Making Sure

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Amunet

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Other than BGA (since it's a bacteria)..... true algae isn't dangerous to fish right?

Just need to make sure b/c I swear our 28gallon is algae heaven! It's absolutely overun with hair algae atm lol.

Also... I was thinking about adding a DIY CO2 thing to the tank to see if that would help, BUT there are 3 filters and an airstone running in it so should I even bother?

Also, would running 2 lines (so I can have it at both ends of the tank) from 1 bottle be ok or would using 2 bottles be better?
 
The only time normal algae will kill fish is if the tank is full of it and there is no surface turbulence at night. Then the algae can use up the oxygen and the fish suffocate. But the same thing will happen in heavily planted tanks. At night the plants use oxygen and release carbon dioxide (CO2). If there is no surface movement to help the excess CO2 out and more oxygen in, the fish can have problems.
But in a normal healthy system, algae is perfectly normal and won't have any adverse effects on the fish. Quite the opposite in fact, many fish will feed on the algae.

You can run 2 or 3 lines from one bottle. People with really big tanks often do this so the CO2 is more evenly spread out in the tank.

If you want to run CO2 then have it on during the day and turn it off at night. When it is on during the day you turn off the airstones. But keep the filters running at all times. If the filters are aimed towards the surface then adjust them so they don't create as much surface turbulence. At night you turn the air pumps back on.
 
I have another question....

How do you make a CO2 reactor? I've been reading up on it and... well.. I'm very confused on how to make one.

I'd like something like this one
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcRtqlmGNV8
or this one..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuSbiN1JqL8

I mean it looks simple enough but my tired brain just isn't getting how to set it all up.
All of the websites I go to that tries to explain it to you only have these really crappy little drawn pictures that just don't help at all.
 
CO2 reactor can be made out of a 2litre cool drink bottle. Fill the bottle up with water and add some sugar. Let the sugar dissolve completely and then add some live yeast, (bakers or brewers yeast). Put the lid on the bottle and attach some airline.
The yeast eat the sugar and release carbon dioxide as a bi-product. The gas then comes out the airline and you can put it into the tank.
The yeast will keep growing and producing gas until the alcohol level in the bottle gets too much for them and they die. Then you start another bottle.

A bigger bottle or container will produce more CO2 for longer. Beer or spirit yeast (available from anywhere that sells home beer making kits) will grow for longer than bakers or bread yeast.
 
I know about that part :p I was talking about the way to get it into the water... the whole powerhead + siphoning tube thing that's supposed to help dissolve most of the CO2 quickly and lets it back into the water... as is shown on both of the youtube links I posted. I'm not quite understanding how to make that part.
 
sorry I don't download stuff from youtube. I only have dial up and it takes forever.

years ago we just used a bottle and you cut the bottom off. Have the lid on the bottle and put the bottle in the aquarium with the bottom of the bottle near the gravel. Then we attach a bit of airline from the CO2 unit and join it to the bottle top and let the bottle fill up with CO2.
The water would come in contact with the CO2 in the bottle and then be distributed around the tank by a powerhead. You have to use something to hold the bottle down because they float but that was about it.

The other thing is an airstone. This is joined to the CO2 by airline and the CO2 just comes out of the airstone like normal bubles from an airpump.
 
The only time normal algae will kill fish is if the tank is full of it and there is no surface turbulence at night. Then the algae can use up the oxygen and the fish suffocate. But the same thing will happen in heavily planted tanks. At night the plants use oxygen and release carbon dioxide (CO2). If there is no surface movement to help the excess CO2 out and more oxygen in, the fish can have problems.
But in a normal healthy system, algae is perfectly normal and won't have any adverse effects on the fish. Quite the opposite in fact, many fish will feed on the algae.

You can run 2 or 3 lines from one bottle. People with really big tanks often do this so the CO2 is more evenly spread out in the tank.

If you want to run CO2 then have it on during the day and turn it off at night. When it is on during the day you turn off the airstones. But keep the filters running at all times. If the filters are aimed towards the surface then adjust them so they don't create as much surface turbulence. At night you turn the air pumps back on.

The quote above is very misleading. Algae will NEVER cause fish a problem. Plants and algae will produce oxygen as well as use it at night as they feed off the carbon in the CO2 and release the excess O.

Most heavily planted tanks do not have ANY surface turbulence at night even if they are running CO2 24/7 and the mass of plants will consume much more of everything than algae.

My tank (as with many other peoples) has double the recommended ("/G) fishload, 24/7 CO2 and is very heavily planted yet no problems O wise with the fish. And I have never owned an air pump. If the fish are struggling it is for a reason other than algae.

I have never known people to run several airlines for DIY CO2 on bigger tanks or any other tank. In fact on larger tanks DIY is really pointless as you can never achieve the consistency or quantity of CO2 required. pressurised is really the only way to go over 125Ltr IMO otherwise go the low light non CO2 method.

When using several bottles of yeast CO2 then most people link it into 1 line and 1 diffusor. Then use the filter to distribute it around the tank.


I would ask you why you are using 3 filters? and do you have any pics of the algae? What lighting you have over the tank and if you are adding any plant ferts?

Link to CO2 reactor below:
TB DIY Reactor


Andy
 
It's definitely hair algae in the tank.
We're using 2 24w Life-Glo bulbs.....
I add in Leaf Zone and Flourish Potassium into the tank once a week after a water change.

It has 3 filters b/c the tank is a bit overstocked so needed a little more filtration imo. And one of the filters is mainly in the tank for the hillstream loach. It produces a current that the hillstream likes so I leave it in the tank.
 
Not too sure about this tank TBH.

Light is not overly powerful.

With non CO2 implementation what water change regime are you using?

Latest thinking (and that of old tbh) is virtually zero water changes for a non CO2 planted tank!!! This is because there is more concentrated Co2 in tap water than there will be in the tank water and with any planted tank CO2 stability is key. Therefore if you inject CO2 you can do water changes to your heart's content as long as you keep CO2 stable (not too large with a DIY setup). If you don't inject then no water changes so you don't go up and down all the time with CO2 concentration. It stays at a low level but consistent.

Andy
 
The quote above is very misleading. Algae will NEVER cause fish a problem. Plants and algae will produce oxygen as well as use it at night as they feed off the carbon in the CO2 and release the excess O.
Most heavily planted tanks do not have ANY surface turbulence at night even if they are running CO2 24/7 and the mass of plants will consume much more of everything than algae.
Why is my quote misleading? I didn't state that "Algae will NEVER cause fish a problem". Please don't rearrange sentences to suit your needs.

And plants use oxygen at night and release carbon dioxide. They cannot photosynthesise in the dark. When it is dark they rest and do not use CO2.

People that run CO2 all day and all night are wasting the stuff. It's not necessary. Do you eat when you are asleep? I doubt it. And plants don't eat when they are resting either.
 
The quote above is very misleading. Algae will NEVER cause fish a problem. Plants and algae will produce oxygen as well as use it at night as they feed off the carbon in the CO2 and release the excess O.
Most heavily planted tanks do not have ANY surface turbulence at night even if they are running CO2 24/7 and the mass of plants will consume much more of everything than algae.
Why is my quote misleading? I didn't state that "Algae will NEVER cause fish a problem". Please don't rearrange sentences to suit your needs.

And plants use oxygen at night and release carbon dioxide. They cannot photosynthesise in the dark. When it is dark they rest and do not use CO2.

People that run CO2 all day and all night are wasting the stuff. It's not necessary. Do you eat when you are asleep? I doubt it. And plants don't eat when they are resting either.

To set the record straight it is you that is understanding my sentences incorrectly.

I didn't say that you stated algae will never cause fish a problem. I stated that myself. the quote I said was misleading was the one that says......QUOTE...before and after it. It is above my statement highlighted in a blue box. I know....a little hard for you to notice!!! So I did not rearrange your sentences at all. I clicked on the quote button on your post and it copied your exact words. Then I stated the fact that algae will NEVER cause the fish problems.

You are indeed correct about plants using CO2 in the day and O at night but you are wrong that plants cannot photosynthesize in the dark. Most plants slow down when it gets dark and some do indeed stop photosynthesizing so it is wrong to state that they all stop!!! Resting does not always mean sleeping.

People that run CO2 are wasting the stuff is a very silly comment as you are now offending many very good plant (and fish) enthusiasts) and it is not a waste for them. There are several reasons that some of us run 24/7:

1. So that the Ph remains reasonably constant instead of dropping a point in the day and rising a point at night.
2. Some plants seem to prefer the water to stay the same parameters (Ph and CO2 ppm) I assume because these are the ones that slow down rather than stop.
3. So that we don't have to use a solenoid which of course is electric and once we are at work a power cut will mean the CO2 doesn't come on at all and we then have wasted our money having a stable system because it is now unstable.
4. Some people use CO2 24/7 because they find that BBA grows when they cut it off at night.

So to say it is a waste is just plain silly. And to answer the last of your statements. Some plants do eat while they are sleeping as I have stated above.

Please read my posts properly before trying to accuse me of something. If I say a quote is misleading then I will use your quote. Not change it from something that is clearly visible 2 posts above.

Andy
 
Why do you say algae will never cause fish problems?
If there is a lot of algae in the water, ie: green water, it can use all the oxygen up at night and cause fish to suffocate if there isn't any or enough surface turbulence to keep the oxygen levels up.
Filamentous algae can grow so much it actually makes it difficult for fish to move through it and has on occasions entangled or trapped them and held them until they were freed or died.

Would you mind enlightening us as to which plants can photosynthesise at night when there is no light.
 
Why do you say algae will never cause fish problems?
If there is a lot of algae in the water, ie: green water, it can use all the oxygen up at night and cause fish to suffocate if there isn't any or enough surface turbulence to keep the oxygen levels up.
Filamentous algae can grow so much it actually makes it difficult for fish to move through it and has on occasions entangled or trapped them and held them until they were freed or died.

Would you mind enlightening us as to which plants can photosynthesise at night when there is no light.

I have no idea on which plants but it is true. Just google photosynthesis+aquatic and something should come up. A lot of 'fishkill' comes up too but I have not heard of anyone (who has their CO2 setup at the correct level) have their fish die overnight due to algae using up all the oxygen and there are many greenwater pictures on this forum with no horror stories!!.

I myself kiled a whole tank with CO2 last year but this was during the photoperiod and due to a dodgy second hand needle valve emptying the whole cylinder into the tank!!! There are many stories like this but as I say I have never heard of anyone having algae consume all the oxygen.

I say Algae will never cause problems because algae just like plants photosynthesize consuming CO2 and expelling O by day and then consuming O at night so if algae can be a problem due to this then no-one would have plants as they do this on a much larger scale.

Not many plant people have turbulence in their tanks unless it suits them or they are trying to disturb a surface film.

If you are so worried about algae then I would either stop keeping fish oir put some zeolite in your filter doing heavy heavy water changes daily to remove all the ammonia (as this is what triggers algae).

And can you show me some examples of filamentous algae trapping fish? Damn strong algae to do that!!!
 
I don't have any pictures of filamentous algae trapping fish but it happened in a tank with some killifish. They got stuck in it (tangled up) and I had to cut them free. Cutting was easier on the fish, I just trimmed around them and they could get out. Unfortunately I lost one that I didn't get to in time. It doesn't happen often but it can happen.

Green water killing fish happens quite a lot here. It is primarily ponds and fish living in them. I suppose it is to do with the different climates. We have pretty hot summers.
There are always people complaining about how all their fish died overnight. You have a look at their ponds and they are full of algae and have no aeration or surface movement. The fish were fine the day before but die overnight. The water tests ok and there doesn't appear to be anything toxic in them, certainly not that we can test for. And it usually happens on hot summer nights.
The conclusion being the warm weather decreases the oxygen holding capabilities of the water and without surface turbulence the algae, fish and bacteria use up what little oxygen is left and the fish suffocate. The big fish go first and sometimes the small fish are fine but not always.

A lot of people use green water ponds for rearing fish fry through the first few weeks of life. Quite often they complain about losing entire batches of fry to unknown causes. The ponds are covered with netting and free of insect larvae that could prey on them. No chemicals have been added and there are no obvious signs on the fry. The only thing they have in common is they don't have any surface turbulence and all the fish die overnight during warm or hot weather. The free floating algae, fish and bacteria use up the remaining oxygen and the fish suffocate.

It's easily fixed tho, we just tell people to have their air pumps or fountains on all the time, especially at night, and they never have the problem again. They quite often find after running their pumps continuously, their PH stabilises as well.
We also suggest they do a few more water changes and remove the algae where possible.
 
There is a huge difference between sunlight and fluorescent lamps though. It would be virtually impossible to match the light that sunlight gives over a tank even if you covered the ceiling with fittings!!

I would guess it is also the temperature as you state.

I have a couple of PC fans in my hood for the summer days but the tank water last year maxed out at 32ºC and stayed over 30ºC for a fair few days with no problems (no water turbulence and CO2 injection!!)

Andy
 

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