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Guppynovice

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:S Please be patient - I get long winded. OK - so I bought some fish for my daughter for her birthday. I haven't had any since I was a child. And I am so overloaded with what to do. I've got a 10 gallon tank which came with all the fixens' (filter, heater, net, therm. strip), I've got some plastic plants (small children, can't handle real fish and real plants) and gravel of course. We started with a betta since we could get that right away (not realizing at the time about the whole set up and wait). After a day or so I was told I could put the betta in the tank (water was conditioned) so we did. He LOVES the tank. It's like he explores constantly. I always feel so sorry for those fish floating in those little bowls. ANYway, so today (72 hours after set-up) we bought a pregnant female guppy and two dwarf African frogs. We could only get the one female because they only had the one and we were told about the ratio thing. OK - so now comes all the confusion. And we were told the betta and guppies could live together. So far, so good even though I just read that it wasn't a good idea to put them together. Which is it? I guess that is the first question. 2nd question - How often should I clean the water? I plan on getting two more females and two males (3/2 ratio) and a couple of those skinny rock sucking fish. 3rd question - is that guppy ratio OK? 4th question - what in the world do I do with the pregnant guppy (Lola) if I want some of the babies to survive and knowing my luck won't be around when she has them to scoop them up? I bought one of those plastic floater things but have read they aren't good for the mamas. And I don't have the time and space (since I have a just mobile baby) to get another tank. Will any babies survive with a betta in the tank and the other guppies if I let them go all natural? 5th question - I was told you only change 10% of the water every other week. Is that right? 6th question - how do you know if the water is the same temperature - just test it with your finger and hope for the best? 7th question - is it natural for the fish to not eat when they first get transferred? Lola didn't try to eat anything. And what in the world? Put fresh vegetables in the water? Or live food? As you can see I need lots of advice. Please remember you are giving advice to a clueless beginner who hasn't got a great deal of time (small children) or space. But I do want to take good care of these little fish. I had no idea they would be so much fun to watch. My betta (magenta) seems very happy, Lola - indifferent. Thank you so much!
 
1) no, bettas and guppies do not go together. this is because bettas (who do not live well with other bettas as it is) will think a guppy is another betta due to their finnage and colors. Lots of petstores only know "bettas cant live with bettas, and theyre community fish" that simply isnt so.

2)Well first off i want to say, do you know how to stock? do you know what overstocking is? There is a general rule about overstocking, 1 inch of fish (at adult size) per gallon. that means you can only have 10 inches of fish, and with 2 dwarf african frogs, you cant fit much more in there. I dont know much more about that, so post in tropical chit chat for more on if your overstocked. As it is, i'd say to return the female guppy since she wont go good with the betta.

3) I dont know guppies well, so i cant answer this one. but as i said... just get rid of her, cuz i really doubt you have the room for all of this.

4)If you dont have the room (which you dont have the room in your tank, let alone elsewhere as you said) dont try to save any babies. If she has babies, the other fish will eat them. I'd let nature take its course, and they be eaten, if you dont decide to return the mom.

5)I dont know, Personally ive always changed 10% every other day, and if im going to go by weeks id do 50% every week. did you let your tank cycle, by the way? you didnt say. if you didnt, your fish are in GREAT danger.

6) I bought a floating thermometer that i put under the flowing water for a while, and i dont worry about it being REALLY accurate - just in the same general range.

7) Yes, it is normal after a stressful transfer for fish not to eat. just keep an eye on her.


"Put fresh vegetables in the water? Or live food?" Fresh vegetables for vegetarians, and brine shrimp/bloodworms for carnivores. In the wild, they do not eat flakes. Most local pet stores will carry freeze dried AND frozen bloodworms and brine shrimp (frozen has more beneficial nutrients for the fish), and for vegetarians... well, they like vegetables! Put in a slice of fresh cucumber for them to eat!




So yeah, my question: has your tank cycled? its VERY important, otherwise your fish will die from toxins in the water caused by fish waste, and by adding too many fish too soon
 
:S Please be patient - I get long winded. OK - so I bought some fish for my daughter for her birthday. I haven't had any since I was a child. And I am so overloaded with what to do. I've got a 10 gallon tank which came with all the fixens' (filter, heater, net, therm. strip), I've got some plastic plants (small children, can't handle real fish and real plants) and gravel of course. We started with a betta since we could get that right away (not realizing at the time about the whole set up and wait). After a day or so I was told I could put the betta in the tank (water was conditioned) so we did. He LOVES the tank. It's like he explores constantly. I always feel so sorry for those fish floating in those little bowls. ANYway, so today (72 hours after set-up) we bought a pregnant female guppy and two dwarf African frogs. We could only get the one female because they only had the one and we were told about the ratio thing. OK - so now comes all the confusion. And we were told the betta and guppies could live together. So far, so good even though I just read that it wasn't a good idea to put them together. Which is it? I guess that is the first question. 2nd question - How often should I clean the water? I plan on getting two more females and two males (3/2 ratio) and a couple of those skinny rock sucking fish. 3rd question - is that guppy ratio OK? 4th question - what in the world do I do with the pregnant guppy (Lola) if I want some of the babies to survive and knowing my luck won't be around when she has them to scoop them up? I bought one of those plastic floater things but have read they aren't good for the mamas. And I don't have the time and space (since I have a just mobile baby) to get another tank. Will any babies survive with a betta in the tank and the other guppies if I let them go all natural? 5th question - I was told you only change 10% of the water every other week. Is that right? 6th question - how do you know if the water is the same temperature - just test it with your finger and hope for the best? 7th question - is it natural for the fish to not eat when they first get transferred? Lola didn't try to eat anything. And what in the world? Put fresh vegetables in the water? Or live food? As you can see I need lots of advice. Please remember you are giving advice to a clueless beginner who hasn't got a great deal of time (small children) or space. But I do want to take good care of these little fish. I had no idea they would be so much fun to watch. My betta (magenta) seems very happy, Lola - indifferent. Thank you so much!
First off, hello and welcome to the forum. :hi:

I think Bre_B has covered things pretty well but I will add a few comments.

1) Bre_B is correct. The betta will end up killing the guppies.
2) I do a 15 to 25 percent water change once a week but since your tank isn't cycled, you will have to do them more often. If you don't have test kits, please get them (liquid are best). A master test kit will test for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. Optimaly, ammonia and nitrite should be 0. Nitrate should be kept under 60 ppm. While the tank is cycling, you will have some ammonia and nitrite. Do water changes as needed to keep them under 1 ppm (preferably under .5).
3) I don't keep guppies but I think the ratio should be 1 male to 3 females. Post in the livebearer section to confirm.
4) A breeder box or breeder net will work but in such a small tank it will be difficult.
5) During cycling, it isn't uncommon for people to do 25% water changes twice a day. Normal is about 15 % once a week.
6) You can get a cheap digital thermometer for about $4 or one of the stick on strip ones for less than a dollar. A lot of people do use the feel method to get the fresh water for the water change close ot the tank water temp. I use digitals so I test the tank water and then stick the same thermometer in the bucket of clean water and add cold or hot water as needed to get it close (within 2 degrees).
7) Yes. They are stressed so most times they will hide in a corner. It's best to turn the lights off after adding new fish to ease the stress.

I feed my bettas the Hikari Betta Bio Gold. They love them and eat them immediately (3 a day) so there isn't any uneaten food left over to rot and cause water problems. A lot of people say their fish love blanched veggies (cucumbers, zuchini, spinach) but mine have never touched them.
 
:/ Well thank you to all who have replied. As far as cycling the water I was told to just let it cycle for 72 hours. We went back up to the petstore with a water sample and they tested it - everything was fine. We have a really good water filter. And so far the betta is leaving the guppy alone. Is it because she is a female and doesn't have a large tail? And I don't plan on having more than 10 fish. I mainly wanted my daughter to witness the baby guppies being born. Any suggestions on some fish that are pretty and will get along with the betta? And will the female guppy be happy with a different community of fish? I don't want to just get rid of her.
 
i don't know much about guppies, i know they will breed like rabbits though!

not that many fish can be happily kept with bettas unfortunately.
i'd get cory catfish, at first you think they're weird looking and kinda ugly, but after a while of watching them zipping about like they've had a sugar overdose you'll <3 them lots! and they come in lots of patterns, albino and bronze are the most common ones, google them :) they like to be kept in groups too.
 
And I don't plan on having more than 10 fish.
Actually, it isn't 1 fish per gallon, it's 1" of adult fish per gallon. A guppy grows to 1.5 to 2 inches and bettas to about 2 or 3 inches. Using the smaller size, you could have the betta (2") and maybe 5 guppies (7.5") but that's not taking into consideration the ADFs and their waste. And with the guppies, you will definitely have fry which will put an additional strain on your filtration sysltem.

I understand that your water parameters are good now because you just added your fish. You will see the ammonia and nitrite start to climb. Just keep an eye on them and do water changes to keep the levels low and you should make it through.
 
2)Well first off i want to say, do you know how to stock? do you know what overstocking is? There is a general rule about overstocking, 1 inch of fish (at adult size) per gallon. that means you can only have 10 inches of fish, and with 2 dwarf african frogs, you cant fit much more in there. I dont know much more about that, so post in tropical chit chat for more on if your overstocked. As it is, i'd say to return the female guppy since she wont go good with the betta.


just wanted to make sure you saw that.

oh, and you were told wrong about cycling, as rdd said, it will change when you have fish in there, thats what cycling is. So dont just leave it now, keep testing it if possible, and do water changes alot (i do them daily in situations such as yours, like when my parents didnt cycle, waited a day and threw in a bunch of fish. It took sooo long to get healthy, and alot of the fish died anyway.)

next time, just so you know, the tank should either have 1 or two hardy fish (i find that cruel though :p) then for a few weeks (Sometimes longer, i dont quite know) do frequent water changes until the tank is testing normal (VERY unlikely to happen in less than a week)

another way, which i prefer, is fishless cycling. If you search on that here, you can learn more about it, it is basically when you add bacteria cultures (That are necesary to keep your tank stable) and fish at the same time, and its done for you. Sometimes this doesnt work, if the pet shop doesnt store it correctly (should be in a freezer of sorts)

So yeah, next time youll know :)


EDIT: and i still stand by removing the guppy. people have had livebearers of all sorts live with bettas for a while, and then one day WHAM you wake up to find both injured, perhaps one dead... your already pushing limits with ADF, an with babies, and how fast guppies reproduce? I think it best to just return that one guppy and save yourself the trouble of not only needing more, but then having them breed and breed and breed until you can t take it anymore (trust me, my neighbors ahd guppies, ended up with 3 10 gallons, 2 55s, and then they got annoyed with them and gave up altogether.)
 
I also agree with moving the guppies. Sorry if my other reply led to believe that I thought it was ok to have the betta and guppies together.
 

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