New To Fish Keeping

[HappyGeorge]

Hello Folks

First off an apology as my comma key isnt working so take big breaths before reading any of my sentences.

I am new to the Hobby and am looking at creating a Lake Malawi Cichlid set up. I have always wanted a marine set up but appreciate that it would be a big step to take as a first tank.

I am about to order a Juwel Vision 260 litre aquarium and am planning on setting it up with either Tahitian Moon Sand or Argos play sand (which I read on other forums in inert) and then a sizeable wall of rock - probably slate and river cobble mix probably going to create a DIY backdrop using marine silicone. I know that plants are not necessarily required and indeed would probably be destroyed and I would like to set up the tank with a "marine" look using blue bulbs to highlight the fish colours.
I have read all I can find on the net and have 2 books on the subject and I think I am happy with the general issues concerning keeping/buying Malawi Cichlids but a few questions that I just cant seem to find a straight answer to which is where I hope you guys may come to my rescue a little.

1) Is the built in equipment on the Juwel sufficient for filtration/heating do I need to add anything now to the off the peg package? If I were to go for overstocking as a means of aggression control what would I need to add to cope with the extra muck?

2) Can anyone suggest a website or resource where I can easily check compatibility of the Lakes hundreds of species? There is a lot written on this much of it conflicting and very little of it helpful I understand the major problems but when it comes to issues of keeping Plecos or other bottom feeders in a Malawi tank it seems everyone has a different view. Is it realistically a case of suck it and see appreciating that these guys have their own individual characters so what goes for one may not for another? (I do know that these fish are not suitable as community fish).

3) Given that I am starting out and have no current interest in breeding is it acceptable to keep a tank of male only specimens? Or is this going to cause its own problems given the potential for aggression in these fish? If not any suggestions as to species mix?

4) Is there any specific aquarium friendly paint? In theory acrylic shouldn't be a problem as I would have to assume that they use acrylic paint in the manufacturing of aquarium parts and in tank decor.

Many thanks in anticipation of some answers - they may well be staring me in the face but have read so much (ggod and bad) that I think I have Cichlid overload and temporary useful info blindness.

 

[HappyGeorge]

Sorry just read that back and in reference to question 3 I appreciate that more than one male of a particular species (or similar species/markings/colour) is not acceptable. I was suggesting single male specimens from different species.

 

[lgarvey]

Hi,

I have done something similar recently with a similar size and shaped tank. Instead of the juwel vision 260, I went for an aquaone regency 120 which is bowfronted and 290 litres. Nice tank

Substrate. I'd definitely go for some kind of sand for the fish to dig in. My fish were previously in a tank that had gravel substrate and I never saw them trying to move it about. But they constantly play with the sand substrate. They are messy fish, though, and it's frustrating that the nice white substrate is always covered in fish poo, inspite of regular gravel vacing. Apparently a darker substrate means this is less noticable, hence the tahiti moon substrate may be a better option.

Background. I also fitted a background with silicone. Unfortunately the background is polystyrene and designed with a rock-like effect. It's a problem because as algae grows on the polystyrene, the fish nip at the it. This means that the nice black textured background now has tonnes of white pits in it and looks less attractive. I used a standard 3d background, but not juwel's 3d background -- which if I was to do this again i would probably use. Also, make sure there's no gaps at all. One fish died by fitting inot teh smallest gap on the 3d background. I would really love to remove the background, but it would be a mammoth task, especially chipping off all that silicone. =( Lesson learnt. If I were doing this again, I would put a black background on the outside and have done with it.

I have a one white and one marine actinic t8, and the blue light really accentuates the colours of the fish. Looks awesome. And great if you are not putting plants in there.

1. The juwel filtration will be fine initially, but as soon as you get densely stocked, or the fish get a bit bigger, you're more-than-likely going to want to upgrade. I'm not sure about the flow rate of the juwel internal filter for the 260, but I have a tetratec ex1200 on my tank which should theoretically turn the water 4 times an hour, and it's not holding up. I have another ex1200 on order, and will be running them both on the tank. (read other recent thread: 'particles in water' for a background on that issue. =) )

To deal with the 'extra muck' you'd need some kind of canister filter, the larger the rating the better. If you had enough room in the cabinet for a Fluval FX5 (which is rated for a tank up to 1500L) then go for it! There's no such thing as over filtration, apparently.

2) You can post to the forum about each fish to get a general idea of temperaments and compatibility. If they are mildly agressive then I wouldn't worry too much. But if they are very aggressive, then the key thing is not having fish with similar markings or colouration and being very careful with other fish of the same species. Two male elongatus and you are in trouble. One male wiht not enough females is also bad news. So, if you have a pseudotropheus elongatus (I had one in my first tank, called him Tyson) which has vertical blue stripes, watch out for other fish with vertical blue stripes, as they're likely to be harrased. The elongatus used to push every fish (not jsut the blue ones) into the corner of the tank. It was impressive to see, but I had to return him.

I then got an auratus which is now turning from female to male colouration and has become more agressive. They are seen as probably the most agressive mbuna that is regularly for sale at LFS. And I saw it viciously attack another fish (melachromis johanni) repeatedly. It had gone beyond being territorial, the auratus was determined to kill the johanni, because the johanni (from the same genus) has similar horizontal stripes, despite being a different colour. However, the auratus is very placid in the tank now and harrases nobody! It doesn't really seem to notice that other fish exist.

Sexing the fish is difficult if they are juvenile. Some fish have female colouration but are actually males and will begin to change colour later on, others are sexually monomorphic (i.e. the same for male & female). Both myself and the LFS guy wrongly sexed an acei based on egg spots (bad idea) and behaviour. We saw one fish with no egg spots, and another with about 3. I wanted a female so chose the fish with no egg spots. Upon putting it in the tank it started attacking the other male acei and had to be returned. I swapped it for the fish with 3 egg spots and everything is fine now, so it's probably the female. Very weird.

Synodonitis cat fish seem to do fine in the tank. Especially if you get some that are a bit bigger. There are several varieties of tanganykian catfish and one species of malawi cat fish that will do well in the higher pH. I had two cat fish called 'squeaking cat fish' according to the LFS guy, but I'm not able to determine if they are african. But they love it in the tank, nobody really bothers them at all. Catfish are also an awesome contrast -- very interesting to watch them scanning the tank.

3) You don't need to have only males or females. You can let them breed and they'll hold for awhile. The other fish will eat the fry.

4) No idea. Will have to see what other people say.

You seem to be very much on the right track!

L

 

[Ace Of Spades]

Hello Folks

First off an apology as my comma key isnt working so take big breaths before reading any of my sentences.

I am new to the Hobby and am looking at creating a Lake Malawi Cichlid set up. I have always wanted a marine set up but appreciate that it would be a big step to take as a first tank.

I am about to order a Juwel Vision 260 litre aquarium and am planning on setting it up with either Tahitian Moon Sand or Argos play sand (which I read on other forums in inert) and then a sizeable wall of rock - probably slate and river cobble mix probably going to create a DIY backdrop using marine silicone. I know that plants are not necessarily required and indeed would probably be destroyed and I would like to set up the tank with a "marine" look using blue bulbs to highlight the fish colours.
I have read all I can find on the net and have 2 books on the subject and I think I am happy with the general issues concerning keeping/buying Malawi Cichlids but a few questions that I just cant seem to find a straight answer to which is where I hope you guys may come to my rescue a little.

1) Is the built in equipment on the Juwel sufficient for filtration/heating do I need to add anything now to the off the peg package? If I were to go for overstocking as a means of aggression control what would I need to add to cope with the extra muck?

2) Can anyone suggest a website or resource where I can easily check compatibility of the Lakes hundreds of species? There is a lot written on this much of it conflicting and very little of it helpful I understand the major problems but when it comes to issues of keeping Plecos or other bottom feeders in a Malawi tank it seems everyone has a different view. Is it realistically a case of suck it and see appreciating that these guys have their own individual characters so what goes for one may not for another? (I do know that these fish are not suitable as community fish).

3) Given that I am starting out and have no current interest in breeding is it acceptable to keep a tank of male only specimens? Or is this going to cause its own problems given the potential for aggression in these fish? If not any suggestions as to species mix?

4) Is there any specific aquarium friendly paint? In theory acrylic shouldn't be a problem as I would have to assume that they use acrylic paint in the manufacturing of aquarium parts and in tank decor.

Many thanks in anticipation of some answers - they may well be staring me in the face but have read so much (ggod and bad) that I think I have Cichlid overload and temporary useful info blindness.

Ok firstly, Its great that you have researched this thoroughly before actually jumping in and a Vision 260 will be a perfect set up. Are the vision 260 and Rio 300 not about the same price, and the only real difference the bow front?.

Ok to answer your questions:

1) With Malawi, Especially Mbuna, As you are going to be overstocking slightly to reduce agression it is best to have around 10 times the tank volume in filtration. Me myself I have around 8/9 with two Tetratec Ex1200. External is always better IMO as it opens up your tank alot, And I hate cleaning out Juwel internals there is nothing worst.

2) I dont know if this is allowed but its not really advertising but this site http/www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/ has hundred, if not thousands of profiles on many of the common and rare Malawi species.

3) It is acceptable, but how ever you will have to watch cospecific temperaments, you cannot keep 2 males of the same breed in the tank as there will be an all out war fare without females. Also youll have to watch out for fish that look similar as they will also not like each other. Species groups to avoid if you dont like overly agressive fish are the Melanchromis.

4) Im sure there is an Aquarium friendly paint, but I am not sure what it is as Ive never used it, sorry.

Good Luck
Ace

 

[HappyGeorge]

Thanks for taking the time to answer guys.

Main reason for looking at the vision was the bow to be honest and athough the same price both me and the mrs fell in love with the look of the bow front.

My idea with the back drop was to use a technique I have used before to make artificial wood/rock effect. This involves coating whatever it is you want to replicate with a thin layer of silicone i.e bark or a rock then leaving it to dry and peeling it off to give create a skin with the features of the real thing. This can then be painted or/and coated with glue and have sand or similar glued to it to create texture then to lay it over a piece of polystyrene or foam to give it shape.
This is not a technique I have seen described anywhere on fish forums but I see no reason why it wouldn't work provided all materials were fish safe and would work out pretty cheap so I may have a go and see what I can create. Would think that the fish probably wouldnt find anything to nibbe either as seems to have happened to some peoples polystyrene backdrops as it would be smooth and flexible?

Think I need to gen up on filters still haven't accumulated enough knowledge on this and dont want to get it wrong at the expense of the fish.

 

[Ace Of Spades]

Thanks for taking the time to answer guys.

Main reason for looking at the vision was the bow to be honest and athough the same price both me and the mrs fell in love with the look of the bow front.

My idea with the back drop was to use a technique I have used before to make artificial wood/rock effect. This involves coating whatever it is you want to replicate with a thin layer of silicone i.e bark or a rock then leaving it to dry and peeling it off to give create a skin with the features of the real thing. This can then be painted or/and coated with glue and have sand or similar glued to it to create texture then to lay it over a piece of polystyrene or foam to give it shape.
This is not a technique I have seen described anywhere on fish forums but I see no reason why it wouldn't work provided all materials were fish safe and would work out pretty cheap so I may have a go and see what I can create. Would think that the fish probably wouldnt find anything to nibbe either as seems to have happened to some peoples polystyrene backdrops as it would be smooth and flexible?

Think I need to gen up on filters still haven't accumulated enough knowledge on this and dont want to get it wrong at the expense of the fish.

The Bow fronted does bring disorted fish viewing at times, which is why I went for the rio instead. I used a mix of slate and granite, my journal is in the journal section if you want to check it out.

Have you thought about stocking idea's yet matE?

 

[lgarvey]

teh aqua one royal 120 claims to not to cause distortion and is a more attractive tank. They had 'em online for a massively reduced rate of £420 or something like that, but I think they've sold out.

I think a smooth silicone background will prevent the fish from chewing it to pieces.

L

 

[HappyGeorge]

Well not sure whether to thank you guys or not

Started looking at other tanks and saw a lot of bad press about the Juwel filters and have now bought one of these.

Aquience Bow 1500 Bow Front Aquarium

Tank and cabinet Size - 150 x 140 x 50cm (WxHxD)
Capacity - 380 Litres
Glass - 10mm
Lighting - 2 x 30 Watt + 2 x 40 Watt
Filtration - 2 x CF1000 Canister Filter
Heater - 2 x 200 Watt

Was in Dark Wood which doesnt really matter as my furniture is distressed reclaimed pine and all my floors are unstained varnished vistorian floorboards so nothing was going to fit in anyway no choice as it was an ex-dispay model got it for what seems like a massive bargain of £399. Less than the Juwel by £30 (or £100 LFS prices).

Seems that the onboard filters and heaters were much more capable

Did I do good?

 

[HappyGeorge]

Original price listed at £899

 

[lgarvey]

Sounds like an awesome bargain!


I take it CF1000 is the aquaone external canister filter? (I have a CF1200)

If so, they seem OK, but the lack of a priming mechanism, I find, to be a PITA (pain in the ass). You'll have to suck on the outflow pipe, draw water into it, then connect it to the filter to give it enough back pressure to prime the filter.

They will work fine though, i'm sure.

It'll be a nice set-up!
L

 

[HappyGeorge]

Well have just had an email from the company I ordered the aquarium from and the item had already been sold they have offered me this though still ex display but at the same price £399 which is a sizeable discount considering this model is not discontinued and its normal price is £695.

Aquience Rectangular 150 Aquarium - Beech
[1500R]

Tank Size - 150 x 65 x 55cm (WxHxD)
Cabinet Size - 150 x 75 x 55cm (WxHxD)
Capacity - 398 Litres
Glass - 10mm
Lighting - 4 x 40 Watt
Filtration - 2 x CF1000 Canister Filter
Heater - 2 x 200 Watt

Now I really dont know what to do was after a bow front ideally but this does look like a pretty nice piece of kit. What would you do?
Have made myself the start of a stocking list which when I find it will post up for you guys to have a look at.

 

[lgarvey]

Well have just had an email from the company I ordered the aquarium from and the item had already been sold they have offered me this though still ex display but at the same price £399 which is a sizeable discount considering this model is not discontinued and its normal price is £695.

Aquience Rectangular 150 Aquarium - Beech
[1500R]

Tank Size - 150 x 65 x 55cm (WxHxD)
Cabinet Size - 150 x 75 x 55cm (WxHxD)
Capacity - 398 Litres
Glass - 10mm
Lighting - 4 x 40 Watt
Filtration - 2 x CF1000 Canister Filter
Heater - 2 x 200 Watt

Now I really dont know what to do was after a bow front ideally but this does look like a pretty nice piece of kit. What would you do?
Have made myself the start of a stocking list which when I find it will post up for you guys to have a look at.

I'd say that's pretty much a personal opinion, HG. Though I would say say that the additional size and floor space is going to give you more stocking options, and improve the cichlids ability to get along by provding them more floor space to form territories.

When I first got my 4 ft tank, it felt too big. Now I wish I had a bigger tank! =)

Also, I wsa determined to get a bow front. Now that I have one, I'm not particularly bothered either way. But you may be different.

L