New to salt water, few questions.

[lalaland]

Hi,

I've currently got a fresh tropical tank, it's 1000 x 400 x 400 mm (160 litres / 35 UK galons) and I want to change this to a marine tank.

I've already found someone that wants all my fish and am prepared to part with them (even my favourate ones) to move on to a marine tank, but the guy in my local fish store seems to want to charge me thousands to do this, so I need advice please??

I would like to use my existing tank if possible. It has 2 lights at the top, 1 fluval 3 filter (I know I probably need to change this for something else), 1 heater and a pump which powers a bubble curtain.

I would of course clear the whole thing out and start from scratch, but what do I need to buy and how much can I get it for? (I am on a tight budget)

If I can get a list of what I need then I can search second hand etc. and buy the rest from my LFS.

I am not bothered about an expensive reef setup, I just want some of the more colourful and interesting fish that you marine lot seem to enjoy compared to us fresh water folk. I recently saw a lion fish and I would love one of those, or even just a clown fish or two (probably not together).

Any advice would be greatly appreciated please?

Thanks

 

[lalaland]

BTW, I am looking to setup a fish only tank.

Thanks

 

[Navarre]

OK well basically it depends on the type of filtration you want to pursue.

I would say your fluval will be ok as a supliment but not as a main filter. (dont get rid of it as its good for water flow and carrying treatments etc)

Your lights will need replacing (or the tubes at least) as freshwater tubes are not designed for marines. They will promote algea growth. If you want to keep corals etc you might need to lookinto more powerful lights like halides.

Basically...

Get yourself as much live rock as possible. this acts as your best filter. Gets a ratio of 1kg per 2 gallons of tank minimum.
Powerheads.. lots of em.. you want high circulation for a marine setup. corals like high flow over them and even in fish only th elive rock needs a good flow to act as a proficient filter.
Skimmer. If you want fish only then i really recomend a skimmer. If you want corals too then i would go for a prizm as it tends to underskim rather than overskim.

If you want a basic setup where you can start out in the hobby. then purchase live rock and a skimmer. with these you can start keeping marines. as time goes by you can look for other more expensive items.


I have a few tank as you can see.. my most expensive tank was my 40 gallon setup that i purcahsed froma shop. I went there foradvice as a newbie and ended up spending nearly £2000

My cheapest tank is my 100 gallon setup! After knowinf more about the hobby i managed to get this reef on a budget of about £700 and that includes the live rock, metal halides and tank stand

KNowing what is needed for a setp will save you alot of cash in the long run, glad you asked here first before wasting cash elswhere.

Any more questions about other equipment or eventhe equipment mentioned then feel free to ask

 

[lalaland]

Thanks for the reply.

How much would I be looking at for a skimmer, power heads, neons and live rock for my tank size then?

I can get an Air Driven Counter Flow Protein Skimmer pretty cheaply it would seem, would this be something that I need? I looks pretty much like a plastic tube and a pipe. But there also appear to be skimmers costing hundreds or thousands, which do I need?

I would be looking for fish only, I don't want a coral set up as they appear to be most expensive.

How many fish and what type should I look at for my setup too?

Thanks

 

[Navarre]

Im always a bit cautious when i am asked to recomend equipment as this is an international forum and the equipment used in the UK (wherei am) is not always the same as what is in the States (or elsewhere).

As for liverock. If you have a 35 Gallon tank then you should aim for 35kg of live rock but as a start i would suggest no less than 20kg. If you are from the UK then you can purchase 20kg for roughly £9.50 per kg. (expensive i know but you wont ever regret it)

Maxijets are great little powerheads. 2 Maxijets 900 or 1200 would be ideal for this tank. They would creat a high flow and the fish will thank you for this. (Maxijet 900=£16 and 1200= £19 is the cheapest i have seen)

Skimmers: A prizom skimmer is a nice little skimmer that hangs on the sid of the tank. I dont use skimmers but i do have one of these and its been a nice little workhorse for me. I find that they undrskim so in a fish only system i would say it might not be enough to remove the extra waste that fish will produce.

Possibly the Deltec MC 500 @ £164 or the MCe 600 @ £192

If you had a sump then i would recomend a larger one. These are basically an internal filter and the 600 is a hang on skimmer.

I really do recomend that you get the best skimmer available if you choose fish only.

Lights.. just change the tubes to marine glo or similar. Iamnot sure on these prices but around £25 would be close i think

Hope this helps

 

[lalaland]

Is a Counter Flow Protein Skimmer any good for this sort of setup?

I can get one for £25 at my LFS and it plugs on to the end of my pump. The guy in the shop reckoned it would be fine, but I wanted a second opinion.

As for live rock, I will have to purchase some, but the LFS didn't mention that. I will get some anyway though, it sounds a good idea. They told me to just upgrade my filter, and buy one of those protein skimmers and that should do it aparantly with my tropical tank. But from the sound of it this is not the case.

They also said to let the tank when set up stand for 4-6 weeks to get it ready.

I'm starting to get the idea though, please tell me what extra I should do besides there ideas though.

Thanks

 

[Reefer 4:19:59]

HI, I take it you are in the UK? I can't comment on brands there but can help with other suggestions.
FIRST!!! What do you want to keep in the tank? I know you said fish only, I agree with Navarre (isn't that a strange name for a Brit?) add live rock. If my conversion factors are correct & N is talking about quality live rock the prices sound fairly comprable to here in the Chicago USA area - from $5.USD - $10.USD per pound for cured live rock. Season affects price as does area it is shipped from and the store. You can buy uncured as you are setting up the tank & cure it in situ but you should def use an air cleaner & protien skimmer if you go that route.
Don't be confused by "Base" rock vs "Face" rock. In your situation base is fine as the "Face" rock needs LIGHT a lot of LIGHT to look different from base. Or rather I should say here in the USofA face costs more & is not better or worse - well base is better with no light as there will not be as*_ much_* further die off.
I must respectfully disagree about the amount of Live Rock to initially stock your tank with ESP as you have not made a decision as to livestock. Unless you have a good reason to try & aquire all your live rock at once DON'T. A good reason might be a starter package - here mail order & some store fronts will sell you X#s of live rock & substrate, then as tank is ready janitors, maybe coral frags or softies or fish and other livestock. You can add live rock immediately, add bubbler or safe screened power head (notice I did NOT say anything about a filter) & light & read zillions of books and in a few months when you look up from your reading you'll have a stocked aq. Then you add whatever else you want.
Huh? add a few rocks, water, some light, no filter but good flow & I'll have a stocked aq? Are you bloody daft? Well yeah I probably am. But you will have a stocked aq - stocked with the micros & minis that you would never see if you put in the fish & inverts immed. You build up a system and it will stabilize. It is very different from fresh. With salt we want all those yucky things we dip everything fresh in Pom to be sure our aq is pure.
Artificial salt water should be aged even when adding to a mature stabilized tank. If you do not mix your own salt water but buy it be sure your supplier doesn't add copper to their tanks or your inverts will die & some fish. You can choose your salt mix and fill tank 1/2 full with RO or distilled water & follow the directions as to cups per gallon; mix with power head & measure salinity. It will NOT match what it should be or what the manufacturer says it will be. If below 1.020 add a proportional amount of salt & check back next day. While "holding" I like to keep salinity or SG at 1.023. Fish vary as to salinity they require and are comfortable at & *usually* have a wider comfort zone. It is easy to adjust the water up & it will get "saltier" due to evap. It is good to run aq and learn it b4 stocking - see where debris accumulates, if there ae hot spots and find out how much & how often you need to add distilled water or top to keep SG stable. KEEPING SG STABLE IS IMPORTANT. LR additions may also change your parameters.
If you want Anthias, Mandarins, or many other absolutely exquisite fish you have to have a lot of live rock (and BTW you can't keep the above in your set up unless you set up or have access to live zoo plankton) if your desire is a Harlequin Tusk or a Lion Fish or a grouper or Lunaire wrasse or Trigger then you don't need as much LR & you will need a protien skimmer but they all require a much bigger tank with the exception of the lion & maybe some triggers - but it would be a single or with luck & care maybe trio (3 different species) fish tank.
If you fill tank with water & say 3 or 4 live rocks, no substrate you have your options and your tank is cycling and has a chance to populate with food sources. When you decide what livestock you want you can put in the substrate you want & if you desire you could still do a plenum, a deep sand bed, a bare bottom or any other variation. It isn't difficult just a tad more time consuming to add sand or any substrate including olitic if you have no macro livestock.
You say colourful marines - what does that mean to you? How much time & effort will you really be willing to go thru every day or week or month? Do you want the salt water version of goldfish or discus? Is one fish betther than a school or do you want shrimps scampering around? Once you have an idea of what you want to keep & if you want a biotope, a reef drop off or just a pretty fin flowing thru the water we can give specific suggestions.

 

[lalaland]

I like the look of the lion fish and would love on of those.

The colourful fish look excellent though. I see them everytime I buy my freshwater fish. Nothing in fresh even compares to them.

Maybe a clown fish and a lion, would that work?

Or could I keep a porcupine fish, a lion fish and a couple of smaller fish? That would be great if possible, I love those two fish!

 

[Navarre]

It would wokr for about the length of time it takes the lionfish to swallow the clown

Seriously though, Lionfish should only be kept with fish that wont fit into its mouth. They are otherwise peaceful. Bigger fish like lions and groupers give off alot more waste so make sure you have good skimmers and filtration.

On a smaller scale, clowns, royal gramma, dwarf angels are really colourful and great characters. These fish usually get along together (but research them first).

 

[lalaland]

How about the porcupine? Could I put one of those in with a lion fish?

 

[Navarre]

Porcupine puffer? They can go together but be careful the puffer doesnt attack the lionshishes fins (some are prone to do this).

They also grow very large. well both do actually. I would not put either in a tank less than 75 gallons, probably even more.