Overstocked?

[charlatan]

Hi Folks
 
Am wondering if I am overstocked in my smaller tank, or can I add any more fish?
 
I have a 64L Fish Box with the following:
 
Pair of Rams (1M 1F)
Pair of Kribensis (1M 1F)
Pair of Mollies (1M 1F)
1 Bronze Cory
 
Ideally would like some neons.
 
Also have a 190L Trigon corner tank, which things could be moved into if needed, as currently only has:
 
2 (small) Silver Sharks
3 Mollies (2F 1M)
1 Blue Gourami
2 Neons
 
Ideally, would like to be able to buy around 15 neon's, put 6 or so in the 64l and the rest in the 190l.
 
Any suggestions gratefully received, and I do need that the sharks will need re-homing before long.
 
Thanks
 
(oh and please disregard my signature, that tank is long gone lol)

 

[DerpPH]

Hi Folks
 
Am wondering if I am overstocked in my smaller tank, or can I add any more fish?
 
I have a 64L Fish Box with the following:
 
Pair of Rams (1M 1F)
Pair of Kribensis (1M 1F)
Pair of Mollies (1M 1F)
1 Bronze Cory
 
Ideally would like some neons.
 
Also have a 190L Trigon corner tank, which things could be moved into if needed, as currently only has:
 
2 (small) Silver Sharks
3 Mollies (2F 1M)
1 Blue Gourami
2 Neons
 
Ideally, would like to be able to buy around 15 neon's, put 6 or so in the 64l and the rest in the 190l.
 
Any suggestions gratefully received, and I do need that the sharks will need re-homing before long.
 
Thanks
 
(oh and please disregard my signature, that tank is long gone lol)

Well your 64 L is overstocked. Considering there are molles and two cichlids. Dont the cichlid pairs kill each other? And for the cory it needs to be in a group of at least 6. So goes for neons. 190l seems fine except for neons. Those dwarf cichlids need to be in separate tanks per pair

 

[Lillefishy]

As above your 64L is overstocked & the rams & kribs will get aggressive if they get in breeding mode.
Your 190 is way too small for the Bala sharks, they can grow over 12" & need a 5/6 foot tank, they also prefer to be in larger groups.
If you rehome those then you can add more neons

 

[Wills]

Yeah that 64 litre is pretty bad you will end up with dead fish as the fish mature, 64 liters is on the small side for Rams but doable at a push. The Kribs need a much bigger tank and would be suited better to your 190L And really I think that Mollys are too big for a 64 litre as well, adults are quite a big fish really.
 
As Derp said the Balas will grow too large for the 190 - I disagree with him on the 5-6 foot tank though they need much much much bigger they are migratory, high speed, large growing fish - which at the end of the day can only mean one thing tank wise - huge huge ponds to keep them properly.
 
I think that what you could actually do is move the fish from your 64 litre to the 190 and end up with a pretty nice tank
 
So you could look at stocking the tank like this
 
2 x Blue Rams
2 x Kribensis
1 x Blue Gourami
5 x Mollies (2M 3M)
12 x Neons
8 x Bronze Cory (you could mix them with Albinos as they are the same species and it makes for a bit of interest)
 
Then stock your 64 litre with smaller more suitable fish.
 
Since you like Cichlids (which in my books is always a good thing) what about doing a tailored South American tank? I think for me I would look at something like
 
2 Laetacara Dorsiger - 1m 1f
6 Ember Tetras
6 Green Neon Tetras
 
That gives the Laetacaras the full run of the bottom and then two small schools of different colours - or you could do 12 of just one species. Which I think will give quite a nice tank
 
Wills

 

[DerpPH]

Yeah that 64 litre is pretty bad you will end up with dead fish as the fish mature, 64 liters is on the small side for Rams but doable at a push. The Kribs need a much bigger tank and would be suited better to your 190L And really I think that Mollys are too big for a 64 litre as well, adults are quite a big fish really.
 
As Derp said the Balas will grow too large for the 190 - I disagree with him on the 5-6 foot tank though they need much much much bigger they are migratory, high speed, large growing fish - which at the end of the day can only mean one thing tank wise - huge huge ponds to keep them properly.
 
I think that what you could actually do is move the fish from your 64 litre to the 190 and end up with a pretty nice tank
 
So you could look at stocking the tank like this
 
2 x Blue Rams
2 x Kribensis
1 x Blue Gourami
5 x Mollies (2M 3M)
12 x Neons
8 x Bronze Cory (you could mix them with Albinos as they are the same species and it makes for a bit of interest)
 
Then stock your 64 litre with smaller more suitable fish.
 
Since you like Cichlids (which in my books is always a good thing) what about doing a tailored South American tank? I think for me I would look at something like
 
2 Laetacara Dorsiger - 1m 1f
6 Ember Tetras
6 Green Neon Tetras
 
That gives the Laetacaras the full run of the bottom and then two small schools of different colours - or you could do 12 of just one species. Which I think will give quite a nice tank
 
Wills

He said he was gonna rehome them. No problem in that

 

[Steffyboy]

I think sometimes people go a bit overboard about tanks being overstocked.
I agree with having bigger tanks for the larger species but they're not needed when they're small.
Just as long as you're going to upgrade your tank then i think it's fine to have whatever you want in your tank.
If your filtration is spot on and your water changes are too, plus you're not over feeding then who's to say you've overstocked a tank?
All these rules about fish to water ratio etc is rubbish! Some people think a 4ft tank with 6 tetra in is overstocked!!
I have a 4ft (350L) tropical and have such a varied variety of species and some would say it may be overstocked but i don't care.
They all get along together fantastic, not one fight or bit of aggression whatsoever.
It took me a while to finally get it like this and i'm so proud of it.
I've got a large Syno that's best mates with a large Black Ghost knife fish...An African albino frog that's inseparable from 2 large weather loach...Fire Eels best mates with a Reed fish...albino cory's mates with my Bala sharks!!
I've never seen a tank like mine and i wouldn't change it for the world.
Not one sick fish, not one disease...where's the problem?!!
My thinking is do what you want but just keep the fishes best interests at heart...feed them right...look after them and the tank....rant over!!

 

[fluttermoth]

The problem is that fish kept in tanks that aren't big enough become stunted.
 
This causes numerous health problems, including deformities and increased likelyhood of stress related illness, and significantly shortens their lifespans.

 

[the_lock_man]

To a certain extent, yes, you're right.
 
BUT, you buy a small tank, you put a baby common plec in it - it's only a couple of inches long, no problem. You have the space in your house to upgrade to an 8' tank later.
 
Fish grows a bit.
 
6 months later, you lose your job. Or perhaps your good lady wife falls pregnant unexpectedly with twins. No way you can afford that 8' tank now. You can't tell that common plec to stop growing. And it becomes stunted, and dies way before it should.
 
That's why it's a bad idea.

 

[Lillefishy]

To a certain extent, yes, you're right.
 
BUT, you buy a small tank, you put a baby common plec in it - it's only a couple of inches long, no problem. You have the space in your house to upgrade to an 8' tank later.
 'D
Fish grows a bit.
 
6 months later, you lose your job. Or perhaps your good lady wife falls pregnant unexpectedly with twins. No way you can afford that 8' tank now. You can't tell that common plec to stop growing. And it becomes stunted, and dies way before it should.
 
That's why it's a bad idea.

Good post, I've lost count of the number of people who say they know their fish are going to get big & they're going to upgrade soon, then a few months later when the truth sinks in & they can't afford to upgrade they're desperate to rehome them.
If people did proper research before buying fish there'd be a lot more happy non stunted healthy fish.

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Get the tank, then get the tank buster fish. Good intentions to buy that bigger tank as the fish gets bigger is a massive risk, things happen in life that prevent that dream tank coming to fruition and the fish suffers for it.
 
I've had a ~22cm SL Synodontis notata for ~18 months, he has basically lived in my garage 5x2x2 and my newer indoor 6x1.5x1.25, bar a month or so in my Rio240 last autumn. He is near on fully grown, perhaps another 2cm over time.
 
I've had a Chrysichthys ornatus for ~10 months, bought at ~4cm SL, now ~11cm SL and will eventually reach ~22cm SL. It has grown up in a 4x1x1.25 (with 4x ~10cm SL  Ctenopoma acutirostre; 1x ~6cm SL Pantodon buchholzi; 1x ~14cm SL Xenomystus nigri) and at some point within the next 6-9 months it will need to be transferred to the 6x1.5.1.25, which will mean moving any streamlined fish out of there, this catfish is a predator with a monster sized mouth already!
 
I've had an Auchenoglanis spp. for ~10 months, bought at ~5cm SL, now a chunky ~18cm SL... Unreal growth rate! He shared the above African oddball tank for ~3 months, then moved into my ~4x1.25x1.75, then moved again a month ago to the 6-footer. I still worry he might not be one of the smaller Giraffe species (A. tchadensis) and that my 5- or 6-footer may be too small long term, a wonderful fish, but not one of my wisest fish purchases. 

 

[Steffyboy]

I wouldn't let anything stop me from getting the fish i wanted.
If everyone worried about losing your job etc, you'd never buy anything.
Of course, it would be silly buying a 2ft tank and putting fast growing monster fish in but there's no harm in getting fish that grow large but are slow growers.
If push comes to shove and god forbid anyone lost their job etc, you could always give it to your local LFS when it's getting too big and get smaller ones again.
I've got 3 Bala's in my 4ft (350L) tank...they're only around 2-3" but they're fine for now in my opinion. 5-6ft tanks for them and bigger is nonsense. I know they're super fast swimmers etc but they can get used to a smaller tank with ease and it's not cruel (I'm not talking about a 2ft tank for a fully grown one!).
At least when and if something happens and you can't upgrade for a while and you need to get rid because of the size, you know you've given them a fantastic home and they've been well looked after.

 

[Wills]

wow just wow...
 
I'll save time and just bullet point it best I can, Im guessing its not getting read by the person its intended for (steffyboy not the OP)
 
- like goat said buy the tank then the fish, I was the same as you, planned to upgrade - then when I had saved, had the space and the fish of course. My flat flooded... roll on nearly a year later and after rehoming a lot of my stock - I got the tank.
 
- dont pretend your fish are friends...
 
- dont judge the success of your tank based on weeks or even months - judge it in years. IE when the fish are adults, you can plan ahead for when this happens, I suppose it is a choice as to if you do it but a good rule to live by is - fail to plan, plan to fail.
 
- dont assume an LFS will take a big fish off you - because they wont always be there to do that.
 
Your attitude is just alarming, it makes me wonder why your even posting here
 
Wills

 

[Steffyboy]

Wow just wow?
My attitude is alarming?
WTF are you on about?
I'm speaking my mind like every one else on here if that's OK with you?
Where did you get the idea that I've had my tank for weeks/month?
I've kept fish for years so i do know a little about them.
I'm expressing my personal experience and how I've kept some tanks, and with great success may i add.
Some people don't have to live by the so called rules and personally i think some of them are bad word removed.
It always makes me laugh on forums like this about people who think they know everything about fish and how to keep them when a lot of them are just reading crap that is posted on the internet.
Everyone has different ways and means about keeping fish etc and as long as you're doing it in a safe and caring manner...what's the problem?
Thanks for your bullet points and suggestions on how to live my life...next time, save it.

 

[silenthawk2x3]

I work at a local LFS and we DON'T take monster fish, fish that people are trying to get rid of because they are sick, fish that have been stunted, or fish that people don't have a big enough tank for. That being said, we also DON'T sell those fish or have them in stock. It's a huge risk to business as some of these fish will become near permanent residents if we can't find someone who does want that fish. They can get our stock ill or injure our fish. Occasionally if we have the space we may take a few half grown angels from someone after they've paired, a few cichlids if someone is moving away and I personally breed some of the stock, be we almost never take fish from someone walking off of the street. It is not because we are unkind, it is because they could very well be in the same predicament under our care. A chain LFS won't even consider taking fish. Most of the fish we get in are tetras, livebearers, bettas, small pleco varieties, some cichlids, and goldfish. If people want a specific species we order it special from our supplier. Our customers don't suffer, and neither do our fish!
 
Also I think it is very rude that you hijacked this thread from our poor OP just to "speak your mind", Steffyboy. :C

 

[Steffyboy]