Having A Few Problems With My Black Moor

xautomaticflowersx

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A little information about the tank etc. ...

Dimensions: 30x18x12inches (29 US Gallons I believe)
Stock: 1 x black moor (approx. 3.5 inch body, 3 inch tail), 1 x veil tail (approx. 3 inch body, 4 or 5 inch tail), 1 x oranda (Approx. 2 inch body, 2 inch tail).
Feeding: Once a day with either soaked Aquarian goldfish flakes, defrosted frozen bloodworm, peas or courgette (zucchini for the US forum members). Sometimes I'll soak the flakes in Kent Zoe multivitamin liquid.
Filtration: Fluval 4 + with a spray bar (so that my fish don't have to live in a whirlpool!)
CURRENT temperature: 24C
I also have an airline attached to a pump bubbling away in there to provide a bit of extra oxygen, although the Fluval 4 creates a lot of surface movement.

The problem...

About two months ago I started noticing some small white spots on his tail, so I figured it was white spot (he's had that before and it looked the same). I performed several large water changes, raised the temperature to 26C over the course of a few days, added lots of tonic salt to the water and put some Interpet Whitespot Plus treatment in the water.
After about 3 weeks of treatment it became apparent that the problem wasn't actually white spot as the small spots on his tail began to appear more like little slightly raised patches than grains. He's an extremely active fish and when I get close to the tank to look at him he flutters about and sucks at the glass, which makes it really hard to look at his tail as it keeps moving about! Anyway, the white patches seemed to look slightly fuzzy as though it was a kind of fungal growth. So I performed a 50% water change, waited a week and tried some anti-fungus treatment instead. This did absolutely nothing, so since then I've just been performing water changes of between 30% and 40% every few days to see if it clears up on it's own.
I'm at my wits end with this moor! He eats well, he's active, he swims with ease, his behaviour is perfectly normal and yet he has these odd white patches on his tail. I noticed today also that he has a slightly swollen white patch just behind his right 'nostril'. This only became apparent to me today, but it may have been present for a couple of days as I've ben quite busy of late and haven't been as observant as I probably should be.
I seem to have lost my master test kit (I know, I know... silly me), so I am unsure of the water parameters, but none of the fish are displaying symptoms of bad water quality and I performed a 50% water change today, cleaned out the filter and have been changing at least 30% of the water every three or four days for the last month or so. Before that I was changing about 25% or 30% weekly. A couple of days ago I lowered the temperature to 24C as I don't think it's a very good idea to keep it at 26C for much longer.
I can honestly say that I don't know what the problem is with my moor. He appears robust and healthy (as do the other two fish) apart from these odd white/grey patches on his tail and now the swollen nostril. The only thing that I can think of that it resembles is fish pox, but the patches on his tail aren't raised enough and don't have the pinkish tint to them that you might expect. If somebody could shed some light on the matter I'd be very grateful!
I was wondering if it might be some sort of skin infection, since he has developed a swollen nostril now? The swelling appears to be *behind* the actual nostril, as the the inside is where the problem lies. Do you think I should just continue with the water changes for a couple of weeks and see if things improve, or should I try some Melafix/Primafix or both?
:blink:
 
Are the marks all the same size and shape and egg shaped or maybe looks like wax has been dropped on him?
 
It doesn't look like wax has been dropped on him, so I guess it can't be fish pox :X
The patches on his tail are quite small, they are this sort of size and shape proportionately...
(Sorry I can't get an actual photo... the tank is downstairs, the webcam's upstairs and I don't have a digital camera!)
moor0us.png

The patches do actually seem a bit more grey than white now... they were cream/white when they appeared, but are now a grey colour (scraping the glass today before the water change has helped visibility quite a lot).
I had a closer look at his nostril and it's actually not so much a swelling as an ulceration... it looks like a white wound behind the nostril with a pinkish center. I'm not sure if it was like that all along or if it's actually become worse since I did the water change. It may have been an abcsess which has burst?
Sorry I'm not being terribly specific... it's hard to get a proper look at him when he's constantly moving about and with no pictures it's probably quite hard to tell what on earth I'm on about!
 
The only thing that springs to mind for the head is hexamita. Still looking around for the discoloured blobs on the tail.
 
I should probably also mention that the patches on his tail appear soft like the skin does. They don't look hard, shiny or waxy. They look soft, but ever so slightly raised.

Yeah I had wondered about HITH when I looked just a second ago at his nostril in order to do the crappy 'Paint' image! HITH is something I find a bit scary, especially as I've never had to actually treat it before :crazy:.
The blobs on his tail are a bit of a dilemma though, especially as they appeared before the wound on his nostril did.
 
Get a hold of him and actually have a feel of the blobs and see if they are actually soft or hard, and if they feel smooth. You should be able to find out if they stand off the fins as well.
 
Ok, one second. I'll go and net him and have a see...

Also - if this is HITH, how am I meant to treat it since in the UK we can't get Metronidazole over the counter?

Ok... I had a good feel of his fin and I can't actually feel any raised bumps where the patches are. It might be the case that since they are a different colour to the striking black they *look* raised, but aren't actually... if that makes sense :/. At any rate, I couldn't feel anything. The fin just felt normal! I was expecting to be able to feel *something*, but it seems as though the patches may be just discolouration.
 
Keep an eye on them then and see if they spread. I am still looking to see what i can find.
 
Thanks... I've been doing the same. So should I get and treat the tank with some Octozin and keep an eye on the fins? Would Melafix be a good thing to use in conjunction with the Octozin?
 
Haha... I'm more confused than ever now! :lol:
I don't know if the problem is epistylus or not to be perfectly honest. When I look closely at it, it doesn't seem filamentous like the site above describes. It also hasn't caught any organic matter in it like algae or whatever. But then I can't see it very well, so it might well be the problem. At the moment, it doesn't seem to be spreading. Over the last couple of months it's gone from one small spot to one larger spot with a few smaller ones. It certainly isn't spreading fast... so at this stage I think I'm more concerned about the HITH issue as that has literally occurred over the last couple of days.
I will get some Octozin and some Melafix and treat the tank with those to try and heal the problem with my moor's nostril. I'll keep a close eye on the fins though and if something new develops I'll be sure to post a message!
Thanks for your help... research is OK, but experience is usually better :lol: :*)
 
Treat with the octozin for the head then and just keep an eye on the fins and if it gets any worse then have another rethink. Glad i could help, even if it was to confuse you even more :lol:
 
I'm feeling a bit guilty to be honest, because obviously something's gone wrong in the water for this to happen. I have a feeling I know where I went wrong... just before this whole thing started happening with the odd patches on his tail, I missed a couple of weeks of water changes because I was really busy so I let the water quality slip a little. I'm obviously paying for that neglect now though and so is my moor. I think I've learnt my lesson though now -_-. I like to think of myself as a reasonable fish keeper, but I suppose we all have moments where our husbandry slips. Hopefully anyone else reading this will see that it doesn't take much to make your fish unwell and will learn from my cockup!
 
Dont beat yourself up too much as we are all guilty to some extent. I desperately need to do water changes on my tanks but i hurt my arm and its impossible for me to lift any buckets. My fish havent had a water change for three weeks now so it happens to us all. I'm hoping they can go a bit longer until my arm is stronger. -_-
 

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