Julidochromis Dickfeldi And Marlieri Are Breeding

[fry_lover]

http/www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/Fishindx/juli-mar.htm

http/www.thetropicaltank.co.uk/Fishindx/juli-dik.htm


I havent posted this in the hybrid section, as i wanted to maximise my chances of fedback from people who know a fair bit about these type of fish, but if the thread needs to be moved, fair enough.

I have x1 Marlieri (2") and x1 Dickfeldi (2") in a 48x20x24 (approx 300 litre) tank that is mostly Malawi in stock (Yellow Labs, Small Acei, Small Red Zebra's, one Greshaki and a few other small Malawi), all the Malawi are in the 1-3" range.

You dont need to comment too much on mixing Malawi and Tangs, its something i intend to post on later. The Dickfeldi i got with the tank a few months ago and the Marlieri i had for quite a while beforehand.

Tank is sand, ocean rock and lava rock in set-up, pH in the 7.5 to 8.0 region and GH was 12 degree's when i last checked. Ammonia and Nitrite is always 0.0 on kits and Nitrate varies between 30-60 mg/l

Anyway........................

I am aware usually that different Julie species sometimes really dont like each other, i have seen it before!!! But these two seemed to "hang out" together straight away so i always wondered if they were a "pair", a couple of days ago i saw then with about 20-30 fry in a small pit they dug underneath and around a load of ocean rock.

My main questions are.....

1. The Marlieri is the one doing the guarding and the Dickfeldi is kind of keeping an eye out over the very local area, but its the Marlieri who's staying right next to fry. Does this help me determine the sex of the Julie's by this behaviour? I know Julie's can be tricky to sex just from looking at them? Usually the females are slightly bigger i know. They are both allowing some of the Malawi to swim by very close before they warn them off (and this is even not very aggressive).

2. I am tempted to just leave things and see how it pans out, but if none of the fry survive i am thinking about removing the Julie's to their own 2-foot tank. I havent had a breeding project in ages and i kind of miss it. I know this raises issues about hybrids? Does it count as a hybrid even thought its x2 Julidochromis? I guess it does?

3. I know Marlieri are known to "divorce" each other so to speak if you interfere with them when spawning or even interfere with a pair in any way. I saw this for myself last time and learned the hard way. I had a group of 4 (including the one i still have) and a pair where breeding (not this one) and the other two were co-habiting in the tank fine (3 foot tank). When i moved some fry, the next day x1 Marlieri was dead, another was half beaten to death (and later died). The remianing two survivors couldnt live together anymore so i moved one on and hence this is how i am left with one Marlieri. So this is why i am hesitant in changing anything.


any particular opinions, advice, feedback?

Thanks

 

[WaterBender1995]

You asked for OPINIONS, ADVICE, FEEDBACK....


all of these can be found in my signature link. please go there and read, it might give you a broader view of the hybrid/mutant topic.

 

[fry_lover]

You asked for OPINIONS, ADVICE, FEEDBACK....


all of these can be found in my signature link. please go there and read, it might give you a broader view of the hybrid/mutant topic.

Thanks, and i have saved that article from your signature on my favourites, as i do take it seriously, i just spent 5 mins reading through it, but i feel i really need to dedicate more time and have a good read, i probably only read 50% so far.

It does sound a bit "extreme" and emotionally loaded, especially when referring to Parrot Fish as having "disgracing tanks for over a decade" but i do value people's views on this. I myself (at the moment) am not massively interested in the "bigger picture" of hybrids, but please dont jump on me, i am still in the "debating" it mode.

But thats for your contribution, and like i say, it wont be wasted on me, i will read it properly and give it good consideration

 

[juanveldez]

weither or not it was intentional this topic does belong in the hybirds section, the only reason right now that I am leaving it here is that imo it wasn't intentional. But I do warn to tred carefully. not only to the OP but to everybody that responds to this post.

 

[fry_lover]

weither or not it was intentional this topic does belong in the hybirds section, the only reason right now that I am leaving it here is that imo it wasn't intentional. But I do warn to tred carefully. not only to the OP but to everybody that responds to this post.

i dont mind what forum its in, lets move it the Hybrid section if its best. I am more after knowing if anyone can tell whos the male out of this pair by the behaviour, the fact its hybrid fry is neither here nor there for me. Also want to know from Julidochromis experts about the chances of this pair "divorcing" if i change stuff around.

 

[dthoffsett]

1. The Marlieri is the one doing the guarding and the Dickfeldi is kind of keeping an eye out over the very local area, but its the Marlieri who's staying right next to fry. Does this help me determine the sex of the Julie's by this behaviour? I know Julie's can be tricky to sex just from looking at them? Usually the females are slightly bigger i know. They are both allowing some of the Malawi to swim by very close before they warn them off (and this is even not very aggressive).
Based on my own observations in the past, generally the female will stay with the fry, and the male will guard both the female and fry. So, my guess would be that the Marlieri is the female. The best way to make sure is to vent them though.

2. I am tempted to just leave things and see how it pans out, but if none of the fry survive i am thinking about removing the Julie's to their own 2-foot tank. I havent had a breeding project in ages and i kind of miss it. I know this raises issues about hybrids? Does it count as a hybrid even thought its x2 Julidochromis? I guess it does?
I wouldn't be surprised if most or all of them get eaten by the mbuna, it really depends on how aggressively the julii's defend their fry. Yes they count as hybrids. I'm not a fan of hybrids, but, IMO as long as you keep them, and never allow them out of your tank(s), I don't see a problem with it.

3. I know Marlieri are known to "divorce" each other so to speak if you interfere with them when spawning or even interfere with a pair in any way. I saw this for myself last time and learned the hard way. I had a group of 4 (including the one i still have) and a pair where breeding (not this one) and the other two were co-habiting in the tank fine (3 foot tank). When i moved some fry, the next day x1 Marlieri was dead, another was half beaten to death (and later died). The remianing two survivors couldnt live together anymore so i moved one on and hence this is how i am left with one Marlieri. So this is why i am hesitant in changing anything.
If it were me, I'd leave them in the tank, and introduce a couple of catfish (a synodontis species would work) to help eliminate any excess fry.

 

[fry_lover]

thanks for the feedback