Help With Aggressive Fish

[STEWARDSONS]

i recently set up a new 190ltr tank with external filter. this was filled with water on monday the 14th feb. that friday (5 days later) i introduced the first fish with safestart as recomended by my local fish shop, these fish were,

3 beacon tetras
3 scissor tails
4 cardinal tetra

a week later i put in

3 emperor tetra
3 popendetta furcatas

this is where the problems started. i woke the next morning after putting these in and one of the male popendettas was dead, it had no fins left and a chunk out of its belly.

2 days later i returned to the shop and they tested my water and all was ok so they replaced him and i also got 2 african dwarf frogs.

2 days after putting these in my partner was watching the tank when she saw one of the beacons take a bite out of the female popendetta's tail fin then all of the fish started goign at her which crippled her so we took her out of the water and she died in a bag i floated in the top of then tank. the beacons were still tryin to attack her through the bag!

so now i have lost 2 popendettas in the space of 3 days but the two males i have left seem to be ok.

could these attacks be due to the fact that i should have got at least 6 of each tetra? or is there anything else it could be? i am thinking of takign the 3 beacons back to the shop and getting 3 more emperors so i have a total of 6 of them.


i am also thinkign of adding a denilson barb to the tank. its in a separate tank to the rest of the den barbs at the shop as its a larger one and is in a tank with a different species of fish, apparently he has been there for about a year. would he be ok on his own in my tank as he is obviously used to being away form his own kind for some time or will he be likely to finish off my remaining two popendettas?

any help would be much appreciated

 

[Aqua Tom]

I am sorry to tell you that your Popendetta's are probably all going to die soon anyway. they are extreemly sensitive to water chemistry & as you have just started a Fish-in cycle your Ammonia & nitrite levels will soon rocket.

May i suggest that you do not add any more fish untill after your cycle has completed?

Here is some recomended reading regarding cycling your filter.

What is Cycling?

The Nitrogen Cycle

Fish-In Cycling

Fishless cycling


I hope this helps

Tom

 

[STEWARDSONS]

i have been testing the water regularly and yesterday the ammonia and nitrite were both 0 and have been every time i have tested them since i put the first fish in.

 

[KittyKat]

As above.. do the reading on fish-in cycling.

i returned to the shop and they tested my water and all was ok

This is meaningless. It could very well mean "your water is a toxic soup which will kill most fish in an hour". Get them to write down the exact numbers. Ammonia and nitrite over 0.25 ppm are toxic to fish and you should do water changes with warm, dechlorinated water to bring those readings below. Even better, get a good, liquid test kit for yourself. For now, I would strongly recommend that you start doing 50% water changes daily until you know the readings because they are currently almost guaranteed to be well above 0.25 ppm.

could these attacks be due to the fact that i should have got at least 6 of each tetra? or is there anything else it could be? i am thinking of takign the 3 beacons back to the shop and getting 3 more emperors so i have a total of 6 of them.

Yes, this is most likely to be one of the main reasons. Do NOT get any new fish until you have finished cycling your fish tank or they are likely to just die on you.

i am also thinkign of adding a denilson barb to the tank. its in a separate tank to the rest of the den barbs at the shop as its a larger one and is in a tank with a different species of fish, apparently he has been there for about a year. would he be ok on his own in my tank as he is obviously used to being away form his own kind for some time or will he be likely to finish off my remaining two popendettas?

Please don't. Denison's barbs require larger aquariums than what you have to be happy.

Once you finish cycling, this is the sort of stock you should consider:
* 10 schooling fish of one species (for example, cardinals)
* 10 schooling fish of another species (for example, emperor tetras)
* pair of cichlids, such as Bolivian rams
* one bristlenose pleco or 6 Corys if you have sand

Keeping lots of species in small numbers is unfair on the fish and they never do as well as when kept in schools.

i have been testing the water regularly and yesterday the ammonia and nitrite were both 0 and have been every time i have tested them since i put the first fish in.

This is really not possible unless you seeded the filter with mature media. Which tests are you using? Test strips? Liquid? Did you at any point have an ammonia spike? And a nitrite spike?

 

[STEWARDSONS]

the ammonia and nitrite were high on day 3-4 after filling the tank, the day before and the day i introduced the first fish it was also 0, then i have tested a few days after the first fish , then again the day before i got the 2nd set of fish. then again 2 days ago, all results are showing 0 but the nitrate is about 10-20. the shop confirmed it was 0 before selling me both sets of fish.

the filter was used for gold fish previously and has been sitting around for about a year before i used it. i purchased the tank 2nd hand.

i also used safestart but only put in when i added the fish on day 5.

i am using an api liquid testing kit.

 

[KittyKat]

the ammonia and nitrite were high on day 3-4 after filling the tank, the day before and the day i introduced the first fish it was also 0, then i have tested a few days after the first fish , then again the day before i got the 2nd set of fish. then again 2 days ago, all results are showing 0 but the nitrate is about 10-20. the shop confirmed it was 0 before selling me both sets of fish.

the filter was used for gold fish previously and has been sitting around for about a year before i used it. i purchased the tank 2nd hand.

i also used safestart but only put in when i added the fish on day 5.

i am using an api liquid testing kit.

Very odd, but fair enough. Without an ammonia source, there should not have been any ammonia and without a nitrite source, no nitrite.. but if it worked, then I'm glad that whatever you did worked.

So, assuming you are fully cycled, the problem is then either stock related or fragility of fish related (or both if bullying is involved). Also most fish will eat dead fish, so the missing fins and tummy do.not indicate a direct attack necessarily.

 

[STEWARDSONS]

the tank went very cloudy after 2 days but cleared up by the 5th day and now has got clearer every day until its crystal clear, i assume this was a bacteria bloom.

i am probably going to take the 3 beacons back to the shop and get 3 more emperors and 4 more cardinals so that i have larger numbers of them and fewer varieties.

so i will then have,

6 emperor tetras
8 cardinals
3 scissor tails
2 popendetta furcatas
2 dwarf frogs
hopefully in a few weeks i will add 2 elec blue rams

and then eventually a plec that wont grow large or 2 hongkong plecs

would it be fully stocked then?

 

[KittyKat]

the tank went very cloudy after 2 days but cleared up by the 5th day and now has got clearer every day until its crystal clear, i assume this was a bacteria bloom.

Yes, it would have been..

i am probably going to take the 3 beacons back to the shop and get 3 more emperors and 4 more cardinals so that i have larger numbers of them and fewer varieties.

Good idea, you will definitely see a difference in behaviour.

so i will then have,

6 emperor tetras
8 cardinals
3 scissor tails
2 popendetta furcatas
2 dwarf frogs
hopefully in a few weeks i will add 2 elec blue rams

I would advise against keeping scissor tail rasboras because they grow to 5-6 inches (13-15 cm) and are schooling.. so as you can imagine don't fit with the other fish you have or the tank size.
Also against blue rams because they tend to be fragile. Bolivian rams would be a much better choice.

and then eventually a plec that wont grow large or 2 hongkong plecs

Either would work: bristlenose gets a thumbs up from me, the hillstream loaches also (if the temperature of the tank is 20-23C - they do better in cooler water).

would it be fully stocked then?

Basically, yes.

You might decide in half a year or more that the tank could take another few fish for the schools, or something like that if you don't keep the scissortails, but that is for the future..