Never split a married couple

[anewbie]

I have this rather nice looking solo male ram with my discus and thought I would breed him as his colouring is unusually intense. Netting him was easy enough (rams are such suckers) and i put him in a 10 with a female and male that weren't doing much. The existing male didn't take kindly and while 1/2 his size pestered him for 24 hours so i removed it and put it in the 180.
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Ok now i'm set just wait a while and we will have eggs. Well the male sulked and went into a corner behind the sponge filter refused to come out and refused to eat - the female went to the opposite corner and sulked and refused to eat. Wait 4 days and same behavior. Sigh. So net the original male put him in the 10 and net the really nice ram and put him in the 180 and presto everyone is happy swimming and eating.

Sigh.

 

[GaryE]

My Mom kept finding these future Church ladies for me when I was in my later teens, and could never understand why I ducked, weaved and avoided as politely as I could. Some things just can't be made to be...

Maybe I was a Mikrogeophagus in another life.

 

[Back in the fold]

That’s not the way it is in the cichlid world . They pair off and it’s their decision . The only cichlid I know that doesn’t go by that rule is Convict Cichlids . Any female Convict will bully any male Convict into mating if she’s ready and no other male is around .

 

[anewbie]

That’s not the way it is in the cichlid world . They pair off and it’s their decision . The only cichlid I know that doesn’t go by that rule is Convict Cichlids . Any female Convict will bully any male Convict into mating if she’s ready and no other male is around .

There are many species of fishes that are polygamous - in this if the female finds an acceptable male she will make a territory inside his territory and raise frys in his territory; there are other species that form weak bonds where they pair off and will breed but at a later date the female might choose another male. There are species that form strong bonds where the will basically pair off for life or until they decide it doesn't work (i.e, a number of failed breeding will usually trigger a 'break' up which is more or less permanent).

In truth i am unsure which category rams fall into - angles seem to lean towards weak bonds - people claim keyholes form strong bonds (i have no first hand experience here as mine never paired up); cockatoo are an example of the first type (polygamous behavior but beware if the male is not suitable); nijjnesi seem to fall into weak bond category though in the aquarium environment she usually has no real reason to consider alternative unless breeding is not successful.

 

[Back in the fold]

That’s not my experience with Angelfish . They stick together like glue and never pair off again if their mate dies .

 

[anewbie]

That’s not my experience with Angelfish . They stick together like glue and never pair off again if their mate dies .

I've had several females switch mates and in the process kill or violent attack their old mate - i had one lovely platinum male i had to remove from the 120 because the female would have otherwise killed him (she switched to a black after 1 years though i'm sure the color had nothing to do it but he was a handsome dude genetically); i removed the platinum male for 3 months and 30 seconds after putting him back in she was all over him again so i had to take him to the petshop (he was too large for the 29 long term - was a lovely specimen if you are into domestic angels).

Anyway so first hand i've seen the break up and female switching mates - it isn't pretty so hopefully you will never see it

 

[GaryE]

I always take what I see with a grain of salt. How we set up tanks, how big they are, how they're filtered, maintained etc can have a huge effect. Then, we have individual variation. Fish aren't robots, much as people aren't.
I have a highly developed broodcare instinct - one that has dominated my life. I know people who just don't react to parenting that way. I believe I've seen the same general sort of variation with fish. If you get a pair with strong instincts in one direction, you'll see a different story than with a pair who don't share the same drives.
As I've gotten older and convinced myself I'm wiser, I like to keep several pairs of a species, and to keep them for several generations before I can be sure about how they'll react in the conditions I offer them. I try to keep single pairs of dwarf Cichlids in 20s, 40s and 75s, just to see how their behaviour varies. With some fish, it really does. So you can figure them out, but not from one pair bred once.
Early in my fishkeeping days, I made the over generalizing mistake a number of times. Maybe. I'd need more info to know.
We have to be critical of our own certainties, which is easy because if you're smart, the more you learn the more realize what you don't know.
What @anewbie did resetting that pair could work with different fish, a different tank, etc. But man, I've shared that frustration of having it not work quite a few times. As the old joke goes, fish don't read books to know what we think they're supposed to do.
I appreciate it when people share stories like this because it shows we're not alone in what happens (or doesn't) in our tanks.

 

[anewbie]

For me it was that the female actually pouted (refused to eat) until i returned the original male which surprise me the most - the fact that they did not bond in such a short period was not shocking though the male pouting was also a surprise (being the largest fish in there and hiding behind a sponge esp during feeding time). Also both fishes immediately perked up when return their previous configuration.