Keyhole Cichlid Or Angelfish?

[m1lky12]

So I'm looking to upgrade my tank from a 100 to 175 liter, I've already got both tanks but I'm just waiting for the green light to be able to start up the bigger one as well as pay day. I've already got rid of my old stock so I'm basically starting from scratch (though I'll be keeping my old tank running and dosing ammonia to keep the filter cycled for the meantime.

I'm planning a planted South American biotope and for a while was going to go with a single angel as a centerpiece fish, however I've read a few journals and have begun looking at Keyhole Cichlids, now I'm undecided. So I'm just wandering which fish would be best with my other potential stock? I was going to go for;

Definite-

Rummy Nose Tetra
Panda Corys
BN catfish

Hopeful-

Banjo Catfish
Royal Whiptail (Sturisoma panamense)

Possible-

Marble Hatchetfish

Any help or advice would be awesome, thanks.

 

[MBOU]

Keyholes will definitely suit your stocking better!! Both size wise and temperament wise Angels would be very cramped in 175L and might lead to them being a bit more gnarly in their personalities and maybe even wanting to eat the rummynose... seen it all lol.
 
Besides, everyone has angels, takes someone else to see the true beauty in the poor overlooked Keyholes!! They just take aaaages to colour up to their truly beautiful gold spangled bronzy colour but when they do, they are stunning! Alternatively, a similar species though bit more boisterous personality wise is the Rainbow Cichlid..
 
The only thing that just wont fit is that banjo catfish! It will eat your rummynose eventually and might hurt itself trying to eat cories... they aren't all that bright bless them but they lunge at movement near where they buried themselves...
 
That said, if you want something similar, you could have a little group of Hara catfish

 

[m1lky12]

Hey thanks for the advice! I was concerned that an Angel might see the tetras as food, but my thoughts were that it would be added last as a juvenile so would grow with them and not see them as a food source (I've read that people do this to stop them from snacking on Neons). Though I agree on what your saying about the Cichlids, something I've never really thought about until the other day.. would be an interesting choice and they are such beautiful fish. How many would you say I could fit in with my potential stock? Just a single one or a pair? Think I'd definitely be overstocked with anymore though!

And I wouldn't have thought a Banjo Catfish would be a serious danger to tetras and corys? Everything I've read about them says that they're community fish which shouldn't bother any fish other than possibly fry and Neons (Rummynoses should be twice the size when fully grown). Though I had one a few months ago before it died of a bacteria infection, and I can see how it could eat something that size, it's mouth was deceptively big! Shame it died because for something that I would barely see it was my favorite fish while I had it.

And I just looked at the Hara Catfish and they looked a lot like Banjos! Though there from Asia so wouldn't quite fit into a South American biotope 

haha.
 
Also just to give you some info on the tank both the 100 and 175 liters are corner tanks, so while they're quite tall they don't have the same water surface area that a conventional tank would have, so I need to take that into account with stocking.

 

[techen]

The Cichlids are also known to eat tetras as well as Angels so you need to be careful anyway. 
 
So long as you don't go stocking neon tetras and get something larger like emperor tetras you won't have a problem with fish eating them.

 

[m1lky12]

The Cichlids are also known to eat tetras as well as Angels so you need to be careful anyway. 
 
So long as you don't go stocking neon tetras and get something larger like emperor tetras you won't have a problem with fish eating them.

Only real concern that I'd have with my planned stock is the Rummynose Tetras, they can grow just over 2 inches so a felly grown individual isn't really a concern to me, either way the Keyhole or Angel would more than likely be added as a juvenile so the tetras should be big enough before it's fully grown.

 

[MBOU]

Banjos I have seen were a good size, as adults I couldnt see them having a problem with adult rummynoses.. they are ambush predators or at least... oppourtunistic predators anyway....
 
Though tbh, you dont see a busting lot of them anyway... they just bury themselves lol. Always found it curious that so many people wanted fish they rarely saw and a lot of the time.... they were the same people who wanted lots of guppies and platies which are the brightest and most 'in your face' kinda fish.
 
Hmmmmm there are hundreds of south american catfish species anyway! How about trying to source some unusual corydoras? You might get the chance to breed them if you stick with one species... something like the venezuelan black cories... or... i dunno, whichever you like... or Aspidoras? They are cool!! Cories with whiskers!

 

[m1lky12]

I see what you mean, 6 inch adults and massive mouths could be a recipe for disaster with smaller torpedo shaped tetras, don't think I could pass one up if I saw them in a LFS though, rarely see them for sale, probably because of the reasons you've mentioned, not the most eye catching fish unless you specifically want one.

And I think I must have got lucky with the one I had then, would come out most feeding times and once it was out I wouldn't get bored of watching it move around the tank one way or another.. but maybe I'm just weird 

haha, plus they don't really take up much stocking room, not very messy and generally you don't have to give them any specific day to day attention.. infact I've read posts where people have been moving tanks and gone to take a plant or rock out and found one of these guys  living in there tank happily undetected for months after hitching a ride in with some plants from the LFS!!
 
And yeah I'll keep an eye out, like I said in my original post I'm going for those 3 species first then a centerpiece, then after that I'll keep some stocking space left so if I see anything I like and is suitable I can impulse buy haha, what's you take on the marbled hatchetfish? I read somewhere Angels couldn't be kept with them which was another reason I was looking into Keyhole Cichlids.

 

[MBOU]

Angels, keyholes, hatches.. they all get on just great People fuss over some fish a bit too much sometimes and cause more worry for people doing research!
 
The trouble with the Marble Hatchets is that you get good healthy wild batches from South America... or you get the younger, much more prone to dropping dead specimens imported from Singapore area.... easily told though, if the fish is a good 2cm at least, it is likely an American import. if it is 1-1.5cm and a bit thin/pale looking... likely a Singapore(and that area) import.
 
If marbles worry you, the Silvers are much more boisterous, less tolerant of cichlids being bullies and give as good as they get!! Though generally are gentle souls until you offer them bloodworms!

 

[m1lky12]

Haha I thought so! Reason I ask is something sticks in my mind that I read a while ago saying Angels are hit and miss with Hatchets and if they were to be in a community together Silver Hatchets were the way to go as like you said they give as good as they get! But Marbled Hatchets would be my preference, my local Maidenhead Aquatics has a batch which on the whole look healthy so I started reading up on them a bit, only slight concern is like I said my tanks a corner tank with a smaller surface area then conventional tanks and Hatchetfish being surface dwellers would need a larger area.. though it shouldn't be an issue in my upgrade. And apparently the vast majority are wild caught so they're seasonal stock where you'll get them for a few months then won't see any more for a while.. Just an excuse to get my tank sorted out quickly I guess haha.
 
One more question, how many Keyholes could I get in my 175 without overstocking, I was thinking possibly 2 as I read they like there own company and it shouldn't matter too much about male:female ratio?

 

[MBOU]

I would aim for a male/female pair to be safe but in my experience they tolerate each other fine, though best as male/female or a group of 5+ in which so long as majority are females, they didn't seem to care much.

 

[m1lky12]

Sounds good to me! I guess it's good they don't really care much as apparently they're very difficult to sex while they're young in LFS, thanks for you advice.. Much appreciated.