Petstores (in General)

[KingofthePisces]

i have seen the worst and the best but ive never seen these fish that are supposedly "dieing" from the mistreatment of these poor fish
dont hate me for this but its the truth in my eyes
you cant assume that because they have a bunch of oscars in a 15 gallon tank and the algae is going awyre because they killed the algae eater and the pet store members are too busy to find the time to clean them theirselves (in big citys etc) and you hate the fact that their fish tanks arnt quite meeting your requirements but you have to realise that your attention to a fishes home is WAY larger than theirs

personally i think you need to give the pet stores a chance. walmart is just a chain store, no matter how bad the quality is their still gonna sell you their crap until someone complains about it.
if you dont like their view towards fish keeping then start working there and fix that problem yourself because the superpowers really dont give a damn about what we say about how a certain oscar was in a tank too small for a few days until it got sold to some rich guy with a fish tank the size of alabama. The truth is: these fish arnt unhappy for long their only unhappy for the few weeks their in those tiny fishtanks until they get sold to us: the fish keepers

once again dont hate me for this
i just see this way
dont make fun of my grammar it wasnt typed up on microsoft word, i didnt spell check it, so leave it alone and reply on what you think about petstores in general

KOTP

 

[gold_fishy]

I would have to agree with you on this subject.
Unhappy fish: In my opinion those few oscars in a 15 gallon probably feel like they are in heaven compared to the fish farm they most likely came from, which I'd say is way overstocked, to who knows how many shoved in a bag, for who knows how long, to be transported to the lfs.
On chain stores: I don't judge all the same. I have heard so many on different forums down the wal-mart fish department. But in my experience I'd just as soon go there as I would to the lfs that deals only in fish. The lady at wal-mart knows a whole lot more. I believe she checks her water stats every day. And if the water params are the tiniest bit off she slaps Fish not for Sale signs on every tank that is off. She also does that to tanks where ICH or some other disease breaks out. And she WILL NOT sell any of the fish until the problem is cleared up. I can't say the same for my LFS. He will tell you anything that you want to hear in order to make a sale. From, Yes a Tire Track Eel will do great in a 30 gallon
to telling customers that clown loaches will have no problem being in a 55 gal for life.
Tammy

 

[KingofthePisces]

In my opinion those few oscars in a 15 gallon probably feel like they are in heaven compared to the fish farm they most likely came from, which I'd say is way overstocked, to who knows how many shoved in a bag, for who knows how long, to be transported to the lfs.

its interesting you say that because i was going to add another part on that subject but i decided it was too rude
you have to give it to the fish though, they do go through a hard time to get to us

 

[ryanp15]

i think i agree really, without going into detail, the pet shops are a buisness just as any other. It's good if they do care about the fish, and some do! but the main aim is to make money, we just need to make sure that when we buy them we keep them well

 

[KingofthePisces]

i think i agree really, without going into detail, the pet shops are a buisness just as any other. It's good if they do care about the fish, and some do! but the main aim is to make money, we just need to make sure that when we buy them we keep them well

yep that just about sums it up!
im also highly against wild capture, but then again were would be the fish keeper hobby if we didnt capture them from the wild in the first place
its great to see people who think as i do about this subject

KOTP

 

[Miss Wiggle]

here's a couple of examples of fish shops from my local area.

firstly the really bad one, just down the road from me, not part of a chain just a small local pet store with a fish section. Been in once and the tanks were in atrocious condition, they were absolutley filthy (and i don't mean they had a bit of algae or anything, but you could see the substrate was filthy, the flow rate from filters was low so they clearly needed a clean out, the water was all abit murky etc etc) they had a beautiful selection of dyed parrot fish, waaaay to many of them in the tank and they'd clearly been squabbling as several of them had damage on them. Most of the tanks had dead fish in them, several tanks clearly had ich and i saw signs of fin rot and other diseases too. I was so upset by it I just walked out. Now this isn't a busy city centre shop, it's a small shop in a suburb, there was no one else in the shop and the owner was sat at the counter reading a paper.

the really good shop, again a small non chain in a suburb of the same city, a marine specialist shop. Run by a bloke who writes for one of the top marine fishkeeping magazines and is a qualified marine biologist. Beautiful selection of livestock, can get rare stuff too shop always immaculate, you'd rarely go in there and see them sat around, they're alwasy tinkering with the tanks, doing maintenance, making sure everything was clean. The corals were astounding, beautiful display tanks. The owners very enthusiastic and friendly, he'd invite you into the back of the shop to look at all their equipment and explain how it all works. Brilliant shop.

One of these shops has gone out of business cos it was hemoraging cash........ take a guess which one it was.

Good fishkeeping is not profitable, it costs too much to staff a shop with quality employee's and get them to maintain the tanks to that level. The running costs of low stocking tanks mean that it's not profitable to run them like that.

Those two examples are extremes though, there's a handful of shops around here which seem to have struck a nice balance between the two, they're run by genuine hobbyists, they do employ a few teenagers to keep the cost of employee's down, they do stock the tanks more hevaily than you would at home, but they have sensible contingency plans in place to control the risks which cost cutting brings. These 'middle ground' shops have all been in business for several years and are showing no signs of stopping.

Really you can't generalise because there's so much varience, even in chain shops if you get one with a couple of really knowledgeable employee's then they can be excellent, but some without are quite bad.

Don't really know what the point of this thread is tbh though, yes fish shops are a business like any other and have to keep themselves afloat somehow, but you can do that perfectly well without resorting to dodgy advice, keeping the fish an abject conditions and so on.

 

[KingofthePisces]

ahh indeed quality is one of the main factors to sales
as my father said many times to me on worksites: it dosnt matter how crappy the job is (ie: the fish selection) as long as you have a clean workplace (the fish tank) no one will care.
my lfs has an average joe running it only 3 workers and the largest selection of fish in the area
noting the fish arnt in the best of conditions and arnt placed in the correct areas for their aggression (tiger barbs and dubosi in the non aggressive area ) but all his tanks are well maintained so i dont give a damn what the fish look like, im just pleased with the quality of their temporary homes in the pet store.
but this dosnt matter the most with me as i dont look at the tank, i look at the fish but because ithe tank is so clean i fail to notice the fact that the fish have fin rot from being placed with the wrong species of co-existant fish.

and the relativity of this thread dosnt matter, its just a subject that is brought up alot and i think that people make too much of a fuss about their possible new fishes temporary home, and ive found many a thread on this site about people complaining to us about their petstores sanitary conditions

final note: dont worry about them whilst their in the pet store, because there only your fish whilst their on your property
and if the conditions were as dismal as you said miss wiggle then why didnt you tell them to clean up their act, and also their fish tanks
i would have done that instead of just walking out

thanks for the comments people! keep them coming

KOTP

 

[Miss Wiggle]

and if the conditions were as dismal as you said miss wiggle then why didnt you tell them to clean up their act, and also their fish tanks
i would have done that instead of just walking out

some days I'm in the mood for a rant, some days I'm not.

As it happens on the day I visited it was the day after my grandma passed away, I'd barely slept and I was too upset to go into work I was trying to take my mind off things so I went for a drive around and browsed a few shops. Went into this shop by chance and in the frame of mind I was in I was nearly in tears so just left.

On a different day I would probably have given them a piece of my mind.

 

[KingofthePisces]

Most of the tanks had dead fish in them, several tanks clearly had ich and i saw signs of fin rot and other diseases too. I was so upset by it I just walked out.

the day I visited it was the day after my grandma passed away, I'd barely slept and I was too upset to go into work I was trying to take my mind off things so I went for a drive around and browsed a few shops. Went into this shop by chance and in the frame of mind I was in I was nearly in tears so just left.

then why didnt you say that at the beginning? you, being a very sensible person, must know you should always tell the exact story
im sorry about your grandma, i didnt know.
if you just said that as well as the bad tank conditions, which would have made me steer well clear of bringing it up.
i wasnt trying to be mean. i was trying to say what i would have done in your situation (based on the info i knew at the time)

KOTP

 

[Miss Wiggle]

lol i wasn't upset by you bringing it up, i just didn't see what relevance my mood that day and the circumstances around it had to how bad the fish shop is.