Help With Purchase Decision

[Rlon35]

I have a 92 gallon corner (2 months old), low tech, planted tank with red mangroves, crypts, onions, vals, anubias, swords, apotogens, wisteria, and ludwigia (high light ....). It is an all play sand base, and I only have 60 watts of lighting in there as of yet, 30 with T8s and another 30 with standard flourescents. I have plenty of oxygen coming in there, a fluval 3 plus internal filter and a 60 gallon capacity HOB filter. I have some clown loaches, a pair of SAEs, and one or two bushynose plecs (tiny). I am not going the route of CO2 with this tank. I am dosing ferts, but I need more lighting. The advise I want has to do with the most pressing purchase. I can't buy everything I need at once, but I want to add a 70 watt clip-on halide and a Fluval FX5 filter. I change 60 percent of the water once a week, so I figured I could order the light first and put off the filter. I want to keep discus, congo tetras, and kribs in this tank. The discus will be the last fish I add, and they will be added in force. I want to get it planted as densely as possible first...what would you purchase first, if you were me? The filter or the light...?....

 

[aaronnorth]

The filter or the light...?..

CO2

i wouldnt get extra light until you have CO2 covered. So it would have to be the filter, then CO2, then light

 

[Rlon35]

The filter or the light...?..

CO2

i wouldnt get extra light until you have CO2 covered. So it would have to be the filter, then CO2, then light

^^^^^^^^

LOL...had a feeling you'd say that. I am going to go with the filter, just because it's more important. Is CO2 really worth it when I have an all play sand substrate???

 

[lljdma06]

The filter or the light...?..

CO2

i wouldnt get extra light until you have CO2 covered. So it would have to be the filter, then CO2, then light

^^^^^^^^

LOL...had a feeling you'd say that. I am going to go with the filter, just because it's more important. Is CO2 really worth it when I have an all play sand substrate???

Isn't play sand inert? Not sure I understand what you're asking. Barring the ludwigia, how are the rest of the plants growing? Are they alive?

 

[aaronnorth]

The filter or the light...?..

CO2

i wouldnt get extra light until you have CO2 covered. So it would have to be the filter, then CO2, then light

^^^^^^^^

LOL...had a feeling you'd say that. I am going to go with the filter, just because it's more important. Is CO2 really worth it when I have an all play sand substrate???

like llj i am confused by your post. It doesnt make a difference if you have a nutritous or inert substrate for you to use CO2. It depends on the lighting levels. If you were to increase the lighting then that would increase growth rate and therefore demand for carbon, regardless of the substrate. The additional light would also increase the demand for nutrients, so you would have to dose the water column heavier, due to there being no nutrients in the substrate as a 'back up' source.

 

[Rlon35]

The filter or the light...?..

CO2

i wouldnt get extra light until you have CO2 covered. So it would have to be the filter, then CO2, then light

^^^^^^^^

LOL...had a feeling you'd say that. I am going to go with the filter, just because it's more important. Is CO2 really worth it when I have an all play sand substrate???

like llj i am confused by your post. It doesnt make a difference if you have a nutritous or inert substrate for you to use CO2. It depends on the lighting levels. If you were to increase the lighting then that would increase growth rate and therefore demand for carbon, regardless of the substrate. The additional light would also increase the demand for nutrients, so you would have to dose the water column heavier, due to there being no nutrients in the substrate as a 'back up' source.

^^^^^^^^^

I don't think I need a better substrate to use CO2, but I just feel it is a waste to progress to CO2 without an optimal substrate. With the exception of the ludwigia, which are clippings from my other tank, all the plants are low light. I am waiting on onions and jungle vals, which will complete the planting. What is the maximum light wattage you would use for this tank if keeping it low tech and non-co2 (just liquid carbon)???

 

[aaronnorth]

there isnt such a thing as low light plants. Just plants that can tolerate low light. Anubias will happily survive in a 10wpg tank, as long as CO2 & Nutrients are ok! But it will also survive in a 1wpg tank.

There is no correlation between CO2 & substrate. Lots of people use inert substrates & CO2 injection, one of my favourite examples is Dave Spencer's tank, CO2 injection, full of crypts and just sand.

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=

 

[lljdma06]

there isnt such a thing as low light plants. Just plants that can tolerate low light. Anubias will happily survive in a 10wpg tank, as long as CO2 & Nutrients are ok! But it will also survive in a 1wpg tank.

There is no correlation between CO2 & substrate. Lots of people use inert substrates & CO2 injection, one of my favourite examples is Dave Spencer's tank, CO2 injection, full of crypts and just sand.

<a href="http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=" target="_blank">http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=</a>

Oh, do not just say "tolerate" low light. It implies that one condition is worse than the other, which obviously you've seen enough low-light tanks to know that that isn't always the case. Plants can thrive in low-light too. How 'bout instead "are able to grow well under a wide range of lighting levels". That is a better way of putting it and you then do not show a bias towards one light level. Anubias will happily survive in both conditions, not "happily" survive in one and just "survive" in the other.

I'm sorry, but I had to say that. Gotta stick up for the dark side!

On the second point, I, myself, have used CO2 injection with inert substrates. It is fine as long as you know that the water column should be dosed.

 

[aaronnorth]

there isnt such a thing as low light plants. Just plants that can tolerate low light. Anubias will happily survive in a 10wpg tank, as long as CO2 & Nutrients are ok! But it will also survive in a 1wpg tank.

There is no correlation between CO2 & substrate. Lots of people use inert substrates & CO2 injection, one of my favourite examples is Dave Spencer's tank, CO2 injection, full of crypts and just sand.

<a href="http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=" target="_blank">http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=</a>

Oh, do not just say "tolerate" low light. It implies that one condition is worse than the other, which obviously you've seen enough low-light tanks to know that that isn't always the case. Plants can thrive in low-light too. How 'bout instead "are able to grow well under a wide range of lighting levels". That is a better way of putting it and you then do not show a bias towards one light level. Anubias will happily survive in both conditions, not "happily" survive in one and just "survive" in the other.

I'm sorry, but I had to say that. Gotta stick up for the dark side!

On the second point, I, myself, have used CO2 injection with inert substrates. It is fine as long as you know that the water column should be dosed.

ok, i'll give you that one lol, but you know what i mean

 

[Rlon35]

there isnt such a thing as low light plants. Just plants that can tolerate low light. Anubias will happily survive in a 10wpg tank, as long as CO2 & Nutrients are ok! But it will also survive in a 1wpg tank.

There is no correlation between CO2 & substrate. Lots of people use inert substrates & CO2 injection, one of my favourite examples is Dave Spencer's tank, CO2 injection, full of crypts and just sand.

<a href="http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=" target="_blank">http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=271607&hl=</a>

Oh, do not just say "tolerate" low light. It implies that one condition is worse than the other, which obviously you've seen enough low-light tanks to know that that isn't always the case. Plants can thrive in low-light too. How 'bout instead "are able to grow well under a wide range of lighting levels". That is a better way of putting it and you then do not show a bias towards one light level. Anubias will happily survive in both conditions, not "happily" survive in one and just "survive" in the other.

I'm sorry, but I had to say that. Gotta stick up for the dark side!

On the second point, I, myself, have used CO2 injection with inert substrates. It is fine as long as you know that the water column should be dosed.

ok, i'll give you that one lol, but you know what i mean

^^^^^^^^^

Let me ask you guys a question. If I decide I want a foreground cover instead of bare sand, after upgrading to co2 injection and better lighting, what foreground plant would form a good carpet in this? I will be using dwarf sag in the midground and would prefer something shorter in the foreground if I go that route.....

I just created a border to my sand with java lace/driftwood pieces (I'll border off the rest of the sand foreground with liverworts and moss balls on flat driftwood pieces). I planted 10 jungle vals in the background, and two crinum natans in front of my mangroves. It looks awesome. The vals look pitiful, but I think they'll thrive in this tank. Dosing rather heavy with flourish, flourish iron, and flourish potassium, with standard doses of excel because of the vals (don't want to overdose). Going to order my filter (FX5) next week. Man, I do these tanks back asswards. One day, I hope to have the wallet to get high tech equiptment all set up at once...and I need to start planting EVERYTHING IN THE BEGINNING rather than doing these 'deep water' plantings. Tank looks awesome and ready for the discus experiment. Need to add more bottom dwellers and a schooling fish before I order the discus.

 

[aaronnorth]

Any foregroud will work as long as they get enough CO2 & nutrients.
Heminathus callitrichoides (HC Cuba), and glossostigma elatinoides are the most popular. marsilea would probably work in your current setup.

 

[tropic_john]

If you want to have a super lo-tech tank, maybe you could blow really hard into the water, creating co2 the easy way

 

[aaronnorth]

If you want to have a super lo-tech tank, maybe you could blow really hard into the water, creating co2 the easy way

adding CO2 makes it high tech

 

[tropic_john]

If you want to have a super lo-tech tank, maybe you could blow really hard into the water, creating co2 the easy way

adding CO2 makes it high tech

xD, I suppose you're right

 

[lljdma06]

If you want to have a super lo-tech tank, maybe you could blow really hard into the water, creating co2 the easy way

adding CO2 makes it high tech

xD, I suppose you're right

I do not blow air into any of my tanks. The misconceptions associated with the darkside are many.