new Adventure Begins

[TwoTankAmin]

I recently had a well planted tank which held my sidthimunki loaches, a couple of young albino BN males and amano shrimp crash and kill all the fish. I am not sure but I think it was caused by the maid having failed to cover the tank before she started cleaning. She did that many years (about 15) ago when she accidentally wiped out almost 1/2 of a tank with 21 zebras about 1.5 inches. That was mu fault as i should have covered all the tanks. After that I explained that it was important to cover the tanks using the bathmats and/or towels in the bathroom. Ever since then she has covered them when I failed to do it.

But I have no other explanation for the wipe out. I discovered the day after she cleaned. But it could have been another cause so I just lived with this. But I had those sids for about 20 years. I cleaned the tanks up, rescaped it and change the filter media. I then added some of my emergency bottle of Dr. Tim's bacteria which I keep in the fridge. I change the water a few times first. I even ordered 6 moss balls which are now in it. I am dosing ammonia as well.

AAT the same time I had set up a 29 gals a couple of months ago because i needed to park some tall ferns and a few other plants. The ferns were shipped out in late Jan. But from other tanks I had excess plants I them parked there. it is bare bottom and the plants are to be sold at some point. But after the recent wipe-out I decided both the cleaned 25 for the loaches and the 29 with plants needed to be repopulated with some fish. I also decide I needed to add a sand substrate to the 29.

As a result of the above I wanted to buy and assortment of new fish for those two tanks. I wanted to get them all at once so each tank would serve as Q for the incoming fish and then as their final tank. I had only two options for doing the stocking. One was to take a 30 minute drive to one of the very few store from which I will skip Q. To work there you have to pass a written test on your fish knowledge. But their prices are extremely high and I really did not want to spend many more $100s of dollars than I did ordering fish online over the weekend.

I used two sources. one was AquaBid and I used a highly rated seller who had a ton of listings. I assumed he was either a full time online only or a serious home based type seller. His rep was excellent, so I order from him 4 redline barbs at about 2 inches. These will Q with the rest but end up in my 150 where I have 6 adults already. The other fish from him included 10 harlequin rasboras (Trigonostigma heteromorpha) and 6 tank raised panda cory (Hoplisoma panda). The seller name on AquaBid was 90125. But the next order was a risky one.

Knowing that Aquqa Huna had a spotty rep. I decided to take the risk in order to replace my sidthimunkis. So I ordered the following from him: 10 amano shrimp (Caridina multidentata), and 12 small sids. (Ambastaia sidthimunki). I thought I had ordered 8 espei rasporas but they are sending chilis instead. There are no chili listed for sale on the Aqua Huna site. Since they will also work, I accepted that one of us made a mistake. I just emailed them about this and we will see how they resolve it and how their fish arrive. But they charged me $1 more for the chili than the price for the espei I wanted and do think I ordered. I di not really read the invoice unti today as I was quite busy over the weekend.

I will update this thread with the results of what I receive from both sellers.

edited because I had a zillion typos- sorry

 

[connorlindeman]

I recently had a well planted tank which held my sithimunki loaches, a couple of young albino BN males and amano shrimp crash and kill all the fish. I am not sure but I think it was caused by the maid having failed to cover the tank before she started cleaning. She did that many years (about 15) ago when she accidentatlly wiped out almost 1/2 of a tank with 21 zebras about 1.5 inches. That was mu fault as i should have covered all the tanks. AFfter that I explained that it was imporatnt to cover the tanks using the bathmats and/or towels in the bathroom. Ever since then she has covered them when I failed to do it.

But I have no other explanation for the wope out. I doscovered the day after she cleaned. But it could have been another cause so I just lived with this. But I had those sids for about 20 years. I cleaned the tanks up, rescaped it and change the filter media. I then added some of my emergency bottle of Dr. Tim's bacteria which I keep in the fridge. I change the water a few times first. I even ordered 6 moss balls which are now in it. I am dosing ammonia as well.

AAT the same time I had set up a 29 gals a couple of months ago because i needed to park some tal ferns and a few other plants. The ferns were shipped out in late Jan. But from other tanks I had excess plants I them parked there. it is bare bottom and the plants are to be sold at some point. But after the recent wipeout I decide both the cleaned 25 for ths laoches and the 29 with plants needed to be repopulated with some fish. I also decide i needed to add a sand substrate to the 29.

As a result of the above I wnated to buy and assortment of new cish for the=ose two tanks. I wanted to get them all at once so each tank would serve as Q for the incoming fish and then as their final tank. I had onlt two options for doing the stocking. One was to take a 30 minute drive to one of the very few store from which I will skip Q. To work there you have to pass a written test on your fish knowledge. But their prices are extremely high and I really did not want to spend many more $100s of dollars than I did ordering fish online over the weekend.

I usedf two sources. one was Auqabid and i used a jighly rated seller who had a ton of lisitings. I assumed he was either a full time online only or a serious home based type seller. His rep was excellent, so I order from him 4 redline barbs at about 2 inches. These will Q with the rest but end up in my 150 where I have 6 adults already. The other fish from him included 10 harlequin rasboras (Trigonostigma heteromorpha) and 6 tank raised panda cory (Hoplisoma panda). The seller name on aquabid was 90125. But the next order was a risky one.

Knowing that Aquqa Huna had a spotty rep. I decided to take the risk in order to replace my sidthimunkis. So I ordered the following from him: 10 amano shrimp (Caridina multidentata), and 12 small sids. (Ambastaia sidthimunki). I thought I had ordered 8 espei rasporas but they are sending chilis instead. There are no chili listed for sale on the Aqua Huna site. Since they will also work, I accepted that one of us made a mistake. I just emailed them about this and we will see how they resolve it and how their fish arrive. But they charged me $1 more for the chili han the proce for the espri I wanted and do think I ordered. I di not really read the invoice unti today as I was quite busy over the weekend.

I will update this thread with the results of what I receive from both sellers.

They do sell chilis. https://aquahuna.com/products/chili-rasbora

 

[jaylach]

Sorry about the tank crash. Quite a while back I made the mistake of buying a moss from a local Petco that ended up being contaminated and killed everything.

Good luck with the new stuff.

 

[fishorama]

I'm so sorry about your sids, etc.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I checked the Rasbora page before I posted and emailed them. Chili were not there then. The top row had only two species. What I can find is using the WaybackMachine from Apr. 3, 2025. Yes this was about 16 days before I ordered. It also doesn't include the pictures only the text. But on this date chili rasboras were listed as sold out. Scroll down to the final two species and they are there. https://web.archive.org/web/20250403061937/https://aquahuna.com/collections/rasbora

My guess is they came in or were only made available after I placed my order. The confirmation of that order came in an Email with the title Order #161280 confirmed and with this date and time: Sat 4/19/2025 2:22 AM.

I spent a some time both on the Aqua Huna and AquaBid Sites before placing my orders. I highly doubt that I messed up the order for the espei or that the chili were listed for sale at that time. But, the two species are similar in many ways except for their coloration/appearance. The Google AI sums it up this way:

Espei rasboras and chili rasboras are both small, colorful freshwater fish commonly kept in aquariums. While they share similarities in size and general care, they differ in their coloration and markings. Chili rasboras are known for their deep red with black markings, while espei rasboras have a more vibrant, orange-red body with a dark stripe along their sides.

So I can settle for the chili but they are not what I orderd and they are a whopping $10 more. That is not inmporatnt in terms of the amount buy very important in terms of why it is there. What I would consider an acceptable response form them would be were are sorry we will return the $10. I do not expect them to exchange the fish nor do I want them to send me 10 espei. I have no place to put them.

The whole point of this thread is to report how the trans actions went and what the quality of the fish and shrimp involved is.If I can get pics when they come, I will do so. I expect the ones from AquaBid to arrive on Wednesday and the ones from Aqua Huna on 4/22/25 before 12:00 PM.

edited because I did not proof read it before hitting "post reply"

 

[Magnum Man]

some sellers seem quirky, one I rarely use, does an excellent job, with plants, but in 2-3 orders, has sent the wrong fish, each order... tetras are easier to deal with but sending geophagus instead of cupids, as in my case, the cichlid family is a bad mistake, that put one of my tanks 6 months behind, and caused loss of the fish they sent me...

 

[TwoTankAmin]

We all make mistakes. I have never sent the wrong fish but I have occasionally been short a fish but I also have put in extras. The one thing that always guides how I deal with the people who buy my fish is to make sure when it is all said and done the buyer is not only satisfied but is also happy with the transaction.

As far as I know, I am the only seller of plecos like zebras and L173 etc. which are pricey, who will put an extra fish in when the order size is 10 or more fish. I also almost never have DOAs. The only time this was a problem was in the toxic bag period when many fish died in bags because one of the ingredients used was at fault. This gappened to a lot of sellers.

What we often do not realize about fish bags is they would be difficult or even impossible to open or to separate unless what is called a slip agent is used to deal with this. Normally the slip agent is one of the various ingredients that can be used in the manufacturing of the bags. For a period of time the bag manufacturers were using an ingredient that, when in the water, becomes toxic to fish. This whole episode was written up in Amazonas magazine to which I used to subscribe.

In my case the problem was magnified because plecos tend to latch on to the bag and in the process they will rasp the bag some. I actually contacted the lead researcher whose team discovered what was causing the deaths. I said my fish were dying in much less time in a bag than was being reported. I asked him if he thought because the fish were plecos and how they behaved in the bags, that would explain why I had the results I did/ He said he thought it was likely I had it figured out correctly.

I threw away all of my bags and changed my supplier. That was the end of the problem. But I lost a few $1,000 (retail value) of fish due to the toxic bags. I lost at least 25 zebra plecos in transit. Some were even in the bags fewer than 12 hours as they were picked up from me by a friend and then delivered to the buyers at an event the friend was attending. I bagged them in the morning and they were dead by 5 in the afternoon.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I just finished unbagging the fish and putting them into the appropriate tank. I shot pictures of it all. Here is a verbal report as I need to get the pics out of the camera and edited for posting.

1. The box was small but adequate, There wa a heat pack in it which was not very warm. Bu the water temp. was OK.
2. The water in the bags with fish had a yellow tint which I assumed was something added for making the do better while in transit.
3. The fish and shrimp were double or triple bagged. But for the shrimp and rasboras both bags face the same direction. The sids were trippl bagged with a double bagging inside an 3rd bag.
3. The fish were tiny. Any smaller and, they would have been closer to eggs than free swimming fish.
4. The 8 rasboras had 2 DOAs, were hard to get out of the bags at their size but the six live ones were active. I have pics for Aqua Huna of them on a paper towel as they instruct. These fish almost required I used a magnifying glass to see them clearly they were so small. I would never ship fish of this size. If they get delayed they would likely die of starvation.
5. The sids were in 3 bags each holding 4. Very tiny fish indeed. But all were live and active.
6. The amanos were the biggest item of all. They dwarfed the rasboras but were not as long as the sids. Of all 3 items they were the biggest relatively speaking. They were all active and they went into the 29 while the sids and rasboras went into the 25.

I do not acclimate new fish. So here is how I handled the unbagging. I fill a specimen box with tank water from the tank into which the new arrivals will be put. I then open t[a bage apur it out throug a fine mesh net. In this case I used a brine shrimp net. Once the new fish are in the net. I invert it to release the fish into the box. I shoot pics of the fish and then they go directlly into the tank.

I am not sure when I might see the sids or the rasboras because they ar eso small it may take a lot of luck to see them. I am expecting the second box to arrive tomorrow. The redlines and corys will go into the 29 with the amanos as will the 10 harlequins. I have 4 harlequins in another 29 and some of the new ones will go in with them to make a bigger group. I may divide them in half and let 5 go into the 25 to make up for the loss of the 2 chilis.

I never heard back from Aqua Huna regarding the espei vs. chili issue. The fish they sent were tiny, I will have to look at the pics on a big screen when I get them out of the camera. I need to send Aqau Huna the pic of the two dead rasboras on the towel.

I will also post pictures from the arrival of the box, opening it, all the bags of fish and then pics of them in the specimen box. The rasboras all appeared to be alive initially but when I went to net them out of the box to put them into the tank, two if them were lying on the bottom of the box not moving. I made sure they were dead by tilting the box and watching them slide across the bottom, I did this a few times and they never moved aside from sliding from one end to the other on the bottom.

I know Aqua Huna should refund me $7 for the 2 dead fish which is what they charged for them. Over all I consider the experience to have been such that I would not recommend this seller as a good place to get fish etc. This is as much due to the size as anything. DOAs happen but when fish are this small it is made more likely.

The other thing is I have bought fish imported. I have seen the price lists. My guess is that they paid about 25 cents for the rasboras and they sell them for $3.50. I would be surprised if the sids cost them as much as $2 at the size - think maybe 1.25 inches ad less. I am not sure of the going rate for amanos as I have not bought any in some time. Best guess would be $1 and likely lees in quantity. A H sells them lots of 10 for $25 and $1 would be too much considering the mark-up on the other stuff on their site which I assume is mostly tiny in size. I used to buy amanos in 50 or 100 shrimp lots. But, really heavy rains about 15 tears ago flooded the shrimp farms in Asia and wiped them out. So, amanos became harder to find for some time thereafter.

Here is one last bit of info I failed to report about the the tah tab wipeout. it did not kill 100% of the amanos. This really surprised me and I actually forgot they were inthe tank as I rescaped it, changed the filter media and began insuring it would be cycle. I just came back from checking on the tank to see if I could spot any of the small fish. I saw the 3 amanos which had survived. At first I thought I had dumped the new shrimp into the wrong tank which did not fit with the fact I had just seen them being very active in the 29 in the bedroom. Then I rememeber they are the survivors.

I am now worried that they might attack the rasboras which are way smaller that the amanos.

edited for many typos and bad spelling

 

[Magnum Man]

BTW... I love this quote...

What makes the common person uncommon is "common sense."

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Last night was poker in the city and I am now well behind on fish related stuff. Aqua Huna claims I ordered the chilis and I wont fight with them over that. However, the size of the fish was incredibly tiny. I had two die during unbagging. The dead fish below are barely 1/2 inch TL.

I put the chilis, and the sids into the revamped 29 which crashed. I had forgotten that the wipeout was not total, three amanos survived. They dwarf almost all of the sids and could make a meal of the chilis. And this brings me to the second issue. The tank is well planted and has a small size gravel as the substrate. It is impossible to spot a dead chili on that. So I have no clue today how many of the 6 that went in are still alive. I only could spot one a few minutes ago.


The sids were assorted size and a couple are pretty small and the same issue exits for the smaller ones as for the chilis.

On the whole I got what I expected from Aqua Huna and can say unequivocally that I will never order anything from them again and I would also warn members here to be very wary of buying from them. Caveat emptor idefinitely applies here.

I will get the pics out of the camera and edited and will then post them here. However, here is the pic of the chilis in the small size specimen box (Small Size : 5 1/8" long x 2 1/2" wide x 4 1/2" deep). I do not acclimate new fish, especially those which have been shipped to me. I have plopped and dropped new fish no for about 23 years. I initially listened to sites like this one which said one must acclimate. Then I began reading the research papers which taught me that the time for doing true acclimation of any fish to new conditions measured in weeks not hours.

I was also taught by my fiend Rachel, aka msjinkzd, that I should be doing what I now do. She was buying fish both wholesale and imported regualrly. She explained that early on she would acclimate them and she would have losses in the 20-25% range. And then she was taught to plop and dropp and she changed what she did, The result was losses went to under 10%. Considering the volume of fish and the facts about what happens in the bags in transit, and then how crowded a seller makes the number of fish in a bag, under 10% is a decent number.

So, When I have new fish being shipped to me I want to get the fish out of the bags and into clean water ASAP. So, depending on the size and number of fish I do the following:
1. For bigger fish and/or larger numbers of them, I put either tap water (from our well and not needing dechlor) into a cleanbucket. For smaller fish like those in the Aqua Huna order, I use a specimen container. I may opt to take water from the tank where the new fish will go instead of tap.
2. It is important to get the fish out of the bag as soon as possible after opening the bag. The reason is that, while in transit, the fish are making ammonia. They do this every time they exhale. But when they do, they also exhale CO2. CO2 in water creates carbonic acid which acts to lower the pH. The lower the pH, the more of the ammonia that will be in the form of ammonium (NH4). But, when one opens a the bag the excess CO2 in the water goes out and oxygen comes in and the pH will go up. This turns the ammonia more toxic.
CO2 reacts with water molecules (H2O) to create carbonic acid (H2CO3)--> CO2 reacts with water molecules (H2O) to create carbonic acid (H2CO3)
3. It is a lot easier to observe in the clear specimen box than through one or two bags, especially if the water is not clear. It is also easier to get clear picture of new fish in the box rather than the shipping bag.
4. Once I am happy with what I am seeing, I pour the fish into the tank from the box. Because I know the water I just used is mine, I have no issue doing this. I never pour bag water into a tank. When I unbag into a bucket I do not normally pour it and the fish into a tank. Instead, I net them out of the bucket and put them into the tank from the net.

Here is a poor pic I snapped of the surviving amanos from the original tank crash. You can see what I mean when I say you cannot see the chilis if they died and fell to the bottom:

Here is the latest on my second order. No happy about the delay since he shipped on Monday. All of the fish in the order will go into the 29 with the amanos I added yesterday. The real issue with the order is that 1/2 of the harlies will stay there and the other half will go into another 29. And I am not sure where I will put the pandas. I need more corys for my in-wall 75 but I have been getting them at my club monthly auctions when available. I know the fish are healthy and the prices are usually really good.

edited for typos

 

[TwoTankAmin]

Just to be fair in what I report about the Aqua Huna experience. I sent them the email with the pic of the dead fish. But in my haste I managed to typo the Email addy and it came back undeliverable. I fixed the error and resent it. Today I receive n Email back saying they had credited my card for the two fish.

Last night I did see just 1 if the chilis and the sids were all over the tank. Today I watched the sids and saw no chilis. I could not spt any corpses. I also have sponge pre-filters on the intakes of both AqauClears on the tank (a 200 [50] and a150 {30]). I have a box of small scraps and pieces of driftwood. I plan to add a wood pile for the sids.

The other box is due "Today, April 24 between 3:15 P.M. - 7:15 P.M. It is 2:30 now here. I will report on this as well.

 

[Back in the fold]

I know that people these days order fish online but you hear almost as many bad experiences as success stories . It’s a gamble and with the exorbitant shipping costs it takes the nerve of gunfighter to do it . Just my opinion .

 

[anewbie]

Just to be fair in what I report about the Aqua Huna experience. I sent them the email with the pic of the dead fish. But in my haste I managed to typo the Email addy and it came back undeliverable. I fixed the error and resent it. Today I receive n Email back saying they had credited my card for the two fish.

Last night I did see just 1 if the chilis and the sids were all over the tank. Today I watched the sids and saw no chilis. I could not spt any corpses. I also have sponge pre-filters on the intakes of both AqauClears on the tank (a 200 [50] and a150 {30]). I have a box of small scraps and pieces of driftwood. I plan to add a wood pile for the sids.

The other box is due "Today, April 24 between 3:15 P.M. - 7:15 P.M. It is 2:30 now here. I will report on this as well.

Usually aquahunaa will refund I think the policy is up to 3 days IF you can find hte corpses.

Also i acclimate for temperature - i .e, set the unopen bag in the tank for 15 to 30 minutes before i plop the fishes in. I think i've only lost 1 - maybe 2 fishes out of approx 100's i've ordered the past 3 years. I've had a few die after 6 months as they could not adapt to the new environment or i did something wrong but that is a different situation.

Anyway - i almost exclusivly use wetspot and aquaticlcarity these days. I used to use aquahuna a lot and i won't go into details while i stopped but i will note that inbreeding is easier to spot these days for myself.

 

[FranciscoB]

Sorry for your lost fish.
For myself, I don’t skip quarantine from any desler, source, fellow aquarium, nobody. 30 day mínimum (standard), unless something i emes appstent or suspected, in which case the clickear is re-started.
It is not only due to potential problems that come with the new Gus, plants, whatever, but also for the fact that the new inhabitants may come from a different biológicas conditions.

 

[FranciscoB]

I despide the darn autocorrect!!!!