Hillstream Loach

[fluttermoth]

Always wanted some of these, but I have only a 24x12x12" tank (57l, probably 55 in reality). As this would be my eighth tank, I really can't go any bigger

I have a couple of 1000lph filters; if my tank is big enough, should I use one or both?

I've done the blended spirulina flake/bloodworm pellet/nori sheet/prawn mix painted onto rocks before, so feeding them shouldn't be a problem, and I'm happy to do multiple large changes to keep the water pristine; luckily my tap water has zero nitrate, so that's a help.

So, can I please rescue three (or five?) from my local (shall remain un-named) large chain pet store? I'm not 100% which species they'll be

Or should I abandon the whole idea?

 

[fishprotector]

Dont know if you have seen my tank log, but I currently have a 3 foot hillstream tank. At the moment I have 35x turn over, but anything between 10 and 15 should be ok in a 60l otherwise you may turn it into a washing machine. They also need a very high level of oxygen in the water and most species are sub tropical, living between 15 and 23 degress depending on the species.

Apart from this, the most important thing for these fellas is a mature tank with a good biofilm. Depending on species they are very very hard to keep in a new tank. You will also need to have the lightning on for a long time to grow this biofilm.

I imagine you are referring to p@h and so they will either be p.Myersi or p.Cheni. Either way I have never been able to get mine to eat the egg mix. They munch all day on the micro organisms that live in the biofilm and also eat algae wafers and frozen foods.

I would say go for it, you should be able to house a single species group of three to five in your tank or a pair of rhinogobius. Hillstream loaches are fascinating fish, you won't regret it! I have got a couple of species breeding now and it is very rewarding as they do require more effort than the average fish.

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Being an experienced fishkeeper on here pretty much all the time I've been around and being prepared to put the water changes in where/if necessary, I'd say go for it.

Besides the species mentioned by fishprotector (who has a great hillstream tank that is doing great after a rocky start), other possibilities are Sewellia spp. or Beaufortia kweichowensis, but post up some pics so we can have a gander and try to identify them.

I will let you know how it behaves, but I'm awaiting delivery of a http/www.ebay.co.u...=item27c50a425b 2200lph powerhead/mini filter (basically a compact higher power Fluval U4), that I plan to probably put in my 60x30x30cm tank for my Chaetostoma milesi, who really needs similar conditions to these loaches. I've had her in my 48x12x15 since spring, which she has done alright in, but I want to try and provide her with a more specialist super current setup and while she is small this 54l will do the job nicely... I might even try and catch my Aborichthys elongatus (Indian Redtail Squirrel Loach) male out of the 5x2x2 that he has been in for almost two years to give the Rubbernose some company!

 

[fluttermoth]

Dont know if you have seen my tank log, but I currently have a 3 foot hillstream tank.

I have been following your thread, it's been most helpful. I just wanted to check a two foot tank would be big enough; I'm sacrificing my dining room table for this tank, I really can't go any bigger!

At the moment I have 35x turn over, but anything between 10 and 15 should be ok in a 60l otherwise you may turn it into a washing machine. They also need a very high level of oxygen in the water and most species are sub tropical, living between 15 and 23 degress depending on the species.

Will they need acclimatising to the high flow, or are they ok to go straight in to that? I have a variety of internals with different flow rates I can use, if needs be. I know about the temp and the oxygen, I've been reading up on these guys for a few years now

Apart from this, the most important thing for these fellas is a mature tank with a good biofilm. Depending on species they are very very hard to keep in a new tank. You will also need to have the lightning on for a long time to grow this biofilm.

I'll get the lights set up and get growing biofilm then! I'm not going to rush in to getting them

I imagine you are referring to p@h and so they will either be p.Myersi or p.Cheni.

That might well be the shop I was referring to, yes! Obviously I'l try and properly identify them when I get them, but what would be the ideal temp for those two species?

Either way I have never been able to get mine to eat the egg mix. They munch all day on the micro organisms that live in the biofilm and also eat algae wafers and frozen foods.

Ok, I have plenty of stuff to temp them with! Are veggies and fruit, like lettuce and apple any good, as with plecs, or are they more carnivorous than that?

I would say go for it, you should be able to house a single species group of three to five in your tank or a pair of rhinogobius. Hillstream loaches are fascinating fish, you won't regret it! I have got a couple of species breeding now and it is very rewarding as they do require more effort than the average fish.

Thanks, at least I know they'll get a better home with me than most of them get; I'm getting so irritated with people having them in 24l with a couple of fantails
I'll keep it species only, I expect, unless they like dithers...?

Thanks again for the first hand info, I really appreciate it

 

[fluttermoth]

Being an experienced fishkeeper on here pretty much all the time I've been around and being prepared to put the water changes in where/if necessary, I'd say go for it.

Thank you for the vote of confidence, I appreciate that

Besides the species mentioned by fishprotector (who has a great hillstream tank that is doing great after a rocky start), other possibilities are Sewellia spp. or Beaufortia kweichowensis, but post up some pics so we can have a gander and try to identify them.

I certainly will when I get them

I will let you know how it behaves, but I'm awaiting delivery of a http/www.ebay.co.u...=item27c50a425b 2200lph powerhead/mini filter (basically a compact higher power Fluval U4), that I plan to probably put in my 60x30x30cm tank for my Chaetostoma milesi, who really needs similar conditions to these loaches. I've had her in my 48x12x15 since spring, which she has done alright in, but I want to try and provide her with a more specialist super current setup and while she is small this 54l will do the job nicely... I might even try and catch my Aborichthys elongatus (Indian Redtail Squirrel Loach) male out of the 5x2x2 that he has been in for almost two years to give the Rubbernose some company!

Sounds awesome! Look forward to hearing how it goes

 

[fishprotector]

Now that is commitment, I would never ever get away with that unless I wanted to live on my own

I acclimatised all of mine in the standard floating the bag method but for two hours, then turned the powerhead off with the lights for two hours, then booted it all back on.

I keep my p.Myersi at 23 degrees as my a.Normani like it a little warmer and everyone seems to be happy at this. When I first got them, the p.Myersi were happy living at 19 to 20 degrees, but some sewellia linolate I had did not like this and passed away. I just have one sewellia sp. now which I have had for two years and she is doing fine.

Nothing in my tank will touch fruit or veg. I feed frozen food daily five times a week for my rhinogobius so that may be partially why, but even before I got these, the loaches wouldn't touch fruit and veg.

The main dithers for hillstream tanks would be minnows or danios. I would say that you tank will not be long enough for these to live in long term. Mine buzz up and down all day in the powerhead flow. Another thing to think about is that dithers could eat any eggs which are laid. This might happen more in a smaller tank with less space. You could try bamboo shrimp. I added a few to my tank last month and they are doing well.

What hard scape are you planning on?

 

[fishprotector]

Being an experienced fishkeeper on here pretty much all the time I've been around and being prepared to put the water changes in where/if necessary, I'd say go for it.

Besides the species mentioned by fishprotector (who has a great hillstream tank that is doing great after a rocky start), other possibilities are Sewellia spp. or Beaufortia kweichowensis, but post up some pics so we can have a gander and try to identify them.

I will let you know how it behaves, but I'm awaiting delivery of a http/www.ebay.co.u...=item27c50a425b 2200lph powerhead/mini filter (basically a compact higher power Fluval U4), that I plan to probably put in my 60x30x30cm tank for my Chaetostoma milesi, who really needs similar conditions to these loaches. I've had her in my 48x12x15 since spring, which she has done alright in, but I want to try and provide her with a more specialist super current setup and while she is small this 54l will do the job nicely... I might even try and catch my Aborichthys elongatus (Indian Redtail Squirrel Loach) male out of the 5x2x2 that he has been in for almost two years to give the Rubbernose some company!

Sounds like a plan and that power filter looks good, keep us informed as to how it performs.

 

[fluttermoth]

Now that is commitment, I would never ever get away with that unless I wanted to live on my own

I do live on my own (well, partnerless)! The only other person affected is my 15 yo son, and he's a keen fishkeeper as well, so he's just encouraging me

I acclimatised all of mine in the standard floating the bag method but for two hours, then turned the powerhead off with the lights for two hours, then booted it all back on.

I keep my p.Myersi at 23 degrees as my a.Normani like it a little warmer and everyone seems to be happy at this. When I first got them, the p.Myersi were happy living at 19 to 20 degrees, but some sewellia linolate I had did not like this and passed away. I just have one sewellia sp. now which I have had for two years and she is doing fine.

Ok, I'll aim for 22/23°C and adjust if necessary

Nothing in my tank will touch fruit or veg. I feed frozen food daily five times a week for my rhinogobius so that may be partially why, but even before I got these, the loaches wouldn't touch fruit and veg.

Duly noted

The main dithers for hillstream tanks would be minnows or danios. I would say that you tank will not be long enough for these to live in long term. Mine buzz up and down all day in the powerhead flow. Another thing to think about is that dithers could eat any eggs which are laid. This might happen more in a smaller tank with less space. You could try bamboo shrimp. I added a few to my tank last month and they are doing well.

I'll probably keep it species only anyway, tbh.

What hard scape are you planning on?

I've got a load of river rocks in my garden; they're not completely smooth like cobbles, but they're rounded. Was thinking of those with something like you've done; sand in the corners with a largish gravel on top and perhaps a clump or two of Java fern?

 

[fishprotector]

Sounds great!

Mine is sand all the way across, thicker at one end than the other (downstream end) with gravel on top (thicker at upstream end) and pebbles on top. Some wood and moss would go well, but the pebbles are the main bit. They love sitting on a nice flat rock infront if the powerhead, jostling for the best position.

Can't wait to see another hillstream tank

You looked on loaches.com? Good info on there sometimes!

 

[Baccus]

I have a few Borneo Suckers mainly Gastromyzon sp (one of which I still have not been able to identify). I have found these guys to be very forgiving with regards to high water flow, they rarely even come out to play in the hose as I top up their tank. At times they do hang out near the airstone wall but mostly mine can be found munching on the biofilm on my Amazon swords, on the numerous green rocks they have or cleaning the glass. They readily take tropical fish flakes and any other food I give my Cory's as well as defrosted bloodworms. Through winter the tank has probably dropped in temp to 17 degrees cel at the lowest and in Summer it has hovered around 33 degrees cel for a few days barely getting down to 28 degrees overnight. Thankfully my little Borneos have taken it all in their stride and just keep motoring around the tank, even it seems not harming my dwarf shrimp or showing any interest in cory eggs.

So if the pet shop is selling Gastromyzon species I would get them, such a peaceful little fish.

 

[fluttermoth]

Well, I said i wasn't going to rush this, but my mum's just presented me with three hillstreams from P@H; she knew I was doing to get some and "couldn't resist them" when she went in for dog food, apparently



So, let's hope I can coax them through being in a new tank. I'm going to pull put some rocks and wood from other tanks which will hopefully have some biofilm on. Obviously I've filled the filter with cycled media and will be testing frequently, but anyone got any other tips?


I also seem to have two different species; two are dark with pale spots (almost like a BN) and one is stripey, #63### I'd post pics, but they're too small for my rubbish phone camera to pick up.

Thanks mum (not!)

Jeez; parents, who'd have them, eh?

Edit, sorry, I didn't realise that was a swear

 

[fishprotector]

Lol what is she like, quite cute though.

I have never seen mixed batches in my p@h. If I had to guess though, I would say the striped one would be either p.Myersi or p.Cheni and the spotted one's Beaufortia Kweichowensis. Do they look like yours?

What kind of setup have you gone for in the end?

 

[fluttermoth]

The spotty ones don't look anything like P myersi or P. cheni! They look more like Gastromyzon scitulus than anything else!

I'm guessing it'll become clearer as they get older; I notice juveniles look a lot different to the adults. I didn't think any fish from P@H would be this hard to ID

The stripey one has, typically, gone into hiding

I've got a 1000lph filter with one, short open ended bit of spray bar on it (I might take that off tomorrow), squarish chunks of slate from another tank (should I swap them for smooth ones, even though they won't have biofilm?) and a bit of flat, arched bit of bogwood.

I'm sure I'm making them paranoid peering at them now; one of them's giving me funny looks! I still want to test the water again before I go to bed too

 

[fishprotector]

I said striped one might be p.Myersi or p.Cheni lol not the spotted one's.

I would put rounded stones on the base and stand the biofilm covered slate vertical at the far end away from the filter so the flow hits it. They should like that.

Oh and my loach fry are the spitting image of the adults if that helps identification at all.

 

[fluttermoth]

I said striped one might be p.Myersi or p.Cheni lol not the spotted one's.

Oh, duh, I've had a long afternoon looking at loach pictures I'm very confused now! I'll start again tomorrow

I would put rounded stones on the base and stand the biofilm covered slate vertical at the far end away from the filter so the flow hits it. They should like that.

Ah, genius, I'll get on to that first thing