier because they weren't well or were dead on arrival. It was these they were talking about and would have been a couple of batches after the shipment my Minnows came in but wondering if it's dodgy suppliers.

Temperature is now at 75 degrees F but was nearly 80 yesterday. Could something as simple as temperature do this?

The poorly fish has now died and now another is looking a bit iffy. My LFS advised me to move all fish over to my big tank as the nitrates are better in there (10/20ppm) cos it doesn't sound infectious. Just want to be sure that I'm not going to kill off all my other fish.

 

[-germ-]

Now theres a surprise! I got mine in timperley so i'd guess it is a bad local supplier....
Don't allow your temperature to fluctuate so much, minnows like a low temperature and quick moving water, google the temp i forget what it is. Temperature going up and down constantly can stress fish which make them more vulnerable to disease, i assume it goes deeper than that but i'm not so well informed.
Also theres no way i'd move my fish until i know what the cause of illness actually is. It isn't worth the risk.
If your convinced its due to nitrates;
I'd get two 25% water changes done before the end of the day, although not in one go; to prevent temp fluctuation. Also, and i may bet reprimanded for this, i'd buy a new small filter and put in a filter pad made by Seachem, it's called a purigen pad, i wouldn't run it permenantly, i'm experimenting with them at the moment and they can get a bit odd after a week or so. Nitrite and Nitrate dancing up and down, but you can be sure that within 24hours of putting a brand new one in that there will be almost no Nitrite and/ or Nitrate left in your tank. You could put it in your current filter, but like i say i'm not entirely convinced of their long term reliability or the effects they may have on your current cycling bacteria.
Its worth the investment i reckon....
Good luck again!

 

[Gypsy5]

The temperature is lower today because we turned down the heater. Worried about lowering it any more because of my other fish (2 Honey Gouramis, 4 Guppies). Have lready done a water change today and will do another one tonight (I always try to get the replacement water about the same temperature as that which I'm taking out.

Agree with you about moving over to the big tank. Feel very unsettled about it myself. Think I will keep water changing and testing for now and see what happens by the weekend.

 

[vinylman]

Can you put the WCMM in a tank by themselves; they really need to be kept in cooler water than tropicals would be comfortable with.