Need Some Advice On Fish :)

[Jen_S]

Ok, I just set up a 10 gal tank to house the red cherry shrimp that I won an aquabid and not really thinking went ahead and put 3 goldfish in there. I have always enjoyed goldfish and couldn't tell my kids no LOL They all have the chicken pox. Anyway, I'm thinking this was a really bad choice because I would like to breed the shrimp and think the goldfish will get fat on the baby shrimp LOL. My other tanks are a 20 H that has about 15 gal of water in it so the newts have room to get out, a golden dojo loach, a dwarf pea puffer, 2 dwarf frogs, 5 adult guppies + a few guppy fry and last but not least the 2 newts (California and firebelly). I don't really have live plants in here other than hornwort for the fry to hide in but have rocks and plastic plants for the most part. My other tank is my pride and joy LOL It's completely planted and is mostly south american fish (other than 3 flying fox, 3 speckled cories, and 4 otos). My biggest concern with putting the goldfish in the newt tank is possible injury by the rocks or the pea puffer (about 1/2, not aggressive yet). Biggest concern with putting them in the 46 gal tank is that they will eat all my plants!
I want to keep the goldfish and my husband would kill me if I asked to set up another tank LOL
Any advice would be appreciated!

 

[confusion]

I'm pretty sure people are passing out at their respective keyboards over the goldfish in your 10G tank

Maybe your husband would like a pond?

 

[Jen_S]

They are small and I do realize that the big bodied goldfish (i.e. oranda, lionhead, veiltail) get 8+ inches. These 3 are quite small at this point. Right now the size is ok, I know not ideal. When they outgrow the tanks that I have setup, hopefully, we will be living in a place where we can put in a pond though black moors are a very poor choice for a pond because of their vision difficulties.
I know that I'm new to this forum but I kept fish before I had my human kids for 3+ years, I have worked in a petstore for 3+ years as well. and do my research first (for the most part LOL).
Thank you for your reply!

 

[afishdude]

those 3 goldies will need a 55g+

 

[three-fingers]

Your goldfish will no only eat the baby cherry shrimp, they will also eat the adults.

The tank with newts in it doesn't sound suitable for the newts TBH, does it have any land area for them? Also, commercially available newts should be kept in cold water (despite what the pet store told you), keeping them at higher temps can often lead to bad health problems, but at the very least I'm told it will be significantly shortening their life span. Make a post on the 'Invertebrates, Amphibians & Aquatic Reptiles Forum' for more info .

When they outgrow the tanks that I have setup, hopefully, we will be living in a place where we can put in a pond though black moors are a very poor choice for a pond because of their vision difficulties.

Unfortunately, goldfish appear to a species of fish that 'stunt', so waiting for them to outgrow the tank is not too wise and will most likely lead to serious problems. See this post .

Your right, fancy goldfish like black moors are a poor choice for ponds, the really don't seem to be able cope with low winter temperatures at all, as well as competition with other fish.

Since this post concerns goldfish, you would probably get a better response by posting it on the 'Coldwater Fish and Ponds' section .

But personally I'm of the opinion you only have two options: get a new bigger tank for the goldfish or rehome them/take them back to the petstore.

 

[Jen_S]

Your goldfish will no only eat the baby cherry shrimp, they will also eat the adults.

The tank with newts in it doesn't sound suitable for the newts TBH, does it have any land area for them? Also, commercially available newts should be kept in cold water (despite what the pet store told you), keeping them at higher temps can often lead to bad health problems, but at the very least I'm told it will be significantly shortening their life span. Make a post on the 'Invertebrates, Amphibians & Aquatic Reptiles Forum' for more info .

When they outgrow the tanks that I have setup, hopefully, we will be living in a place where we can put in a pond though black moors are a very poor choice for a pond because of their vision difficulties.

Unfortunately, goldfish appear to a species of fish that 'stunt', so waiting for them to outgrow the tank is not too wise and will most likely lead to serious problems. See this post .

Your right, fancy goldfish like black moors are a poor choice for ponds, the really don't seem to be able cope with low winter temperatures at all, as well as competition with other fish.

Since this post concerns goldfish, you would probably get a better response by posting it on the 'Coldwater Fish and Ponds' section .

But personally I'm of the opinion you only have two options: get a new bigger tank for the goldfish or rehome them/take them back to the petstore.

I have no heater in the newt tank, where did I say there was a heater? The only tank with a heater is the 46 gal bow front to keep it at 82 degrees for the angels. I have kept 4 newts in the same tank (8 years ago) with no problems. Of course I have areas for them to come out on. There is a turtle dock and a piece of driftwood for them to come out on. They are quite happy and hale and hearty but they weren't the creatures I posted about. There are pictures of the 2 bigger tanks in my photobucket link in my signature.

As for stunting the goldfish that is not my intention. I just meant until they got a little bigger. Sorry I missed the pond section. And I do understand that goldfish need a bigger tank, that's why I asked questions (not to be berated). Thanks so much for no help.

 

[confusion]

Thanks so much for no help.

Don't get discouraged. I'm quite certain that everyone on this forum has done/is doing something that others on the forum strongly object to. The people here really do care about the well being of fish, and when they feel that harm is being done - like stunting goldfish - they're going to be vocal about it. Now, you could also make the case that at least they aren't in a bowl.

There doesn't seem to be a lot of good options in your situation. If you leave the goldfish in the 10G, they'll eat the shrimp. If you move them to the 46G, they'll shred your plants. I'm not going to pass judgement on what the 20H, because I have no knowledge of or experience with frogs and newts.

One (inexpensive) suggestion is to get a 2.5G tank for your shrimp. I don't know how many you have, though. 2.5G's are about $9 by me. Then again, so are 10G's.

 

[Jen_S]

Thanks so much for no help.

Don't get discouraged. I'm quite certain that everyone on this forum has done/is doing something that others on the forum strongly object to. The people here really do care about the well being of fish, and when they feel that harm is being done - like stunting goldfish - they're going to be vocal about it. Now, you could also make the case that at least they aren't in a bowl.

There doesn't seem to be a lot of good options in your situation. If you leave the goldfish in the 10G, they'll eat the shrimp. If you move them to the 46G, they'll shred your plants. I'm not going to pass judgement on what the 20H, because I have no knowledge of or experience with frogs and newts.

One (inexpensive) suggestion is to get a 2.5G tank for your shrimp. I don't know how many you have, though. 2.5G's are about $9 by me. Then again, so are 10G's.

LOL I'm getting 40 shrimp though I plan to put some in the 46 gal tank too. Confusion thank you for your second reply, you were at least constructively crticizing me LOL. I know I shouldn't have gotten 3 of them but I have 3 kids and someone would have been upset. Maybe I'll just put them in both tanks (for now, not permanent all!!!!!!). If I'm seeming short with everyone I apologize! Please understand that I've had sick kids at my house for a week now with at least another week to go. My 3 year old daughter also has the chicken pox bad enough that she's having trouble sleeping which means I am as well.
I already have a 2.5 gal eclipse tank but I'm having terrible luck with it. I put a female betta in, she died. I put 3 guppy fry in, they lived and are now in the 20 gal tank. I put in 9 new baby fry. They all died. I just am having terrible trouble though I think my son helped by feeding too much with the 9 tiny fry. I've tested the water and the ammonia is high so I'm working on fixing that before adding anything. Just cycling with freshwater snails for now.

 

[three-fingers]

I have no heater in the newt tank, where did I say there was a heater?

You didn't, I just assumed (obviously incorrectly) that since you keep tropical species such as dwarf frogs, guppies and dwarf puffers, it would be a heated tropical tank . Given the different temperature preferences of the tanks various inhabitants, you may (or, as I get the impression, you may not ) want to reconsider it's stocking.

The only tank with a heater is the 46 gal bow front to keep it at 82 degrees for the angels. I have kept 4 newts in the same tank (8 years ago) with no problems. Of course I have areas for them to come out on. There is a turtle dock and a piece of driftwood for them to come out on. They are quite happy and hale and hearty but they weren't the creatures I posted about. There are pictures of the 2 bigger tanks in my photobucket link in my signature.

No worries, I simply missed the part in your original post that said the newts had land area (however, so many people neglect this need). But see above .

As for stunting the goldfish that is not my intention. I just meant until they got a little bigger. Sorry I missed the pond section. And I do understand that goldfish need a bigger tank, that's why I asked questions (not to be berated). Thanks so much for no help.

I never at all thought stunting the goldfish was your intention, but the point I was trying to make was that they will most likely never "outgrow" the tank/s, so waiting for them to do so as you said you were going to do, is not a wise decision .
No need to be defensive, nobody's berating you at all, I'm sorry if you got that impression. We're simply trying to help through offering some advice .
And your welcome .

I plan to put some in the 46 gal tank too.

Angels will certainly eat any shrimp they can catch too . And angels are good at catching shrimp.

With your other tank, the goldfish are probably going to out compete/harass your ADF's, and the puffer will at least eventually harass the goldfish (same is possible for the other inhabitants anyway, just slightly less likely).

 

[Jen_S]

OK, The newt tank have stayed a constant 78 degrees. I know the puffer is fine for now with his tankmates but may not be when he/she grows up. I'm most concerned about the guppies.
The angels are nickle and slightly bigger than quarter sized so for now at least not a problem.
I'm sorry I got defensive Like I mentioned above sick kids/ lack of sleep. Please bear with me.
I originally had the guppies in the big tank but the serpae tetras killed one by eating fins so I moved them. I will say the dojo loach was something of an impulse but it's pretty cool. I also had a dwarf frog in the 46 gal tank but them read that it's a little deep plus my filter current is too strong and the poor thing got stuck and drown. The 2 that are in the newt tank are doing quite well (another creature picked out by my kids).
I'm trying so hard to work with my kids and letting them pick out some fish too, please bear with my being stubborn!

 

[confusion]

LOL I'm getting 40 shrimp though I plan to put some in the 46 gal tank too. Confusion thank you for your second reply, you were at least constructively crticizing me LOL. I know I shouldn't have gotten 3 of them but I have 3 kids and someone would have been upset. Maybe I'll just put them in both tanks (for now, not permanent all!!!!!!). If I'm seeming short with everyone I apologize! Please understand that I've had sick kids at my house for a week now with at least another week to go. My 3 year old daughter also has the chicken pox bad enough that she's having trouble sleeping which means I am as well.
I already have a 2.5 gal eclipse tank but I'm having terrible luck with it. I put a female betta in, she died. I put 3 guppy fry in, they lived and are now in the 20 gal tank. I put in 9 new baby fry. They all died. I just am having terrible trouble though I think my son helped by feeding too much with the 9 tiny fry. I've tested the water and the ammonia is high so I'm working on fixing that before adding anything. Just cycling with freshwater snails for now.

My first response was somewhat tongue in cheek, since I new what was coming

It's really easy to have disasters in the smaller tanks if they aren't well cycled. The small amount of water can get overcome with ammonia or other bad stuff really fast.

I have 2 kids, so I can't completely relate, but I do know what you're going through. I hope it gets better soon.

One last thing - I've tried shrimp in tanks with angels on several occaisions, and the angesl systematically CHOW on every last one. They must be yummy.

 

[Jen_S]

They are leaving the bamboo shrimp alone but it's larger than they are LOL.
Eventually we plan to have at least one more tank bigger than the 46 gal but space limits us to this for now We also have a large sugar glider cage in the family room so honestly no more tank room unless we get rid of the couch which alas with only one other chair really isn't a possibility for a family of 5 I would like to have a 55-75 gal goldfish tank in a year or so and my husband REALLY wants red devils so we will have to have another tank for those.
OK, I've talked with Craig, my husband, and we're wondering how much harm would come to the goldfish being kept at 82 degrees? I can also gradually reduce the tank temp a few degrees if you think I should before considering moving the goldfish. Most of my plants in that tank are inexpensive and fast growing. I know best case scenario would be for them to have a huge tank now but I'm also trying to teach my kids responsibilty with pets (no matter the species) so I really hesitate to just get rid of them.

 

[DiscusKeeper403]

those 3 goldies will need a 55g+

Rubbish! Three goldies need a 40 gallon minimum... Don't know where you got the hat to pull that one out of...

 

[afishdude]

discuslova you need to chill, everytime someone posts something wrong your the first to jump on them and yell at them. thats not what these forums are for. and nobody has even talked about that since the first post. so don't know where you got the hat to pull that one out of...


and for the reall reason this topic is here il answer some of jen s's questions. keeping goldies at any temp over 72ºF will lead to long term dieases and ilnesses. although goldies can cope with high temps they should never be kept long term in temperatures over 75ºF

I know best case scenario would be for them to have a huge tank now but I'm also trying to teach my kids responsibilty with pets (no matter the species) so I really hesitate to just get rid of them.

thats great that your teaching them that but just remember next time to steer them towards a small tankmate like a guppie or something. or better yet explain to them why its not posable to keep goldies next time. we all have made mistakes and yours is typical so dont get all worked up about it.

 

[Jen_S]

OK, here's another question then about tank temp. How does one keep the tank cooler? It's summer here with the temps in the upper 90's outside. Thermostat is set at 80 (would have bill issues if it wasn't LOL). Both tanks without heaters are maintaining a 78 degree temp. Other than floating baggies of ice I don't know of another way to cool it off. That or water changes with cold water.