Help! My Little Guys Are Dying

[WhoKnewPlecosGetSoBig]

I'm new to this message board and would greatly appreciate any advice.

I recently upgraded from my 10 gallon fish tank to a 20 gallon. The 10 gallon tank had 1 7-inch pleco, as well as 6 rummy nose tetras and 3 neon tetras. The tank had been running fine, with no problems for over a year.

When I changed tanks I filled the 20 gallon tank, installed the heater, filter, rinsed gravel, driftwood, and plant, added dechlorinated water and ran it for about 3 days before I added the fish. The fish did fine for about a week, until I added some new fish and bought a different kind of food - pellets for the big guys and a new brand of tropical staple food for the little ones.

The 20 gallon had the following fish until the dying started:

1 7-inch pleco (old)
6 rummy nose tetras (old)
3 neon tetras (old)
2 gouramis (new)
2 bolivian rams (new)
2 id sharks - 1 irridescent and 1 albino (new)

Everything was okay for about a week and then the tetras started dying. I only have one neon left and my albino id shark is about to go.

The water is slightly cloudy and the temperature is about 81.

When the fish get sick they seem to have laboured breathing, swim upside down and some of them hide in the plants at the bottom.

Where did I go wrong? How do I fix this?

I had no idea you could measure nitrate, nitrite, ph, etc. so I will take a sample of water to the fish store and see if they can measure all of that for me. Any advice in the meantime?

 

[QuotheRaven]

The 7 inch pleco is far to large to be with the other fish, The filter's Bio- load would of been put under strain with Gourami's sharks and rams.

Try to get some accomodation for the other fish perhaps move the tetra's and things into another tank and feed less as not to increase bacteria more. A water change might be good also.

 

[WhoKnewPlecosGetSoBig]

The 7 inch pleco is far to large to be with the other fish, The filter's Bio- load would of been put under strain with Gourami's sharks and rams.

Try to get some accomodation for the other fish perhaps move the tetra's and things into another tank and feed less as not to increase bacteria more. A water change might be good also.

Thanks for your help. I'll see if I can return some of the bigger fish. Exactly what can I put in a 20 gallon tank with a 7 inch pleco?

 

[QuotheRaven]

well the pleco may be over sized for the 20 gallon however I may be wrong.
The issue wasn't really the pleco in the tank more the introduction of the gourami's, rams and sharks that most likely mucked up your tank a bit. Perhaps someone a little more experienced can help with what to put with the pleco as that pleco may grow larger. What type plec is it?

 

[Tolak]

Have the lfs write down the numbers from the test results for you. Too many times a shop will say the levels are fine when they actually aren't.

Irridescent sharks get huge, like 3 feet. Common plecs can top out at 18". A 7" plec shouldn't be in a 20 gallon tank.

What did you do with the filter from the smaller tank, and how did you cycle the newer filter? A white cloudiness is usually bacterial, indicating a cycling tank, or a tank without enough established biological filtration to handle the bio load.

 

[WhoKnewPlecosGetSoBig]

Have the lfs write down the numbers from the test results for you. Too many times a shop will say the levels are fine when they actually aren't.

Irridescent sharks get huge, like 3 feet. Common plecs can top out at 18". A 7" plec shouldn't be in a 20 gallon tank.

What did you do with the filter from the smaller tank, and how did you cycle the newer filter? A white cloudiness is usually bacterial, indicating a cycling tank, or a tank without enough established biological filtration to handle the bio load.

Thanks!

I'm not sure what kind of pleco he is, but I think it's a common. He's black with thin white/light grey spot outlines. He's been the same size for quite a while so I'm not sure if he will grow anymore. He's awesome!

We threw the filter from the smaller tank out because it was really old and was starting to go and it wasn't large enough for the new tank. The new filter is a bio wheel. What exactly do you mean by "cycle"? I think you're right about not enough bio filtration to handle the bio load. The tank was completely clear when it was just the pleco and the little tetras and only got cloudy a few days after the larger fish were added.

The albino died last night and the tank is not so cloudy anymore. Maybe it has stabilized?

I was trying to go by the 20 inches of fish per 20 gallons of water rule, but maybe I'm not applying the rule correctly?

 

[Fillet 'O' Fish]

I would strongly suggest that you invest in a test kit. The results will let you know just what the problem is.
Even established aquariums should be tested regularly to check that things are not going wrong, and by adding all those new fish I suspect your filter could not handle the sudden increase in bioload.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

OK what's happened is when you threw out your old filter you also through out all the good bacteria that was keeping your water stable and the levels healthy. Your new filter doesn't have any of this to start off with and it's now going through the nitrogen cycle and building up the bacteria it needs to keep the fish alive. While it does this there will be high levels of amonia nitriate and nitrate ALL of which can be poisonous to fish in high amounts. I'm about 99% sure this is what's killing your fish.

What you should have done is taken the mature fitler media, sponges etc from the old filter and put those in the new one.

At the top of the beginner forum there's loads of topics about cycling, have a read of them.

What I would advise you to do now is to try and get some mature media to go in your filter. If you know anyone with tanks ask them, or ask your lfs if you can have some of theirs. There's also a pinned topic in the beginners section with a list of members willing to donate media and they're locations. Hopefully there's someone near you who can help out.

That's without even contemplating your stocking...... The inch per gallon rule isn't really a rule at all, it's a guideline, and it applies to a mature tank with small thin bodied fish. When anything gets to bigger than 3/4 inches you can pretty much throw it out of the window. There's no way your plec or ID sharks will be OK in that tank, I would re-home them asap, having less bio-load on your filter may also help it to cope until you can get the filter cycled.

 

[Ava_Banana]

We threw the filter from the smaller tank out because it was really old and was starting to go and it wasn't large enough for the new tank. The new filter is a bio wheel. What exactly do you mean by "cycle"?

Hi,

please have a look at this link which I think explains "cycling" quite well.

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=10099

It should answer most of the questions you have posed..........

........good luck..

 

[scubadoo]

Ok it sounds as if you've just put all your existing fish from a mature and cycled tank into a completely un-cycled environment.

This means that the bacteria colony which has been living in your old filter (and processing the waste products - ammonia) has gone, now your fish are still peeing & pooping but there'e nothing to treat the ammonia.

You need to cycle the tank - please look at the cycling threads in the FAQ's or Beginner Sections.

In the short term, be prepared because you may well loose a lot more fish.
The only way you can keep on top of this is to do lots of large & frequent water changes - maybe 30-40% perhaps up to twice a day to try and keep the ammonia & nitrite levels in check.

Edit:
DOH!
Miss Wiggle has faster fingers than me!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

Edit:
DOH!
Miss Wiggle has faster fingers than me!

fastest fingers in the west

 

[catxx]

I'm not sure what kind of pleco he is, but I think it's a common. He's black with thin white/light grey spot outlines. He's been the same size for quite a while so I'm not sure if he will grow anymore. He's awesome!

if you've kept him in a 10 gallon, his growth will probably have been stunted, stunting shortens the lifespan of the fish.
if he was kept in a larger tank (50 gals+) and fed well he may start growing again.

 

[WhoKnewPlecosGetSoBig]

I'm not sure what kind of pleco he is, but I think it's a common. He's black with thin white/light grey spot outlines. He's been the same size for quite a while so I'm not sure if he will grow anymore. He's awesome!

if you've kept him in a 10 gallon, his growth will probably have been stunted, stunting shortens the lifespan of the fish.
if he was kept in a larger tank (50 gals+) and fed well he may start growing again.

A 50 gallon tank? Wow! I had no idea!

No sick fish or deaths today But I miss my tetras and my albino Katie