Mysterious Fish Death

[electric yellow]

Hi Wise Fish Doctors

Could someone point me in the right direction to an answer please? Ive been sitting here scratching my head...

My fishies in my communal tank are dying...mysteriouslly...they all look really healthy but it is seeming to happen more and more and if they arent half gobbled up they just plain disappear. They arent babies either. I thought i may be under feeding or over feeding but i think its something more.

Over the past three weeks we have lost:

2 bristol nose plecs (one today)
1 bronze cory (today)
2 guppies (vanished)
1 zebra danio (vanished)
1 blue ram (found wedged between rocks)
2 platys
6 neons (over night and they are the only babies)
1 tiger barb
1 dwarf flame gourami


Without pushing the panic button im concerned as to what could possibly be wrong. I feed them every two days. The water readings are good. Water looks crystal clear. There is no signs of white spots or any fungus on any of them. Their gills are maybe a bit pinkish but not all of them are like that. I noticed the bristol nose that died today had a redish patch on his back the other day when he was out swimming around. They havent lost their appetite at all!

What could it possibly be?

I am going to do a water change and clean the filter this weekend see if that helps if there is anything wrong.

 

[WILDER]

If you said red inflamed gills I would of been worried.
The reddish patch on the plec did it have a circling of white dead skin around the edges of the patch, or a white centre.
Any signs of flicking and rubbing.
How many gallons is the tank.
How many fish and which type.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

i would suspect bacterial infection as sometimes you get them where fish exhibit next to do symptoms and just suddenly die.

you're right though, too many deaths to be a coincidence.

 

[pinkdolphin_113]

yea, what other fish do you have?
is the tank well covered? because that would be an easy explaination of the vanashing fish. unless there is a misidentified predator in there with them.

how often do you check the water? and what do you check for?
vanashing fish just floating around, rotting away has serious conciquences and the water will stay clear but micro organisms, maybe bacteria too (i don't kno, i'm still getting to terms with the micro part of fish keeping), will still be getting released into the water.
i remember a few months back, one of my otos died and, being such a small fish, i hadn't realised until it had half rotted away. it was stuck in the crown of an amazon sword and had been releasing all sorts of things into my water, still crystal clear! i lost my precious L134 because of it
just have a good look around to see if you can see any of them.
if you can't test for things that may have an affect on the fish, i only test for nitrite regularly, take a water sample to your lfs and i'm sure they'd test it for anything else for ya... i'm doing it today lol

 

[electric yellow]

If you said red inflamed gills I would of been worried.
The reddish patch on the plec did it have a circling of white dead skin around the edges of the patch, or a white centre.
Any signs of flicking and rubbing.
How many gallons is the tank.
How many fish and which type.

Its a 4ft by 2ft. (SO i think 90gallon)
Water stats:
pH: 7.2
nitrIte: 0ppm
ammonia: 0ppm
nitrAte: 0ppm

Temp: 26deg celcius

Filtration:
aqua one cf700 external filter
two air stones (one in a hippo)

Decor: gravel, two plants and a range of hiding spot

Stock (well right now):
2 clown loaches
3 grouamis
1 tiger barb
2 blue rams
3 small zebra danios
4 neons
4 platys
3 plecs
3 corys (1 cory was half dead when i got home tonight) he was pale and laying on his side down the bottom. I had to put him to sleep.

So there is a range of fish. The all get along great and we havent had any problems before. I thought maybe ov er feeding or over stocking but i dont think so. As its been happening for a few weeks now where they just vanish of die.



I didnt notice any white bits on the plec But it was red enough for me to notice on a brown plec.

Ihe gills on the platys are pink (which i assune is normal) but I may be wrong. The loaches and gouramis have no signs of fungus or red gills. One of the loaches occassionally flicks against a log but its rare. If one flicks, shouldnt they all flick? The tanks been established now for around 10months.

Their appetite seems fine. But it seems that its either a sudden disappearance or they seem to lose interest in what the others are doing.

My water is decholrinated etc before it is used in a water change.

Such a stressfull hobbie

 

[electric yellow]

yea, what other fish do you have?
is the tank well covered? because that would be an easy explaination of the vanashing fish. unless there is a misidentified predator in there with them.

how often do you check the water? and what do you check for?
vanashing fish just floating around, rotting away has serious conciquences and the water will stay clear but micro organisms, maybe bacteria too (i don't kno, i'm still getting to terms with the micro part of fish keeping), will still be getting released into the water.
i remember a few months back, one of my otos died and, being such a small fish, i hadn't realised until it had half rotted away. it was stuck in the crown of an amazon sword and had been releasing all sorts of things into my water, still crystal clear! i lost my precious L134 because of it
just have a good look around to see if you can see any of them.
if you can't test for things that may have an affect on the fish, i only test for nitrite regularly, take a water sample to your lfs and i'm sure they'd test it for anything else for ya... i'm doing it today lol

My tank is in my lounge with glass plates on the top, aswell as the typical wooden hood and light. Its not near any air freshners or smelly things and we dont smoke. I have also read the other threads about mysterious fish deaths etc for back ground info but am drawing a blank. Im still pretty new to this :\

When i say 'vanish' i mean vanish. There is not signs on them anywhere!

Ive been telling myself it is the gouramis knocking them off one by one if its not an infection of some form...but its too many to be just a food chain thing.

My water i test every week or so and i use API Freshwater Master Test Kit which tests for ammonia, ph, high ph, nitrIte and nitrAte.

 

[WILDER]

The gills are fine.
Red patches are bacterial but can be caused by parasites.
Signs of bacterial infections are also being pale or darker in colour, being listless and lethagic and sometimes not eating.

When you loose alot of fish without signs of gasping and flicking and rubbing, usually you then treat the tank with a bacterial med.

If the corys are laying on there sides that can be a sign of a bacterial infections.
Corys are more prone to bacterial infections.
[URL="http/www.petsforum.com/cis-fishnet/afm/G29060.htm"]http/www.petsforum.com/cis-fishnet/afm/G29060.htm[/URL]

Taken from the link.

The third type of infection produced by Aeromonas is by no means the least. This form is often the most virulent (potent) and can be rapidly fatal. This insidious form does not produce any noticeable external ulcers. The most notable feature is a behavioral change in which the infected fish generally become listless and lethargic. Some fish may lose color or appear darker. The fish do not feed, frequently seem off balance and may sink to the bottom laying on their sides. The course of the disease is rapid, and by the time the behavioral changes are noticed, the entire population of a tank may succumb, sometimes in a day or so. This is an internal infection, with the bacteria being found in the kidneys and blood of these fish. The bacteria produce potent toxins that account for the severity of the disease.

 

[electric yellow]

The gills are fine.
Red patches are bacterial but can be caused by parasites.
Signs of bacterial infections are also being pale or darker in colour, being listless and lethagic and sometimes not eating.

When you loose alot of fish without signs of gasping and flicking and rubbing, usually you then treat the tank with a bacterial med.

If the corys are laying on there sides that can be a sign of a bacterial infections.
Corys are more prone to bacterial infections.
<a href="http/www.petsforum.com/cis-fishnet/afm/G29060.htm" target="_blank">http/www.petsforum.com/cis-fishnet/afm/G29060.htm</a>

Hmm...so maybe bacterial. There was definantly a red patch. it would of been the size of a 5 or 10cent peice. It was only one cory that was on his side. The others all seem fine. But there have been so many deaths that there has to be something...

Would you suggest we treat it as a bacterial? What would you suggest? Ive never treated a bacterial before.

 

[WILDER]

Water changes to dilute the bacteria down in the tank.
Yes I would add a bacterial med.
Whats your location.

 

[electric yellow]

Water changes to dilute the bacteria down in the tank.
Yes I would add a bacterial med.
Whats your location.

Thanks for all your help Wilder

My location: (eastern suburbs) Melbourne, Victoria, Australia

 

[WILDER]

I would ask the lfs for a good bacterial med, as I don't know what meds you can get in your country.
Good luck.

 

[Madam Macaw]

Should the nitrates be 0? That doesn't sound right to me.

 

[Bloo]

Should the nitrates be 0? That doesn't sound right to me.

You're right. It shouldn't be zero on a stocked tank. It can't be.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

not necessarily, it is possible to have 0 nitrates, unlikley but possible.

we've got 0 nitrate in our tap water, i've had a few tanks with a fair few plants and relativley light stocking which have run at around 0 nitrates, occasionally creeping up to 2/3ppm but never anything significant.

also rememebr nitrate test kits are not v reliable, it could just be a duff reading.

 

[vinylman]

The vanishing isn't too much of a mystery. As unpalatable as it is to many of us, many fish will not pass up the offer of a free meal - it won't take long for a recently deceased fish to be disposed of by its tankmates. Do you buy all your fish from the same shop?; and do they all look healthy in the shop's tanks?; no sign of diseased tankmates?.